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Old 08-25-2007, 09:14 AM   #31
China_hand_Joe
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionmark-

The loss to Hatton only enhanced my opinion of Tszyu. Past prime in a horrid stylist matchup, against someone the quality of Hatton and still a very close fight.
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Old 08-26-2007, 09:15 AM   #32
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionmark-

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Old 08-26-2007, 03:11 PM   #33
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionm

You got a new keyboard I see.
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Old 08-29-2007, 07:21 AM   #34
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionmark-

He's an all-time great at 140, one of the most talented boxers in terms of pure ability you're likely to see (his amateur fights show how good his head movement and hooking off the jab were amongst other things)

...but even as my favourite fighter, his ego got him in two fights he could have won. Phillips fight, even with court distractions aside, he didn't listen to lewis telling him to watch Phillips right hand and box more. He spent the fight trying to blow Phillips out and walked into a huge punch. He was ahead on the scorecards, a smarter Tszyu (eg the one that adjusted to Tackie after realising he couldn't ko the guy) could have won that fight on points or as lewis had said, delayed the fight and got into better shape and taken Phillips more seriously.

Hatton fight, again I have the same concern. He was happy to fight Hatton's fight rather than stay on the outside and set up Hatton. Watching the fight is actually an interesting study in stamina. By the time Tszyu realises what he needs to do (stiff jab and set up for the right) he's got nothing left and can't keep Hatton off him. Middle rounds I thought Tszyu was just starting to take over but the start of the fight he'd expended too much and couldn't execute. His lack of powerful right hands in this fight was also a concern and I think shows his age for the first time. As George Foreman said 'Your brain knows it should be throwing the right, but the body just doesn't do it.'

Tszyu needed one more big name to really cement his place. A mosely, de la hoya, mayweather fight would have made a huge difference to his resume. He is left with a slight question mark because he lost to two fighters who in my opinion he should have beaten and both at a time that would have provided the superfight Tszyu needed.
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Old 08-30-2007, 02:32 AM   #35
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionmark-

Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorage
He's an all-time great at 140, one of the most talented boxers in terms of pure ability you're likely to see (his amateur fights show how good his head movement and hooking off the jab were amongst other things)

...but even as my favourite fighter, his ego got him in two fights he could have won. Phillips fight, even with court distractions aside, he didn't listen to lewis telling him to watch Phillips right hand and box more. He spent the fight trying to blow Phillips out and walked into a huge punch. He was ahead on the scorecards, a smarter Tszyu (eg the one that adjusted to Tackie after realising he couldn't ko the guy) could have won that fight on points or as lewis had said, delayed the fight and got into better shape and taken Phillips more seriously.

Hatton fight, again I have the same concern. He was happy to fight Hatton's fight rather than stay on the outside and set up Hatton. Watching the fight is actually an interesting study in stamina. By the time Tszyu realises what he needs to do (stiff jab and set up for the right) he's got nothing left and can't keep Hatton off him. Middle rounds I thought Tszyu was just starting to take over but the start of the fight he'd expended too much and couldn't execute. His lack of powerful right hands in this fight was also a concern and I think shows his age for the first time. As George Foreman said 'Your brain knows it should be throwing the right, but the body just doesn't do it.'

Tszyu needed one more big name to really cement his place. A mosely, de la hoya, mayweather fight would have made a huge difference to his resume. He is left with a slight question mark because he lost to two fighters who in my opinion he should have beaten and both at a time that would have provided the superfight Tszyu needed.
Fantastic post mate
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Old 08-31-2007, 08:55 PM   #36
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionmark-

Anyone else put him top ever 10?

Or have the Americans here made you scared to hold such views?
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Old 09-01-2007, 04:22 AM   #37
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionmark-

Quote:
Originally Posted by China_hand_Joe
Anyone else put him top ever 10?

Or have the Americans here made you scared to hold such views?
They do they always give off the vibe that our fighters are not worthy of All Time status.

How much have we seen these fighters get the Overated thread over the years from the USA fans.
Lennox Lewis
Joe Calzaghe
Kostya Tszyu
Ricky Hatton
Nassem Hamed
Wlad Klitschko
Manny Pacquiao

Why because there not USA fighters but yet our guys go into there country and win titles yet still get no respect.

I get fed up with it at times but you no what as the future of boxing goes on the best fighters that are exciting to watch are all guys from Overseas and thats why they diss our guys.
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Old 09-01-2007, 04:33 AM   #38
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionm

Quote:
Originally Posted by China_hand_Joe
Anyone else put him top ever 10?

Or have the Americans here made you scared to hold such views?
I couldnt care less what they think to be perfectly honest, I don't have him in the top 10 on percieved or realised talent because frankly I think there are other fighters who are simply better. He is a great boxer, and had great talent, but then so did so many other great fighters in the last 25 years.

I am probably one of the biggest advocates here like yourself that boxing has definitely progressed. However that said, there were some fantastic fighters who came from the eighties and nineties, a few of which I would put above KT.

Perhaps I would have him higher then what I originally said, but since I have never been bothered to make a top ATG list of my own, I really can't say for sure. I do know however that I would not have him in the top ten based on my own personal analysis.

IMO truely great fighters can alter their gameplans, to overcome different opposition. I think this was something KT had trouble with at times. He was and will always be susceptible to pressure fighters.
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Old 09-01-2007, 04:39 AM   #39
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionm

Quote:
Originally Posted by China_hand_Joe
Anyone else put him top ever 10?

Or have the Americans here made you scared to hold such views?
On a side note, i actually respect quite a few of the US posters here. Their boxing knowledge is very good. At the same time though, I like the fact that you actually use your own opinion and beliefs when discussing boxing.

Its good to see that some people can look past the cliched views of the average boxing fan and be an individual. If i were to make a generalization about the US posters, it would be that they love to follow popular opinion at times, even though it would appear to be wrong, as it ensures acceptance among the other posters. IMO it would be pretty boring if we all sat around and said: Pernell Whitaker the best against all else head 2 head, Sugar ray Robinson the best of all time without doubt ect ect. You know what I mean (I think).

That said though, that is a generalization, and doesn't apply to all. As said above, some of the US posters are very good and also very objective, maybe more so then a lot of other nationalities who use these boards.
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Old 09-01-2007, 05:30 AM   #40
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionm

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Originally Posted by MSTR

That said though, that is a generalization, and doesn't apply to all. As said above, some of the US posters are very good and also very objective, maybe more so then a lot of other nationalities who use these boards.
There are some solid, even one or two who have come to terms with Hopkins ages and the fact he is out the top 10, despite being fans.


Back onto the topic of Tszyu. He looks to me like one of those fighters other world champions couldn't dream of emulating, just like a Roy Jones. Tszyu's timing and accuracy (especially in that right) are something special justlike Jones speed is.

I'm not sure what Joe Calzaghe does well though.
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Old 09-01-2007, 05:39 AM   #41
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionm

Quote:
Originally Posted by China_hand_Joe
There are some solid, even one or two who have come to terms with Hopkins ages and the fact he is out the top 10, despite being fans.


Back onto the topic of Tszyu. He looks to me like one of those fighters other world champions couldn't dream of emulating, just like a Roy Jones. Tszyu's timing and accuracy (especially in that right) are something special justlike Jones speed is.

I'm not sure what Joe Calzaghe does well though.
Maybe more of that IBOGA? root is needed to provide further insite.

I seriously would enjoy that. Especially if it allows you to analyze a fight on a far deeper level.

As for Calzaghe, the thing that impresses me most is that brilliant combination punching. On the inside, I have no doubt that this is the most effective way to fight. I loved watching leonard, de la hoya and even roy at times do similar things (although apart from leonard to a lessor extent). It is almost impossible to mount an effective offense when being bombarded by punches, and I think this is something most opponents of Calzaghe really have trouble coming to terms with.
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Old 09-01-2007, 09:48 PM   #42
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionmark-

Calzaghe is a master of every boxing style.

Last edited by China_hand_Joe; 09-01-2007 at 10:23 PM.
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Old 09-01-2007, 10:42 PM   #43
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionm

Quote:
Originally Posted by China_hand_Joe
Calzaghe is a master of every boxing style.
Totally agree

The punching power of Pernell Whitaker

The tenacity of Willie Pep

The iron jaw of Julian Jackson

The footwork of Jake la Motta

The strength of Naseem Hamed

The combination punching of George Foreman

The defence of Rocky Marciano
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Old 09-02-2007, 08:13 AM   #44
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Default Re: Tszyu - where do Australian persons rank him amongst the all time best -questionmark-

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoppaZoo
Here some Records of Amatuer Records of some of the stars in Boxing.

Jose Napoles (113-1)
Oscar Dela Hoya (223-5)
Vernon Forest (225-15)
Sugar Ray Leonard (165-5)
Don Curry (400-16)
Al Minter (312-
Shane Mosely (250-16)
Joel Casamayor (330-30)

Kostya Tszyu (259-11)

thanx man.... some of those guys had long am careers.. it spins me out when people get over like 100 fights... its hard to do in NSw though coz of the age restrictions..


i guess being 5-6 means i have a long way to go before i gewt to greattness lol
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