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Old 09-24-2009, 01:40 AM   #61
walk with me
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

i think those who read this thread got the point i was trying to make... other just read the first post and got carried away


my point is valid!
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Old 09-24-2009, 01:45 AM   #62
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

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Originally Posted by Jeff M View Post
Hatton would be considered to use effective pressure in fights where his size made up for not being as technically skilled as other fighters, or his opponents either lacked the skill or knowledge to counter it.. Same for Margarito I suppose. When they face a more skilled fighter, or one who uses an effective counter-strategy, their aggression is rendered less effective. Everyone has variations in their styles.

What intelligent pressure is to me is probably subjective, kind of like how people view human intelligence. People say you can't define intelligence as just this or that, because there are different kinds of intelligence.

I'd just call it ineffective or effective I think.
No. Intelligence is the ability to retain information, the ability to quickly asses and analyze a problem, and articulation of thought.

You can talk to someone who doesn't come from Harvard and know instantly that they are smart.

And you can talk to someone from Harvard, and not be able to see, hear, or think they came from an ivy league school.

If that someone who didn't come from Harvard, actually WENT to Harvard...who knows what their capacity would be.

Same with boxing or just fighting in general. Once a smart pressure fighter meets a pure boxer...it's no longer a fight in style or skill...but a battle of mind and heart...a fight between intangibles. And the victor is TRULY the better man because their was nothing uneven in skill or boxing talent...but rather a difference in what someone was born with in terms of natural abilities.
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Old 09-24-2009, 01:46 AM   #63
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

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Originally Posted by walk with me View Post
i think those who read this thread got the point i was trying to make... other just read the first post and got carried away


my point is valid!
Your point is a short sighted answer. It's about as valid as present day. It's short and narrow minded.

There is more to this question then the answer you gave it.
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Old 09-24-2009, 03:41 AM   #64
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

ya'll got some kind of pride chip on your shoulers ya'll wanna keep hailing an exposed cheater.
used to follow that he's got a granite chin and applies pressure jazz with he could hit too. well it turns out my grandma could hit too if she had cement in her gloves.
ya'll were on a much better spin with this pressure thread when you were talking about tyson even better when you were talking frazier. i couldn't expect you to keep that up.
but ya'll margarito? when has anyone even mentioned hagler? i'm tellin you the term pressure fighter is only used just to discribe a fighter who walks forward. take away margarito's trick and he's a hack. let em have his trick and he's a criminal. resto did two years behind his gloves tampering.
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Old 09-24-2009, 03:51 AM   #65
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

i think "intelligent pressure" is a boxing term coined by jim lamply is what i think.
and in spite of his job, that guy knows very little about what he's talking about.
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Old 09-24-2009, 04:27 AM   #66
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

No the OP is wrong as has been written.

You can win fights with unintelligent pressure and it is still unintelligent. Jesse Feliciano comes to mind. Getting hit many times to get your fewer shots off can win so, in the sense that winning is intelligent, ok, but we don't suddenly go.........."ah, that Mayorga, what a clever fellow, do you see how he carefully blocked those punches with his head, quite intelligently securing the win with his intelligent pressure"

You can lose fights and your intelligent pressure doesn't suddenly become stupid, however, maybe your over all gameplan was lacking.

nobody ever called Hatton's pressure intelligent and he won a lot of fights with it

its forcing the other guy to expend more energy than he wants to and forcing him out of his own gameplan without losing sight of yours, its gaining an advantage but its certainly not getting your brains smashed to bits in the process...how could anybody call that intelligent ever when it makes you a moron for real!!
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Old 09-24-2009, 07:41 AM   #67
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

I dont know about intelligent pressure per say It's more there are certain fighters that are/were great pressure fighter you could argue they use intelligent pressure. I have standards as far as that goes they have to beat a great fighter using effective aggression or intelligent pressure or basically placing there shots well and landing there punches often. If a fighter goes in there against a universally known lesser opponent and destroys them that doesn't show me anything and proves nothing. I dont refer to it as intelligent pressure but here's what I think they mean by it a fighter that knows how to cut off the ring, places there shots extremely well, almost always is a world class in-fighter, has great timing with there punches, breaks down there opponent without getting blasted in the face a couple hundred times during the fight. Usually the fighters that they say apply intelligent pressure are boxer/punchers but rarely full on brawlers, however swarmers with incredible punch outputs few to none can match have often done incredibly well in boxing I wouldn't call that intelligent pressure but It's hard as hell to beat so you cant call it un-intelligent or in-effective.
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Old 09-24-2009, 07:47 AM   #68
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Default Re: Intelligent Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

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It's obvious you'd think this way. It's the same case with everyone who has absolutely no technical knowledge of boxing.
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Old 09-24-2009, 07:49 AM   #69
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Default Re: Intelligent Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

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I didn't think it was possible for someone to be so ignorant. If you don't understand the difference, just ask. Don't say that there is none.
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Old 09-24-2009, 07:58 AM   #70
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

Terrible topic.

You can win fights with sloppy pressure, doesn't mean it was good.

Much like you can win fights with poor counter punching or poor boxing. Why don't you start a thread saying there's no difference between a world class counter puncher and a rubbish counter puncher and it just comes down to the result?
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Old 09-24-2009, 07:59 AM   #71
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Default Re: Intelligent Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

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Originally Posted by walk with me View Post
no you did... i understood what your saying

my response to that is

someone like margarito was a great pressure fighter even though he would get abused coming in... it didnt matter because he was going to boil your ass inside...

i just think to try to define good & bad pressure is bogus... you either have successful results with your pressure or you have unsuccessful results with your pressure

every pressure fighter is great at "applying pressure" until they lose... the day they lose they become bad at being a "pressure fighter"
That's a new breed of nonsense.
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Old 09-24-2009, 08:19 AM   #72
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

pressure can be continously going forward eating punches to land your own. cutting off the ring. bombing away and so on.

intelligent pressure is where you still establish the same thing a boxer does - timing and range. you work behind a jab. you cut off the ring but don't just stay square on infront of your opponent. you move your head to avoid incoming shots. you counter as well as be first.

there is irrefutably intelligent and stupid pressure.
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Old 09-24-2009, 08:21 AM   #73
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

note: some fighters have the intangiables to apply stupid pressure i.e. margarito. he has the chin, stamina, durability etc to come bombing away...

..but we are talking about the science, the technical side of boxing. not having the intangiables or talent to get away with a non-scientific approach.
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Old 09-24-2009, 08:34 AM   #74
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Default Re: Intelligent Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

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Originally Posted by David Fanning View Post
Intelligent pressure is coming forward while not walking into shots, and while throwing effective and accurate punches. Effective aggression. It exists. It's real.
You forgot cutting off the ring.
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Old 09-24-2009, 08:35 AM   #75
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Default Re: Applied Pressure Is One Of The Biggest Fluke Concepts In Boxing...

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Originally Posted by achillesthegreat View Post
note: some fighters have the intangiables to apply stupid pressure i.e. margarito. he has the chin, stamina, durability etc to come bombing away...

..but we are talking about the science, the technical side of boxing. not having the intangiables or talent to get away with a non-scientific approach.
Librado Andrade is absolutely at the top of that category. Cristobal Cruz is #2, IMO.
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