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Old 11-09-2007, 01:18 PM   #46
Luigi1985
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Dempsey1238
I dont see Billy out pointed Marciano. Has a other guy said, Louis's style gave Conn room to box and out point Louis. Marciano would be chest to chest with Conn. I think Marciano would take Conn out in 7 rounds or less imo.

I also think that Marciano would KO him, but I give Conn ca. 15 % chances to outpoint Rocky...
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Old 11-09-2007, 03:32 PM   #47
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Amsterdam
I'd pick most modern Heavy's who are ranked, most modern solid CW's and plenty of famous LHW's over Marciano.

Bob Foster wins over Marciano in my opinion.

Surely you jest, Amsterdam.

Sam Peter?

Jameel McCline?

Sultan?

Kali Meehan?

John Ruiz?

Mike Mollo?

And the same Bob Foster who was UD'd in his prime by Zora Folley (Shut-out).
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Old 11-09-2007, 04:33 PM   #48
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

Picking modern HWs over Marciano is totally different than picking <200lb fighters over Marciano.

The Vitali Klitschko that fought Lewis, for example, would DESTROY Marciano. So would Foreman (young or old), Lewis, the Bowe from Holyfield I...Any conditioned superheavyweight that's taller than 6'3 or so with an iron chin would wreck Marciano.

Any "Marciano vs. X" matchup comes down to durability. The only way Marciano is gonna beat a skilled big man (with a good chin) is via workrate, which most skilled fighters (especially modern heavyweights/superheavyweights) would negate. If his opponent has a solid chin and doesn't let Marciano throw/land hundreds of punches per round, they are at least 50/50 to win.

Also - I'd bet both my kidneys that Marciano was not as hard a puncher as his resume indicates. Granted, knocking out a bunch of old LHWs doesn't mean you are a hard puncher...but you have to keep in mind that Marciano fought his career wearing smaller gloves than modern HWs.
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Old 11-09-2007, 10:41 PM   #49
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

The idea that the 'larger, more talented' variety of super heavyweight would take care of Rocky is unjustified. Marciano's top flight opposition where small men by today’s standards, but his record vs. bigger men, regardless of calibre, is quite destructive.

Certainly by virtue of the larger target, a greater volume of Marciano's flailing bombs would land, as he would re-instate his pre-championship, slugger-style of 'seek and destroy' rather than his title reign style of 'press and suffocate'.

A long, snappy jab from a big man could cause Rocky some big problems, but at the same time, his slithering ways of evading while advancing could create the path to hell for his larger opponent.
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Old 11-09-2007, 11:18 PM   #50
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

I think you could make an argument for him beating anyone from 180-200, sure, but I pick plenty to beat him in that weight range.
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Old 11-09-2007, 11:56 PM   #51
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Maxmomer
I think you could make an argument for him beating anyone from 180-200, sure, but I pick plenty to beat him in that weight range.
For argument's sake, name a few.
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Old 11-10-2007, 12:27 AM   #52
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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For argument's sake, name a few.
I think that Schmeling, Tunney, Holyfield and Langford could all beat him, but the only fighter I'm dead certain would beat him in that weight range is Dempsey.
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Old 11-10-2007, 03:29 AM   #53
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Maxmomer
I think that Schmeling, Tunney, Holyfield and Langford could all beat him, but the only fighter I'm dead certain would beat him in that weight range is Dempsey.
I respect your opinion though differ somewhat in my own. Holy and Tunney would have the best chances, though the fancy dan's did baffle Marciano at times, he ultimately caught up, especially in rematches. In regards to Holy, we have to consider the cruiser version who was less powerful than Moore though very active. That would be a wonderful bout.

Langford- as great as I consider him- didn't have quite the firepower or defense to handle a prime Marciano. My opinion.

Schmeling was not of the same caliber in many regards, though Marciano could be nailed with a straight right.

Lastly, Dempsey had such a short prime and was wildly inconsistent. I think Maricano would be bound to come in better shape than his opponent and certainly take him out in the later rounds. Marciano was no Firpo in lack of style and Firpo was no Marciano in output or even power. Unless he conjured a Willard type effort, I think Dempsey goes down.
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Old 11-10-2007, 03:36 AM   #54
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Seamus
I respect your opinion though differ somewhat in my own. Holy and Tunney would have the best chances, though the fancy dan's did baffle Marciano at times, he ultimately caught up, especially in rematches. In regards to Holy, we have to consider the cruiser version who was less powerful than Moore though very active. That would be a wonderful bout.

Langford- as great as I consider him- didn't have quite the firepower or defense to handle a prime Marciano. My opinion.

Schmeling was not of the same caliber in many regards, though Marciano could be nailed with a straight right.

Lastly, Dempsey had such a short prime and was wildly inconsistent. I think Maricano would be bound to come in better shape than his opponent and certainly take him out in the later rounds. Marciano was no Firpo in lack of style and Firpo was no Marciano in output or even power. Unless he conjured a Willard type effort, I think Dempsey goes down.
Langford was very good defensively and is one of the best punchers of all time, I think he'd stand great chance against Marciano and I don't quite see how Dempsey was wildly inconsistent.
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Old 11-10-2007, 03:47 AM   #55
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

Mundine is certainly a funny pick as he has a glass jaw. Can you imagine putting a glass jawed SMW in with the Rock...

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Originally Posted by Luigi1985




Well, it would be way more logical. Damiani was a big fighter with good skills, good chin and good speed for a man of his size. He beat fighters at the amateurs like Stevenson, and at the proīs he beat also good fighters like DuPlooy, Biggs, etc., he could have outboxed a lot of better ranked fighters (history-wise) IMO, I accept normally almost every opinions, I want to hear other opinions, thatīs why I go in a forum, but to say a SMW like Mundine, who lost to fighters like Siaca (who was schooled by a 40 years old Branco) beats Marciano perhaps is really sick...
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Old 11-10-2007, 04:02 AM   #56
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Maxmomer
Langford was very good defensively and is one of the best punchers of all time, I think he'd stand great chance against Marciano and I don't quite see how Dempsey was wildly inconsistent.
I consider Langford one of the all time greats. However, after studying what footage exists of him, his style was somewhere between the crude pre-Johnson era and a forebearer to the action fighters of the 40's and beyond. However, he was W-I-D-E- open for counters, overcommiting to many punches. I don't see much in the way of great defense, even for his time.

Dempsey-Gibbons.
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Old 11-10-2007, 04:21 AM   #57
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Seamus
I consider Langford one of the all time greats. However, after studying what footage exists of him, his style was somewhere between the crude pre-Johnson era and a forebearer to the action fighters of the 40's and beyond. However, he was W-I-D-E- open for counters, overcommiting to many punches. I don't see much in the way of great defense, even for his time.

Dempsey-Gibbons.
That's fair enough, though I don't think Langford should be judged souly on the few poor quality films available of him.

Dempsey Gibbons? What about it? Gibbons was crafty, quick and iron chinned, and Dempsey still managed to take most of the rounds of their fight. Louis didn't fair any better against Billy Conn, a similar fighter to Gibbons. Until the KO he was doing worse against Conn than Dempsey did against Gibbons.
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