Philidelphia Jack O'Brien gave Jack Johnson fits over the short distance.

[GPater11093]

interesting, so did O'Brien force Johnson to lead, if so surely thats a marvellous piece of ring generalship? and possibly should have won him a decision?

[My2Sense]

Originally Posted by GPater11093

interesting, so did O'Brien force Johnson to lead, if so surely thats a marvellous piece of ring generalship? and possibly should have won him a decision?

Reports I've read make note of O'Brien's superior speed and footwork. Opinions were fairly split on who "won", and the result is generally listed as a no-decision draw.

[GPater11093]

Originally Posted by My2Sense

Reports I've read make note of O'Brien's superior speed and footwork. Opinions were fairly split on who "won", and the result is generally listed as a no-decision draw.

would you say he forced Johnson to lead in the kind of little greaseball vs bigger slower heavy or did he do through being a good ring general?

[Bummy Davis]

O'Brien was no joke...a skilled fighter...so was Johnson....6 rds hard to tell..the truth comes over in 15 bur Props to O'Brien

[McGrain]

Originally Posted by My2Sense

I believe I've seen it listed as a title fight sometimes, and other times not. In those days there weren't the kind of commissions or sanctioning bodies that would flat out state something was a title fight or not, and sometimes reports and public opinion were not so sure or in agreement themselves, so it can be hard to discern.

Yeah, quite right. The thing is, of the primary reports I was reading today, flat out none mentioned it as a title fight.

[McGrain]

Originally Posted by GPater11093

would you say he forced Johnson to lead in the kind of little greaseball vs bigger slower heavy or did he do through being a good ring general?

It was a mixture of quickness and cleverness. I saw a couple of references to O'Brien out-feinting Johnson, but mostly he used superior footspeed to get it done.

[My2Sense]

Originally Posted by McGrain

Yeah, quite right. The thing is, of the primary reports I was reading today, flat out none mentioned it as a title fight.

It might not have been billed as a title fight, but had O'Brien stopped Johnson or decisively gotten the better of him, a lot of people probably would've recognized him as the new champ regardless. That's the way things often worked back then.

[GPater11093]

Originally Posted by McGrain

It was a mixture of quickness and cleverness. I saw a couple of references to O'Brien out-feinting Johnson, but mostly he used superior footspeed to get it done.

so it is quite impressive. Ill need to research some more of O'Brien

[Mendoza]

The more you read about Johnson in print, the less impressive he becomes. O'brien, who was but a middle weight here appears to have edged the heavyweight champion of the world.

O'brien had speed and skills. I fail to see Johnson's vaunted defense helping him out in this fight. He was sin fact out jabbed by a much lighter and smaller man.

[Seamus]

Originally Posted by Mendoza

The more you read about Johnson in print, the less impressive he becomes.

Then you must stop reading right now and attend Ken Burns' re-education camp.

[mcvey]

Originally Posted by Seamus

Then you must stop reading right now and attend Ken Burns' re-education camp.

[McGrain]

I've read about him extensively, and i'm consistantly impressed.

[GPater11093]

McGrain whereabout have you found stuff to read about him. Newspaper archives? articles? etc...

[Unforgiven]

You cant believe what you read in the newspapers.

[Mendoza]

Originally Posted by McGrain

I've read about him extensively, and i'm consistantly impressed.

Over coming adversity out of the ring, yes. Performance in, not so much.