Is Haye now worthy of a P4P rating?

[DDA365]

List is shit

Validates top level boxers total lack of activity, look at some of the names on there

It seems not having a fight, and therefore not losing, is better for somebodies reputation than actually fighting these days

[JML]

Originally Posted by achillesthegreat

He should be top 10. He was unified at cruiser and a legit champ at HW. The second cruiser to have done it so it clearly isn't easy to do.

[Olu G. Rotimi]

When he stops one of the Ukrainean Brothers he will get in.

[RichT]

Originally Posted by harvinmagler

i think so, considering what he has achieved in just 24 fights

Originally Posted by achillesthegreat

He should be top 10. He was unified at cruiser and a legit champ at HW. The second cruiser to have done it so it clearly isn't easy to do.

I like Haye but don't see how you can rank him top 10 P4P at present.

The two comments above, along with a few more, aren't enough to justify a P4P ranking.

P4P should be about fundamental skills and the ease with which someone defeats their biggest rivals at their own weight. For me, pound for pound literally means who is the best boxer irrelevant of weight i.e. given someone's skills how would they do aginst other P4P contenders if they were the same weight. Haye hasn't shown us good enough fundamental skills to suggest he should be top 10 and he hasn't yet beaten good enough opposition to get in on that alone. Yes he is a two weight champ but the people he has beaten to acheive that have not been anywhere near P4P worthy.

That said, the Ring's list is pretty shit and whether he ranks above some of the people on there is a different question.

[RichT]

Originally Posted by Olu G. Rotimi

When he stops one of the Ukrainean Brothers he will get in.

If he could defeat one of them then he would be a very worthy contender. Showing enough skill to overcome the size difference would suggest he would do very well on a level playing field against other contenders.

[antcull]

Considering Caballero and Donaire are both in the Top 10.....Haye is easily worthy of a P4P place. I personally wouldnt have him in but I have zero qualms at him being rated there.

[achillesthegreat]

Originally Posted by RichT

I like Haye but don't see how you can rank him top 10 P4P at present.

The two comments above, along with a few more, aren't enough to justify a P4P ranking.

P4P should be about fundamental skills and the ease with which someone defeats their biggest rivals at their own weight. For me, pound for pound literally means who is the best boxer irrelevant of weight i.e. given someone's skills how would they do aginst other P4P contenders if they were the same weight. Haye hasn't shown us good enough fundamental skills to suggest he should be top 10 and he hasn't yet beaten good enough opposition to get in on that alone. Yes he is a two weight champ but the people he has beaten to acheive that have not been anywhere near P4P worthy.

That said, the Ring's list is pretty shit and whether he ranks above some of the people on there is a different question.

I'm very suprised that 55% of people do not think he is P4P. One of four unified champs at one weight and then a genuine legit champ at another weight. In 4 fights Haye already has four wins, 3 ko's and two champs on his record.

Haye has done this in 25 fights!!! He oozes P4P!

P4P should be judged on what they achieve. No matter what you THINK of his skills the FACT is like I said above.

For cruisers and heavyweights you must take into consideration that the smaller they are the more their speed, stamina, co-ordination, agility etc increases. I am genuinely frightened at the prospect of Haye's speed and agility being increased to fit a middleweight. We would be looking at RJJ type talent if not more!!!

[KingCobra]

Originally Posted by achillesthegreat

I'm very suprised that 55% of people do not think he is P4P. One of four unified champs at one weight and then a genuine legit champ at another weight. In 4 fights Haye already has four wins, 3 ko's and two champs on his record.

Haye has done this in 25 fights!!! He oozes P4P!

If compared to The Rings list he certainly does. I voted no but only just. One big win at Heavyweight will cement his claim.

[LP_1985]

in that list defo. i also think there shud be an unwritten rule that u have to have at least 2 fights a year to be on the P4P list

[JonOli]

I think probably 10-20 is about fair right now, though, like many others say, he is possibly more deserved than some currently on The Ring list.

Not having the Kilts in there also presents a huge obstacle for putting Haye in there, though I guess you can argue the CW angle.

I haven't made my own P4P list for a long time, but think a case can be made for Wlad's inclusion, though P4P lists often (but not always) seem to ignore the heavies.

[kosaros]

Originally Posted by JonOli

I think probably 10-20 is about fair right now, though, like many others say, he is possibly more deserved than some currently on The Ring list.

Not having the Kilts in there also presents a huge obstacle for putting Haye in there, though I guess you can argue the CW angle.

I haven't made my own P4P list for a long time, but think a case can be made for Wlad's inclusion, though P4P lists often (but not always) seem to ignore the heavies.

Wlad is 7th in my list.