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Old 09-06-2007, 06:04 PM   #1
Raging B(_)LL
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Default Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Two welterweight bombers with no defence whatsoever, one preffered the left hook, the other the overhand right, who wins?

I`ve been debating this one for a few days now, and cannot come to a definite conclusion other than this is one of those fights that you can bet the house on the fight not lasting the distance.

Pipino always came storming out of the gates, as did Rocky, but I do think Pipino had the slightly better handspeed which might be the deciding factor here. I think his left hook will find its mark before Rocky`s right hand does, but since both men had such a porous defence I say it`s a toss up as to who lands first.

What says the classic forum?
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Old 09-06-2007, 06:15 PM   #2
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

yea but rocky never really fought at 147, he always fought welterweights that fought up at middle weight
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Old 09-06-2007, 06:17 PM   #3
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Great matchup. IMO Cuevas had the better chin, but Graziano was the harder puncher. What a war that would have been. I pick Graziano, because he showed against bigger opponents what he had...


Graziano KO 8 Cuevas
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Old 09-06-2007, 09:10 PM   #4
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flabby Gut
Rocky feasted on welterweights. He knocked out a murderous-punching welter named Al 'Bummy' Davis in the 4th round among others.

Graziano KO 3 Cuevas

Pipino Cuevas is a great fighter too but this is just the kind of fight it would be. It would end quickly and violently.
Rocky was reffered to by a sportswriter of the day as the best middleweight in the welterweight division, and there is some truth to that. Rocky was a natural jr. middleweight, and weighed in between 153-158 for most of his career, so he was naturally bigger then many of the name welterweight fighters who moved up to face him.

Cuevas would be no exception, but Rocky never faced a puncher like Pipino save for Bummy Davis, who did send Rocky to the mat in their fight. Cuevas punched just as hard as Davis if not moreso, and if he gets to Rocky first he can take him out.

Rocky was always dangerous with the right, but he telegraphed it like nobody`s business and I think Pipino`s hook would catch him first the more I think of it. He was very fast with that left hook/uppercut of his, and Rocky`s chin was always an inviting target for the left hook and it wasn`t exactly made of granite either.

But I will concede that if he lands his homerun right, he can turn the fight around in his favour in an instant. Rocky is the bigger guy and the harder hitter, but he had such a leaky defence and was so predictable that Pipino would nail him first with something big and get him out of there. I agree with you that it would end quickly and violently, but in Pipino`s favour more often than not.
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Old 09-07-2007, 12:52 AM   #5
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Cuevas never fought at Middleweight.
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Old 09-07-2007, 07:39 AM   #6
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raging B(_)LL
Rocky was reffered to by a sportswriter of the day as the best middleweight in the welterweight division, and there is some truth to that. Rocky was a natural jr. middleweight, and weighed in between 153-158 for most of his career, so he was naturally bigger then many of the name welterweight fighters who moved up to face him.

Cuevas would be no exception, but Rocky never faced a puncher like Pipino save for Bummy Davis, who did send Rocky to the mat in their fight. Cuevas punched just as hard as Davis if not moreso, and if he gets to Rocky first he can take him out.

Rocky was always dangerous with the right, but he telegraphed it like nobody`s business and I think Pipino`s hook would catch him first the more I think of it. He was very fast with that left hook/uppercut of his, and Rocky`s chin was always an inviting target for the left hook and it wasn`t exactly made of granite either.

But I will concede that if he lands his homerun right, he can turn the fight around in his favour in an instant. Rocky is the bigger guy and the harder hitter, but he had such a leaky defence and was so predictable that Pipino would nail him first with something big and get him out of there. I agree with you that it would end quickly and violently, but in Pipino`s favour more often than not.
I agree with this. Welterweights extended Graziano into the tenth round on several occasions, and Cuevas was a proven 15 round performer. Pipino could have certainly beaten Rocky to the punch with his hook, doubling or even tripling up on it. Graziano didn't react too well to Zale's body assault (few besides Ali the Megalomaniac could have), and Jose had a good downstairs attack. In their final confrontation, Zale nearly decapitated Graziano with that final left hook which regained the title for Tony.

Graziano wouldn't have the luxury Hearns enjoyed against Cuevas, of being able to hit without getting hit in return. In order to extend Pipino, it was also very helpful to possess a modicum of defensive ability superior to what Rocky generally displayed. Graziano's face could also be busted up to a point, a vulnerability Cuevas was not noted for being susceptible to.

Rocky Graziano's right was as much of a ball on chain as anybody's right hand ever was, but Pipino's hook would likely get there first, more often than not.

This would definitely keep viewers on the edge of their seats, because anything could happen with these two at any time, but this is the best educated guess I can conjure up. There's never any substitute for putting something like this in the ring though, so this can lamentably be nothing more than pure, rampant conjecture.
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Old 09-07-2007, 11:56 AM   #7
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Not a close fight.
Rocky by KO in 2.
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Old 04-16-2013, 01:58 PM   #8
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Rocky would be a little too much for Pipino to deal with.After a couple of shaky rounds, Rocky asserts himself and ends it in the sixth round.
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Old 04-16-2013, 06:08 PM   #9
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Rocky would have to be pulled away from a defenseless Cuevas once he got going.
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Old 04-16-2013, 06:41 PM   #10
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Rocky Graziano who I saw many times was truly a MW 153-5 at his best..Though wild
and crude his size and sheer viciousness would certainly overcome the smaller left hooks of Cuevas in my opinion. For some posters to say Rocky had a "weak chin". WRONG...
I saw a young Graziano take dozens of powerful blasts from a tremendous young puncher
named Billy Arnold, who was called the "New Joe Louis", and had kod almost everyone in 43 or so bouts...Rocky was hit flush on the chin ,kept his feet and flattened Arnold...
Graziano too strong for the 147 Cuevas, survives his left-hook , streetfights Cuevas for a 7rd ko IMO...
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Old 04-17-2013, 01:56 AM   #11
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Graziano by KO
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Old 04-17-2013, 07:09 AM   #12
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Quote:
Originally Posted by burt bienstock View Post
Rocky Graziano who I saw many times was truly a MW 153-5 at his best..Though wild
and crude his size and sheer viciousness would certainly overcome the smaller left hooks of Cuevas in my opinion. For some posters to say Rocky had a "weak chin". WRONG...
I saw a young Graziano take dozens of powerful blasts from a tremendous young puncher
named Billy Arnold, who was called the "New Joe Louis", and had kod almost everyone in 43 or so bouts...Rocky was hit flush on the chin ,kept his feet and flattened Arnold...
Graziano too strong for the 147 Cuevas, survives his left-hook , streetfights Cuevas for a 7rd ko IMO...
Pretty much sums it up...
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Old 04-17-2013, 07:49 AM   #13
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raging B(_)LL View Post
who wins??
the crowd
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Old 04-17-2013, 08:29 AM   #14
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

RG in 2 or 3.
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Old 04-17-2013, 11:03 AM   #15
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Default Re: Pipino Cuevas vs Rocky Graziano

Quote:
Originally Posted by burt bienstock View Post
I saw a young Graziano take dozens of powerful blasts from a tremendous young puncher
named Billy Arnold, who was called the "New Joe Louis", and had kod almost everyone in 43 or so bouts...Rocky was hit flush on the chin ,kept his feet and flattened Arnold...
.
Theres a clip of that ko in the espn sports century doc,shame the whole fight is not available
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