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View Poll Results: WHO WINS
MARCIANO 56 51.85%
DEMPSEY 49 45.37%
DRAW 3 2.78%
Voters: 108. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-12-2007, 09:49 AM   #61
OLD FOGEY
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxmomer
Willie Meehan slapped and ran for all of their four round fights.
Not according to the reports of the 1918 fight in San Francisco written in the San Francisco papers. Meehan was a swarmer. His style was to come right at Dempsey and throw a lot of punches. Miske also went to a ten round draw in 1918 by getting inside Dempsey.

Here's the AP report on the Dempsey-Miske 10 round fight from 1918:

"Jack Dempsey and Billy Miske boxed a ten-round draw tonight. Neither man gained a commanding lead and a poor draw was the general verdict. Miske outboxed Dempsey most of the fight, with the exception of the seventh round, when Dempsey, sinking a hard left into Miske's stomach and putting a right to the jaw, evened up the battle. Up to that time, Miske had claimed three rounds, Dempsey two, with one even.
Miske held his own the rest of the way.
Miske managed to get inside most of Dempsey's blows.
Dempsey scored in the second, third, and seventh rounds and his Chicago supporters were inclined to give him a shade for his work.
The writers who gave Miske a shade based their verdicts on the fact that he made Dempsey miss many blows.
Neither fighter got up a good sweat. A draw seemed the only reasonable decision."

Nor did everyone who saw him live judge Dempsey the worldbeater you make him out. Here is James Dawson of the New York Times on Dempsey after the Tunney fight in 1926:

"In defeat, Dempsey was revealed as an overrated fighter, a man who was good, but never great. It sounds uncharitable in view of his courageous stand to say he had nothing save heart, but that verdict must be uttered.
. . . Dempsey won the title from a cumbersome hulk in Willard, he beat a broken man in Miske, and a comparative middleweight in Carpentier; he couldn't do a thing with a brainy fighter like Gibbons; he battered an unschooled floundering giant in Firpo, and fell when he faced his first real competition from a man who was determined and unafraid and who could fight as well as box."
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Old 09-12-2007, 09:57 AM   #62
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

On the draw with Billy Miske in 1918, I would point out that between Oct of 1917 and June of 1918, Miske lost twice to Kid Norfolk, and twice to Harry Greb, as well as to Tommy Gibbons.
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Old 09-12-2007, 10:06 AM   #63
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

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Originally Posted by OLD FOGEY
On the draw with Billy Miske in 1918, I would point out that between Oct of 1917 and June of 1918, Miske lost twice to Kid Norfolk, and twice to Harry Greb, as well as to Tommy Gibbons.

OLD FOGEY, where have you been so long?



Back to topic, IMO, Dempsey´s title reign compared to Marciano´s is worser, he struggled with one- dimensional punchers like Firpo, I don´t give him much chances against Rocky, Marciano had a better chin, more raw power in both hands, stamina-wise both were very good, the only advantage Jack had, was speed (combinations and handspeed), I see a midround Marciano- TKO...


Marciano TKO 9 Dempsey


(on points 77-75 in favour of Marciano)
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Old 09-12-2007, 10:14 AM   #64
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

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not according to the reports of the 1918 fight in San Francisco written in the San Francisco papers. Meehan was a swarmer.
Look at Meehans KO record, he was a slapper with a good chin and they only fought four rounders. I don't doubt that if they went 10-15 rounds Dempsey would have eventually put him down for good.

Quote:
Miske outboxed Dempsey most of the fight
Out boxing wasn't Marciano's style.

Quote:
The writers who gave Miske a shade based their verdicts on the fact that he made Dempsey miss many blows.
Neither was making his opponent miss.
Quote:
I would point out that between Oct of 1917 and June of 1918, Miske lost twice to Kid Norfolk, and twice to Harry Greb, as well as to Tommy Gibbons.
There's no shame in losing to any of those fighters.

Now, I mean it this time, I'm done on this thread, half the damn posts here are from me and at this point I'd pretty much be repeating myself. You can go ahead and have the last word if you want it. I mean, nothing wrong with a little friendly debate, but generally after a day and a half I lose interest.
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Old 09-12-2007, 12:11 PM   #65
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

I keep going back to two filmed performances by Dempsey. His display of speed and power against the huge and ridiculously tough and durable Willard, and his 15 round demonstration of skill and endurance against a late peaking Gibbons, when past his prime.

How much the hip injury he sustained against Firpo hurt him in his subsequent matches is something we'll never know for certain, but the fact remains that he was never quite the same after being on the receiving end of that shove through the ropes. The most truly significant thing about the Tunney/Dempsey matches is that when Jack finally did land a clean shot on Gene's head, he wobbled Tunney halfway across the ring, then floored him.

Marciano's most impressive dominant win was against Rex Layne. In that one, Layne simply wasn't strong enough to force Rocky backwards, and Marciano's handspeed was vastly superior. At 24, the Dempsey of Toledo was much faster, harder hitting, more mobile and better than Layne in every way except possibly physical strength. (Bigger boxers with superior physical strength never bothered Jack, as Willard discovered.)

The title fight rematch with LaStarza was a tremendous win for Marciano, against an opponent who nearly drew against Rock earlier, but he was on his feet when Ruby Goldstein called a halt, and once again, had nothing like the power Dempsey brought to the table. (Remember, Dempsey fractured the ribs of the non-steroid inflated modern sized superheavyweight George Godfrey in sparring. Godfrey had 82 kayoes in 99 wins, and weighed up to 269 pounds for competition. Godfrey was in his mid 20s when Dempsey did this to him. As Jack was fond of saying, "These big guys are easy meat for me.")

Rocky's best knockout, for my money, was his double hook kayo of Matthews, an achievement no opponent realized in Harry's other 102 bouts. But the Kid, a natural cutie, had been handling Rocky pretty easily before Marciano suddenly struck. Once again, Dempsey's speed and power were vastly superior to what Matthews brought to the table.
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Old 09-12-2007, 01:25 PM   #66
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

The rabid dempsey beats the ape marciano any day of the week
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Old 09-20-2007, 01:55 AM   #67
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

marciano won the poll justlike he would win the fight next poll dempsey vs tyson
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Old 09-20-2007, 05:43 AM   #68
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

very close fight and i dont think anyone could pick a definite winner although i like dempsey more i think it would come down to fitness and a battle of wills. I voted for the rock as i think he just takes it on willpower in an epic battle.
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Old 09-20-2007, 06:27 AM   #69
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxmomer
Dempsey wins 10 times out of 10. Everything Marciano could do, Dempsey could do better and then some. Pretty much equel power, just as durable, better defense, significantly longer reach, better overall boxing skills, better mobility, faster hands, better accuracy. You name it.
ONe of the few times I give the old timers the win. I think Marciano holds no advantage over Dempsey.
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Old 09-20-2007, 08:05 AM   #70
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

Dempsey, one of the quickest starters in the history of the division finds his range early and shakes Marciano up during the opening few rounds. Rocky somehow survives this initial assualt and tries to find a foothold in the fight. Despite this Dempsey doesn't let him of the hook he eventually overwhelms Marciano somewhere past the mid-rounds. Rocky goes out proudly on his his sword, but the ref inevitably steps in saving him from further punishment.

Dempsey TKO7 Marciano.
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Old 09-21-2009, 02:59 PM   #71
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

bump
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Old 09-21-2009, 03:02 PM   #72
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

If Dempsey did not get Marciano out of there in the first 4 rounds or so he would eventually get KOed. This would be an awesome fight from a fan perspective. Wow.
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Old 09-21-2009, 03:10 PM   #73
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

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Originally Posted by Rico Spadafora View Post
If Dempsey did not get Marciano out of there in the first 4 rounds or so he would eventually get KOed. This would be an awesome fight from a fan perspective. Wow.

yes it would be
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Old 09-21-2009, 03:11 PM   #74
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

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Originally Posted by capfunds View Post
Dempsey looks good on film, but who did he fight?
is this the capfunds of old?

if so long time no see
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Old 09-21-2009, 03:47 PM   #75
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Default Re: Macriano Vs Dempsey

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Originally Posted by Maxmomer View Post
Dempsey wins 10 times out of 10. Everything Marciano could do, Dempsey could do better and then some. Pretty much equel power, just as durable, better defense, significantly longer reach, better overall boxing skills, better mobility, faster hands, better accuracy. You name it.
You know you can't go away with this bull**** in the classic section...
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