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Old 09-11-2009, 01:02 PM   #31
booradley
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Default Re: Alexis Arguello - Discussion

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Originally Posted by Thinman View Post
Boo, you are a fan of Alexis as I am, and seems to be we both liked him a lot..... but I would like to clarify some of your points.... Let me expand....

Point 1
BoxRec does not have the records of all the boxers.... and that's why you see that most of Alexis oponents records at the begining of his pro career are pretty much blank.....which means BoxRec never got their records and therefore the info is incomplete....

The boxer you make reference with the record of 5-6-0 is Jorge Reyes, who did not defeat Arguello by TKO as it is said on BoxRec......It is misleading.... Arguello did not lose that fight the way that we understand a TKO.... He broke his left hand and couldn't continue fighting and therefore Reyes was declared the winner.....

Olivares team found out about Arguellos fracture and requested an Xray on Alexis hand around the time they fought.... they wanted to know if Alexis had any kind of metal on his hand, because he was dropping oponents with his left hook very easy.....

Point 5

Not true..... before Arguello beat Escalera, Alexis was already well known by many... you cant beat Olivares without people knowing...... I think the fights that put Arguello on the map were his fights against Marcel, Haffey, Hernandez, and of course Olivares....

I would like to add that Arguello is among the boxers who won three or more titles in different divisions and defended all of them succesfully.... meaning never lost his titles in the ring, and I think only him and Floyd are the ones who can claim such thing.

Peace.
Alexis Arguello is #1 on my list of all time favorites. Little Red is #2. The other spots change periodically depending on what I've been watching and/or reading. The #1 and #2 spots never change.

When I say Alexis was not a highly regarded prospect, that's relative to many other prospects over the years. Take for example Matt Korobov. That kid was on HBO in his 6th pro fight. Arguello did not enjoy that kind of notariety.

I always wondered what was up with the Reyes fight. I did not know the full story until now.

I've developed the habit of pointing out Arguello's early failings from some of the crap that goes on in the general forum. Todays younger fans seem to think that a few losses makes a fighter a bum. In my opinion Alexis is the ultimate proof that such an idea is muddle headed at best.

Prior to the Olivares fight Arguello was sort of "on again/off again." Erensto Marcel is hardly the first name that comes to mind when I think of great featherweights. It seems like the loss to Marcel woke something up in Alexis, because after that he went on a wild ass tear and won (I think) 25 straight including two world titles. I don't think many people realized Alexis was truly something special until he beat Escalera the first time.

On another note, you mentioned PBF. At 130 in 15 rounder, Alexis lights his ass up in the 14th. He'd find a way, because that's what Alexis did; find a way
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Old 09-12-2009, 11:21 AM   #32
GPater11093
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Default Re: Alexis Arguello - Discussion

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Originally Posted by mcvey View Post
Williams certainly had faster feet.
Carlos Ortiz might get a shout ,though his one shot power was not in this class imo.
Eder Jofre?
Jofre is a good shout.

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Originally Posted by scartissue View Post
I agree with most of this except for #3. In fact, Arguello was already well known at that time having beaten Art Hafey, Enrique Garcia, Famoso Gomez, Valentin Galeano and of course Jose Legra, not to mention his title shot. But most of all, the report I saw on Boxrec is completely untrue. In fact, Olivares was, figuratively speaking, beating the crap out of Arguello. I believe it was the 10th and 12th he really lathered Arguello against the ropes in leather. The reports from the magazines I have, not to mention the fact that I have seen the fight, state that the momentum was entirely with Olivares going into the 13th. If you see the fight you will see Olivares resume his attack in the 13th. He was not winded at all as the 'report' in boxrec suggests. Olivares simply walked into a left hook. And with Arguello being one of the best finishers around, that was it on the followup. Also remember that Olivares lost the first five rounds, which will tell you how the fight was going since Ruben was ahead on points at the end. I always felt this said alot about Olivares, at 5'5" beating on an all time great who stood 5'10". I always liked Arguello, who I thought peaked beautifully at 135, but he got lucky that night against Olivares.

Scartissue
I thought the fight was reasonably close with Olivares winning. I thought both fighters turned it up in the 11th and 12th and it was about even but it did look like if it kept going htis way Olivares would be first to go.

I wathce dthe fight on Wednesday so its still quite fresh in my mind

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Originally Posted by fleaman View Post
Good points as well, I think Boo will appreciate these.

Pater; good thread, I could talk about El Flaco Explosivo all day
so could i Flea
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Old 09-12-2009, 12:49 PM   #33
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Default Re: Alexis Arguello - Discussion

The strongest impressions I have of Alexis Arguello are
1. The absolutely devastating way he was able to cut, lacerate and shred Alfredo Escalera in that 1st fight of theirs, prompting Howard Cosell to comment that it seemed that Arguello had "razor blades" in his gloves.
2. The utterly devastating combination he dealt to poor Diego Alcala in that 1 round execution of a title defense in '78.
3. The one punch destruction of Kevin Rooney
4. The beating he handed Boom Boom Mancini and his display of class afterwards in consoling Mancini.
5. His great display of heart before the inevitable end against Aaron Pryor.
6. The way my wife at the time was so completely so much of a fan of Arguello and for a completely different reason than mine.
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Old 09-13-2009, 06:25 PM   #34
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Default Re: Alexis Arguello - Discussion

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Old 09-14-2009, 03:52 AM   #35
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Default Re: Alexis Arguello - Discussion

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Originally Posted by My2Sense View Post
Actually, he was noted for his raw talent (namely his punching power) following his blowout of Legra and record of KOs, but he didn't yet have the skills or polish to make full use of that potential.




Although I had Marcel winning, I don't agree that that was a clear decision at all, and most other people generally didn't either. Also, he had Marcel hurt far worse during the middle rounds, and if that fight was held anywhere else but in his native Panama it very possibly would've been stopped in Arguello's favor.

Just watched this fight recently My2...and if anything it was clear. Dont think it was even particularly close.

Marcel was really handling Alexis early on..which is no surprise for the slow starting Arguello ..but I mean he was really winning these rounds big.
Alexis was waiting a bit, trying to measure him up and Marcel was clocking him with most of what he threw..especially lead right hands. Now Ernesto was fairly economical himself, when I say he was landing most of what he threw thats because he was pot shotting and counterpunching, he wasnt just throwing for the sake of it. He was quite picky and it was paying off.

He staggered him I reckon about 4 or 5 times in in the first 1/3 of the fight..And whilst he never had him in any great trouble...Many of these rounds werent close, Alexis had a hard time landing anything significant.

Around the 9th from what I can gather Alexis really turns it around..Only a couple of rounds earlier he was taking a bit of a beating but in these rounds he really turned it on.

From about the 8th-12th it was mostly Arguello..and one of those rounds was very big, with Marcel looking weary and the bell coming at exactly the right time for him in I think the 10th.
Marcel to his credit made Alexis miss a lot...He was still very crafty but he was going ultra defensive, just really doing enough to keep Arguello from really hammering home the advantage..The odd counter right hand snapping Alexis' head back and making him reset his attacks.
Something had the Panmanian crowd worried though because you could see a few things fly into the ring at this stage.

But with about 10 mins to go on my film..Marcel turns the fight comprehensively back in his favour. It was one of the most amazing 2nd winds Ive ever seen because he looked so tired on a couple of rounds before but now in the final rounds of the fight he was throwing a lot of leather and bouncing on his toes.

2 of these rounds were nearly as big as the big one for Arguello...As Marcel fired the **** up with two handed attacks which stagger Alexis at least once and has him holding on tight on several occasions.
Arguello looked a little winded at this point...perhaps he had punched himself out a little.

Overall I thought it was a pretty easy fight to score..with only a few hard rounds where you had to seperate the two (plus my copy has a few parts where there was no video for a little bit) ..Both had mostly fairly clear rounds but in the end Marcel was the clear winner...the dejected Arguello seemed like he had accepted his fate when the fight was over.

Marcel was such an awesome fighter...One of my favorites to watch right now. And you could already see a green Argeullo had greatness written all over him.

Last edited by WhataRock; 09-14-2009 at 10:41 AM.
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Old 09-14-2009, 10:36 AM   #36
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Default Re: Alexis Arguello - Discussion

Standing at 5''10 exceptionally tall for a fighter who weighed under 140 pounds. Arguello was a thinking man's warrior.

In his prime years In his prime Arguello was considered nigh invincible. In a boxing magazine in 1978 “Alexis Arguello is regarded by some people as the perfect fighter. He is thought to be--pound for pound, inch-for-inch and punch for punch--the best puglist in the world...a fighter without a flaw.”

Arguello was a tall, heavy handed, hard jabbing boxer fighter, his punchers carried great levarge, whether it be to the head or body. He had the strength, defence and skills to excel in four weight divisons, reigning as champion in three.

He knocked out Ruben Olivares to the the WBA Featherweight Title in 74, and defended it four times before stopping Alfredo Escalera for the WBC Super Featherweight Title and defended it eight times.

He moved to Lightweight, outboxed Jim Watt for the WBC Title, which he defended four times, before losing two wars with Aaron Pryor for the Junior Welterweight Title.

All in all he won 19 of his 22 title fights, beating 10 titlists.

Arguello's Resume Of Wins...........
Ruben Olivares
Alfredo Escalera x2
Rafael Limon
Bobby Chacon
Ruben Castillio
Cornelius Boza Edwards
Jose Luis Ramirez
Jim Watt
Ray Macini
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