the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread. - Page 13

natonic · 02-06-2010, 03:05 PM

Angel Espada W15 Clyde Gray This was an entertaining and technical fight. Gray used some interesting tactics. He would move away from Espada's right hand (nothing mind boggling there), but he would also move the fight to the edge of the ring. It wasn't that he had his back to the ropes, but he would position his right side near the ropes. I gave Gray 3 of the first 4 rounds with 1 even. Espada cut Gray in the 5th and it changed the complexion of the fight. Espada come on in the championship rounds but inexplicably gave away the last rounds in a close fight. I had it a draw (7-7-1).

Salvador Sanchez TKO 13 Danny Lopez Typical Lopez slow start. I don't think he or anybody had much clue of Sanchez's greatness. The telecast said the fight was in a 16 foot ring. Amazing display by Sanchez. Never had a sense that Lopez was in this fight. I gave Lopez 2 rounds.

Salvador Sanchez TKO 14 Danny Lopez Lopez started faster in the second fight and gained Sanchez's respect a bit. The brilliant Sanchez changed his tactics a bit and stayed outside and a little more cautious this time. Sanchez still banked rounds and pot shotted Lopez and started dropping some heavy lumber in the late rounds. I still only gave Lopez 2 rounds in this one.

Donald Curry Tko 4 Colin Jones The Cobra at the height of his powers. I'd forgotten how one sided this fight was against a very good Jones. Jones was overmatched and just a bad styles matchup for him anyway. This version of Curry would've been more than respectable against ANY welterweight.

sweet_scientist · 02-08-2010, 08:46 AM

Watched a couple of Sandy Saddler's fights today: against Del Flanagan and Charley Riley.

Fighting with a Willie Pep style, Del Flanagan flashed some pretty fast hands and feet. Del was actually from Willie Pep's camp and no doubt had the blueprint for how to fight Sandy set from Willie himself. Flanagan repeatedly was able to land the jab/right-hand combination on Saddler, who stalked Flanagan futiley trying to rip under his ribcage with the murderous left uppercut of his. Saddler seemed to be coming on towards the end a little, but Flanagan was too far ahead to be pegged back.

With that said, had this fight not been in Flanagan's backyard, there's a good chance he would have been disqualified. Every time Saddler got within distance of Flanagan, Del would flagrantly hold on for dear life and not allow any in-fighting to occur. There was more punch and grab in this fight than Hopkins-Wright, and it's unlikely that he would have been allowed to hold as much as he did on neutral ground.

I had Flanagan taking the fight by a point, but if I was the ref, I would have docked at least a couple points, thereby giving Sandy the win.

Sandy's fight with Charlie Riley was a much more fan friendly affair. Riley, a Frankie ****** type non-stop punching machine, stood toe to toe with Saddler and ripped hooks and uppercuts for the duration of the bout. He rocked Saddler pretty good in the second round to the thunderous applause of the crowd, but Saddler re-composed himself quickly and from then on proceeded to tear Riley up with those famed uppercuts of his.

Though Saddler clearly won the fight, Riley put up a much more gallant effort than Flanagan, who put on a display post prime Camacho would have been somewhat disgusted with.

Anyway, my cards:

Sandy Saddler vs. Del Flanagan vs: 96-95 Flanagan
Saddler: 2,5,9 and 10.
Flanagan: 3,4,6,7 and 8.
Round 1 even.

Sandy Saddler vs. Charley Riley: 97-94 Saddler
Riley: 1,2 and 6.
Saddler: 3,4,5,7,8 and 9.
Round 10 even.

bodhi · 02-09-2010, 05:37 PM

Just watched Napoles-Urbina II. Damned Napoles was a monster at lw. Him and Duran rthere would be a thrilling fight.

Gesta · 02-14-2010, 05:25 AM

Hearns vs Leonard 2

Hearns Leonard
1\ 10 - 10
2\ 10 - 09
3\ 10 - 08
4\ 10 - 09
5\ 09 - 10
6\ 10 - 09
7\ 10 - 09
8\ 09 - 10
9\ 09 - 10
10\ 09 - 10
11\ 10 - 08
12\ 09 -10

Hearns 115 - Leonard 112

lora · 02-18-2010, 08:28 AM

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrBzxOVXnQo[/ame]

Nice short fight.Watson would do extremely well today on the P4P lists, imo he was at least as good a textbook technician as someone like Marquez.

sweet_scientist · 02-19-2010, 04:10 AM

Watched the second Dick Tiger-Jose Torres fight today (which was missing the 14th round) and I came away with this card:

Dick Tiger vs. Jose Torres II: 135-133 Tiger (round 14 missing)
Torres:1,3,12,13 and 15.
Tiger: 2,4,5,6,7,10 and 11.
Rounds 8 and 9 even.

Torres started off well and looked real strong, walking forward behind a super tight high guard. Tiger was wailing away but not much was getting through and when Torres punched, Tiger was getting moved from the force of the blows.

Tiger however was determined to tire Torres out and stood his ground against the much bigger man, working at a high pace Torres could not keep up with. After about 5 rounds Torres started becoming somewhat sluggish and Tiger started to dominate the action with his tough trench warfare approach.

Bu just as it appeared Tiger was going to walk away with an easy decision, Torres somehow found the energy to mount a late rally. He really wanted this fight - BADLY - as could be seen from his post fight reaction when the decision was announced against him (he was absolutely livid). In the late rounds Torres started landing some excellent left hooks and flurries, and whilst Tiger continued to throw punches pretty much non-stop, there was nothing on them by the end.

Unfortunately for Torres, he left his run a little late. He got close, but for me, Tiger took this clearly. The rounds I had even were more arguable for Tiger than for Torres imo.

There was a bit of a fracas after the fight too. Quite a few evidently felt Torres got the rough end of it...

sweet_scientist · 02-19-2010, 07:03 AM

Watched the first Tiger-Torres fight as well. In contrast to the second fight, which was full of action, this was a snorefest. Both guys looking to counterpunch and not getting much done in that regard.

Whilst I think Torres won it, it was one of those fights that neither really deserved to win. If I wasn't being pedantic, I would have called it a draw.

As it was, I scored it thus:

Dick Tiger vs. Jose Torres I: 145-142 Torres
Tiger: 6,9,10,13 and 14.
Torres: 1,2,3,4,5,7,8 and 15.
Rounds 11 and 12 even.

Can't understand how two judges had cards so wide for Tiger.... Must have decided the winner before the fight started...

GPater11093 · 02-19-2010, 07:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweet_scientist

Watched the first Tiger-Torres fight as well. In contrast to the second fight, which was full of action, this was a snorefest. Both guys looking to counterpunch and not getting much done in that regard.

Whilst I think Torres won it, it was one of those fights that neither really deserved to win. If I wasn't being pedantic, I would have called it a draw.

As it was, I scored it thus:

Disc Tiger vs. Jose Torres I: 145-142 Torres
Tiger: 6,9,10,13 and 14.
Torres: 1,2,3,4,5,7,8 and 15.
Rounds 11 and 12 even.

Can't understand how two judges had cards so wide for Tiger.... Must have decided the winner before the fight started...

Me and you disagree alot, I had it a Tiger win. Although it is interesting to hear contrasting opinions. Unfortunatly I cant offer too much opinions because as you say the bout was fairly void of action and it is a while since I watched it. Im going to watch the second one today. I think generally with bouts of little action they are hard to score.

Tiger: 1,2,4,6,7,9,10,12,13,14
Torres: 3,5,8,11,15
Total: 145-140 Tiger (10-5)

Also I watched Bernabe Concepcion vs Mario Santiago from last weekend. Interesting tactical affair with an amazing last round had it 95-94 Concepcion

sweet_scientist · 02-19-2010, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GPater11093

Me and you disagree alot, I had it a Tiger win. Although it is interesting to hear contrasting opinions. Unfortunatly I cant offer too much opinions because as you say the bout was fairly void of action and it is a while since I watched it. Im going to watch the second one today. I think generally with bouts of little action they are hard to score.

Tiger: 1,2,4,6,7,9,10,12,13,14
Torres: 3,5,8,11,15
Total: 145-140 Tiger (10-5)

Well, possibly I'm in my own world, but I just can't see what Tiger did to win this staring contest by a margin like that. I would be pissed off to lose a title like that.... let alone by cards of 10-5 or 10-4-1 as another judge had it...

Interested to hear what some others think on this one. Maybe I need to get my eyes checked...

GPater11093 · 02-19-2010, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweet_scientist

Well, possibly I'm in my own world, but I just can't see what Tiger did to win this staring contest by a margin like that. I would be pissed off to lose a title like that.... let alone by cards of 10-5 or 10-4-1 as another judge had it...

Interested to hear what some others think on this one. Maybe I need to get my eyes checked...

I'll rewatch it sometime. But like I say in an inactive fight you often get odd scores because of the difficulty to judge the rounds.

One thing what is great about this thread is you can see complete difference of opinions that help you understand odd scorecards etc...

sweet_scientist · 02-19-2010, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GPater11093

I'll rewatch it sometime. But like I say in an inactive fight you often get odd scores because of the difficulty to judge the rounds.

One thing what is great about this thread is you can see complete difference of opinions that help you understand odd scorecards etc...

True, true...

GPater11093 · 02-19-2010, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweet_scientist

True, true...

I think you are on CBZ, in the Ron Lipton thread he was breifly discussing these fights and he seemed to think Tiger won the first fight and the second was a lot closer.

sweet_scientist · 02-19-2010, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GPater11093

I think you are on CBZ, in the Ron Lipton thread he was breifly discussing these fights and he seemed to think Tiger won the first fight and the second was a lot closer.

Yes, that seems to be the consensus...

If any fight is generally regarded as contentious it is the second one (where the Puerto Rican fans tore the place up when the decision came down), though strangely enough I thought Tiger won that one...

GPater11093 · 02-19-2010, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweet_scientist

Yes, that seems to be the consensus...

If any fight is generally regarded as contentious it is the second one (where the Puerto Rican fans tore the place up when the decision came down), though strangely enough I thought Tiger won that one...

Quite ironic, Ill have to watch it and see.

GPater11093 · 02-20-2010, 05:16 PM

Dick Tiger vs Jose Torres II

Early on, Torres kept a high guard but Tiger showcased his mobility and landed some good body punches as he lept in and out of range. His head punches were mainly blocked but the body shots got through. Torres did land some nice shots but I felt Tiger was able to take the sting from them by moving backwards.

As the momentum changed Tiger stayed in the trenches with Torres and Torres was able to get off better punches and Tiger was landing about the same rate as earlier, but Torres's work looked better IMO.

In the late goings Tiger was still on top with fast combinations but Torres was battling back hard, I felt Tigers edge in handspeed was letting him get off first the whole way through but was most important in these crucial last rounds.

The fight was similar to how SS described it just we picked up on different things IMO and have slightly different scoring criterea. I liked Tigers ring generalship and fast combinations, also I was scoring Tigers body shots early doors. (not sure if SS was) Again though it was a very close fight and scores could vary in certain rounds.

Also round 14 was missing so i scored it even.

Tiger: 2,3,4,5,6,9,15
Torres:1,7,8,10,11,12,13
Total: 143-143 DRAW (7-7-1)

Excellant scrap though, top class skills and a high pace.

02-06-2010, 03:05 PM	#181
natonic Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 2,736 vCash: 1000	Re: the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread. Angel Espada W15 Clyde Gray This was an entertaining and technical fight. Gray used some interesting tactics. He would move away from Espada's right hand (nothing mind boggling there), but he would also move the fight to the edge of the ring. It wasn't that he had his back to the ropes, but he would position his right side near the ropes. I gave Gray 3 of the first 4 rounds with 1 even. Espada cut Gray in the 5th and it changed the complexion of the fight. Espada come on in the championship rounds but inexplicably gave away the last rounds in a close fight. I had it a draw (7-7-1). Salvador Sanchez TKO 13 Danny Lopez Typical Lopez slow start. I don't think he or anybody had much clue of Sanchez's greatness. The telecast said the fight was in a 16 foot ring. Amazing display by Sanchez. Never had a sense that Lopez was in this fight. I gave Lopez 2 rounds. Salvador Sanchez TKO 14 Danny Lopez Lopez started faster in the second fight and gained Sanchez's respect a bit. The brilliant Sanchez changed his tactics a bit and stayed outside and a little more cautious this time. Sanchez still banked rounds and pot shotted Lopez and started dropping some heavy lumber in the late rounds. I still only gave Lopez 2 rounds in this one. Donald Curry Tko 4 Colin Jones The Cobra at the height of his powers. I'd forgotten how one sided this fight was against a very good Jones. Jones was overmatched and just a bad styles matchup for him anyway. This version of Curry would've been more than respectable against ANY welterweight.
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02-08-2010, 08:46 AM	#182
sweet_scientist Champion East Side Guru Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,300 vCash: 1000	Re: the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread. Watched a couple of Sandy Saddler's fights today: against Del Flanagan and Charley Riley. Fighting with a Willie Pep style, Del Flanagan flashed some pretty fast hands and feet. Del was actually from Willie Pep's camp and no doubt had the blueprint for how to fight Sandy set from Willie himself. Flanagan repeatedly was able to land the jab/right-hand combination on Saddler, who stalked Flanagan futiley trying to rip under his ribcage with the murderous left uppercut of his. Saddler seemed to be coming on towards the end a little, but Flanagan was too far ahead to be pegged back. With that said, had this fight not been in Flanagan's backyard, there's a good chance he would have been disqualified. Every time Saddler got within distance of Flanagan, Del would flagrantly hold on for dear life and not allow any in-fighting to occur. There was more punch and grab in this fight than Hopkins-Wright, and it's unlikely that he would have been allowed to hold as much as he did on neutral ground. I had Flanagan taking the fight by a point, but if I was the ref, I would have docked at least a couple points, thereby giving Sandy the win. Sandy's fight with Charlie Riley was a much more fan friendly affair. Riley, a Frankie **** type non-stop punching machine, stood toe to toe with Saddler and ripped hooks and uppercuts for the duration of the bout. He rocked Saddler pretty good in the second round to the thunderous applause of the crowd, but Saddler re-composed himself quickly and from then on proceeded to tear Riley up with those famed uppercuts of his. Though Saddler clearly won the fight, Riley put up a much more gallant effort than Flanagan, who put on a display post prime Camacho would have been somewhat disgusted with. Anyway, my cards: Sandy Saddler vs. Del Flanagan vs: 96-95 Flanagan Saddler: 2,5,9 and 10. Flanagan: 3,4,6,7 and 8. Round 1 even. Sandy Saddler vs. Charley Riley: 97-94 Saddler** Riley: 1,2 and 6. Saddler: 3,4,5,7,8 and 9. Round 10 even.
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02-09-2010, 05:37 PM	#183
bodhi So I can die easy ... East Side VIP Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 21,759 vCash: 1337	Re: the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread. Just watched Napoles-Urbina II. Damned Napoles was a monster at lw. Him and Duran rthere would be a thrilling fight.
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02-14-2010, 05:25 AM	#184
Gesta Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 3,454 vCash: 300	Re: the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread. Hearns vs Leonard 2 Hearns Leonard 1\ 10 - 10 2\ 10 - 09 3\ 10 - 08 4\ 10 - 09 5\ 09 - 10 6\ 10 - 09 7\ 10 - 09 8\ 09 - 10 9\ 09 - 10 10\ 09 - 10 11\ 10 - 08 12\ 09 -10 Hearns 115 - Leonard 112
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02-18-2010, 08:28 AM	#185
lora Fighting Zapata East Side Guru Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 5,443 vCash: 500	Re: the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread. [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrBzxOVXnQo[/ame] Nice short fight.Watson would do extremely well today on the P4P lists, imo he was at least as good a textbook technician as someone like Marquez.
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02-19-2010, 04:10 AM	#186
sweet_scientist Champion East Side Guru Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,300 vCash: 1000	Re: the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread. Watched the second Dick Tiger-Jose Torres fight today (which was missing the 14th round) and I came away with this card: Dick Tiger vs. Jose Torres II: 135-133 Tiger (round 14 missing) Torres:1,3,12,13 and 15. Tiger: 2,4,5,6,7,10 and 11. Rounds 8 and 9 even. Torres started off well and looked real strong, walking forward behind a super tight high guard. Tiger was wailing away but not much was getting through and when Torres punched, Tiger was getting moved from the force of the blows. Tiger however was determined to tire Torres out and stood his ground against the much bigger man, working at a high pace Torres could not keep up with. After about 5 rounds Torres started becoming somewhat sluggish and Tiger started to dominate the action with his tough trench warfare approach. Bu just as it appeared Tiger was going to walk away with an easy decision, Torres somehow found the energy to mount a late rally. He really wanted this fight - BADLY - as could be seen from his post fight reaction when the decision was announced against him (he was absolutely livid). In the late rounds Torres started landing some excellent left hooks and flurries, and whilst Tiger continued to throw punches pretty much non-stop, there was nothing on them by the end. Unfortunately for Torres, he left his run a little late. He got close, but for me, Tiger took this clearly. The rounds I had even were more arguable for Tiger than for Torres imo. There was a bit of a fracas after the fight too. Quite a few evidently felt Torres got the rough end of it... Last edited by sweet_scientist; 02-19-2010 at 06:57 AM.
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02-19-2010, 07:03 AM	#187
sweet_scientist Champion East Side Guru Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,300 vCash: 1000	Re: the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread. Watched the first Tiger-Torres fight as well. In contrast to the second fight, which was full of action, this was a snorefest. Both guys looking to counterpunch and not getting much done in that regard. Whilst I think Torres won it, it was one of those fights that neither really deserved to win. If I wasn't being pedantic, I would have called it a draw. As it was, I scored it thus: Dick Tiger vs. Jose Torres I: 145-142 Torres Tiger: 6,9,10,13 and 14. Torres: 1,2,3,4,5,7,8 and 15. Rounds 11 and 12 even. Can't understand how two judges had cards so wide for Tiger.... Must have decided the winner before the fight started... Last edited by sweet_scientist; 02-19-2010 at 07:55 AM.
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02-20-2010, 05:16 PM	#195
GPater11093 Barry East Side VIP Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Scotland Posts: 26,115 vCash: 836	Re: the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread. Dick Tiger vs Jose Torres II Early on, Torres kept a high guard but Tiger showcased his mobility and landed some good body punches as he lept in and out of range. His head punches were mainly blocked but the body shots got through. Torres did land some nice shots but I felt Tiger was able to take the sting from them by moving backwards. As the momentum changed Tiger stayed in the trenches with Torres and Torres was able to get off better punches and Tiger was landing about the same rate as earlier, but Torres's work looked better IMO. In the late goings Tiger was still on top with fast combinations but Torres was battling back hard, I felt Tigers edge in handspeed was letting him get off first the whole way through but was most important in these crucial last rounds. The fight was similar to how SS described it just we picked up on different things IMO and have slightly different scoring criterea. I liked Tigers ring generalship and fast combinations, also I was scoring Tigers body shots early doors. (not sure if SS was) Again though it was a very close fight and scores could vary in certain rounds. Also round 14 was missing so i scored it even. Tiger: 2,3,4,5,6,9,15 Torres:1,7,8,10,11,12,13 Total: 143-143 DRAW (7-7-1) Excellant scrap though, top class skills and a high pace.
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