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Old 05-09-2011, 12:44 PM   #31
mcvey
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Default Re: Jeffries admits he could never beat Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamus View Post
Quoting Ward hardly gives your argument the credence of impartiality. Unforgiveable Blackness was the biggest jizzfest I have encountered since Anabelle Chong left the business.

I still see no reason to take the Figaro article over that of the NYT, given the depth of specificity in the latter. It would have to be a complete fabrication at that point.
Actually it was Mendoza who said I should refer to," Unforgivable Blackness," so I did.
Your opinion of Ward's book, is just that ,your opinion, it isnt gospel or written in stone, nor is it any more valid than the many distinguished writers, and sports commentators who have lavished praise on it.
It's true spectators booed the Johnson /Johnson fight, but they were booing the lack of action ,not the verdict.
If you wish to beleive that the Johnson /Johnson fight was a scheduled 20 rounder that is your prerogative.

A man is judged by the company he keeps, in this case you have only one poster for company, Mendoza, I would venture to say that hardly gives your argument the credence of impartiality. TOUCHE I think!
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Old 05-09-2011, 01:49 PM   #32
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Default Re: Jeffries admits he could never beat Jack Johnson

I made a poll regarding how credible ESB members find the quote that is the subject of this thread.

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I put the URL for this thread into my poll thread, refering posters who wish to argue the credibility of the quote to this thread.
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Old 05-09-2011, 01:59 PM   #33
Seamus
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Default Re: Jeffries admits he could never beat Jack Johnson

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Originally Posted by mcvey View Post
Actually it was Mendoza who said I should refer to," Unforgivable Blackness," so I did.
Your opinion of Ward's book, is just that ,your opinion, it isnt gospel or written in stone, nor is it any more valid than the many distinguished writers, and sports commentators who have lavished praise on it.
It's true spectators booed the Johnson /Johnson fight, but they were booing the lack of action ,not the verdict.
According to the sources you chose to believe. Fine. To me, I give more credence to the NYT. Either way, another murky result from the champion. After a while, these stack up to rattle my belief that he was an untouchable ATG>
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcvey View Post
If you wish to beleive that the Johnson /Johnson fight was a scheduled 20 rounder that is your prerogative.
I have heard this contention but have seen no evidence that it is true.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcvey View Post
A man is judged by the company he keeps, in this case you have only one poster for company, Mendoza, I would venture to say that hardly gives your argument the credence of impartiality. TOUCHE I think!
Please keep me out of your catfight. I have found both credence and fault with both of your many statements... as I am sure you have with mine.
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Old 05-09-2011, 02:26 PM   #34
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Default Re: Jeffries admits he could never beat Jack Johnson

Jeffries post-fight press-release in full:

"I lost my fight this afternoon because I did not have the snap of youth I used to have. I believed in my heart that all my old-time dash was there but when I tried to execute the speed and youthful steam were lacking. The things I used to do were impossible. For example I used to shoot in a right-hand body punch, a short-range blow that never failed me. When I tried today the snap was not there and it was only a love-tap.

I suppose most of my trainers and helpers will say that I did not box enough. It wouldn't have made any difference if I had sparred a dozen more times than I did, I simply was not there and that's all there is to it.

I guess it was all my own fault. I was getting along nicely but when the started calling me the "white man's hope". I guess my pride got the better of my judgement. I worked long and hard to condition myself and I was fit so far as strength goes but the old necessary snap and dash, the willingness to tear and crush, were not with me.

Six years ago the result might have been different.

But now - well, I guess the public will let me alone after this."
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Old 05-09-2011, 03:13 PM   #35
mcvey
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Default Re: Jeffries admits he could never beat Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamus View Post
According to the sources you chose to believe. Fine. To me, I give more credence to the NYT. Either way, another murky result from the champion. After a while, these stack up to rattle my belief that he was an untouchable ATG>


I have heard this contention but have seen no evidence that it is true.



Please keep me out of your catfight. I have found both credence and fault with both of your many statements... as I am sure you have with mine.
I'm not in a cat fight, and the fight I accepted did not materialise. Lets be honest there are two Johnson haters on this forum, Mendoza and yourself, you are not as rabid as he is, but never miss an opportunity to rip him, if its at all posssible, actually thinking about it, I can't remember you posting anything positive about any body,you just seem to want to swoop down with little acid one liners ,then fly off again ,that again is your prerogative ,but it is hardly debating is it?
McGrain is no Johnson fan , but he is open minded, and receptive to argument, your mind is made up ,and you have an unshakeable belief that you are allways right.There's no law against it ,but it makes for an unrewarding debate.
I dont actually give much thought to your statements ,I think you enjoy being provocative and that's about it. I wouldn't be surprised ,if everyone was negative about Johnson ,that you came out with a ton of praise for him ,basically I think you are a professional wind up merchant.
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Old 05-09-2011, 03:57 PM   #36
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Default Re: Jeffries admits he could never beat Jack Johnson

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Originally Posted by Mendoza View Post
Scare blue!

Let me guess, you will quickly disregard the French media when Jack Johnson told then that Langford floored him and they printed it.

Sources vary on the lenght of the fight. But what does not vary is Jim Battling Johnson was in fact a journeyman by record, who according to any detailed report you can find was the better.

Ironic, it Jack Johnson were white, and Jim were black, liberal writers who really do not know a lot about boxing would use this match as an example of racism as the decision most certainly stunk.
Here is a report of the Langford/ Johnson fight posted by Clay Moyle,

Boston Post - April 27, 1906

“CAMBRIDGE LAD WENT FULL DISTANCE BUT WAS BADLY BEATEN.
In one of the most one-side bouts ever seen in Chelsea, Jack Johnson of California, won the decision over Sam Langford of Cambridge after 15 rounds at the Lincoln Athletic Club last night.

In the sixth round Johnson put Langford to the mat for the count twice, the first time with a right uppercut to the chin. Both times Langford struggled to his feet at the count of nine and stalled to the end of the round.

After the sixth it ceased to be a contest, Langford merely stalling it out, clinching and holding on at every opportunity. The bout sellted down to a question of how long Langford could stay. He let Johnson do all the forcing, countering with a straight left occasionally, then closing in and hanging on.

The feature of the bout was the extraordinary defensive work of Langford and his remarkable ability to take punishment. It was a wonder that he could stand the beating that Johnson handed him.

He was game to the core, and won the cheers of the corwd by his courage and cleverness. But when that is said, nothing more in praise of the bout could be added.

It was too one-sided to be interesting. Johnson outweighed Langford by fully 30 lbs., and was a head taller and six inches more reach.

Johnson didn’t try very hard. His superiority was evident from the outset and he didn’t have to. In the first three rounds Langford , by his cleverness, held his own.

Johnson had a slight advantage in the first; the second was even, and in the third, fourth and fifth Johnson increased his lead slightly.

Then came the sixth and it did not seem possible that Langford could last the round out. But he did, and after that it was only a question of how much more punishment he could stand.

There were times when Johnson looked tired, but it was from his own exertions.

The Boston Globe reported the day after the fight that Langford was good and strong when the bout ended, but that there was no question about the decision being a just one, for Johnson certainly outpointed Sam. Though Sam left the ring a loser he was loudly cheered.

He left the ring without a mark while Langford’s face showed that he had been through the wars. Maffitt Flaherty refereed.”


Will that shut you up, you stupid cunt?
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Old 05-09-2011, 07:26 PM   #37
guilalah
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Default Re: Jeffries admits he could never beat Jack Johnson

McGrain posted this on my poll thread:






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Does anyone know where this comes from.?
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Old 05-09-2011, 07:27 PM   #38
guilalah
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Default Re: Jeffries admits he could never beat Jack Johnson

Here are some boxing articles published in papers in the days after the Reno fight:

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-------

[Edit]

Another article on the fight

(nothing concerning the quote being discussed)
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----------
[EDIT]
Another article, June 26 1910, generally favoring Johnson in the upcoming battle

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Pretty good prognostication; the writer thinks the fight would last quite a bit longer than it actually did, but mostly he nails it.

Last edited by guilalah; 05-09-2011 at 07:56 PM.
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