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Old 06-09-2011, 07:40 PM   #16
Bonkers
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

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Originally Posted by bballchump11 View Post
is this good? I'm actually trying to get back into lifting weights, because I do body weight exercises now also, but I'm to the point where I can do 10+ one arm pushups and 10+ jumping pistol squats and I need to add more difficulty
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Wow, those pistols are whooping my ass(I'm 6'1 220, and 25lbs overweight right now). If I were you, I would cycle plyometics(SS cycle), and power work with endurance.

Cycling all the different phases is your best bet now, seems that you have all the absolute strength you need. That book: Periodization for Athletes by Bumpa explains everything really well if you ask me.
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Old 06-09-2011, 07:42 PM   #17
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

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Originally Posted by 1punch1nder View Post
too much muscles makes you slow and lose stamina.
This is a law IMO.

Even in DragonBall Z from the early 1980's said this in the Cell Saga.
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Old 06-09-2011, 07:43 PM   #18
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

I try and do bodyweight exercises more than I lift weights..And when I do lift weights it's usually only for one exercise at a time along with my bodyweight exercises, and sticking to lifts like squats,deadlifts, bench press etc, that work big muscle groups
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Old 06-09-2011, 07:50 PM   #19
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

It seems to me that strength and conditioning practices are moving forward at tremendous rate. Particuarly, MMA coaches have show willingness to learn from athletes from others sports and seem open to try anything that could improve the performance of their althletes. 100m sprinters and NBA players are also benefiting from more scientific athletic training. (including both heavy and light resistance training)

Boxing, however, is a sport steeped in history and tradition with many fighters and trainers alike, staying loyal to old-school methods and remaining fearfull of resistance training. This is not a suprise considering that early weight training techniques that boxers had adopted were largely borrowed from bodybuilding. Boxers would lift heavy loads at a slow velocity. This is not going to produce good results for a fighter.

A more suitable program would consist of lifting medium-heavy loads and lighters loads but focusing on the velocity of the movement as opposed to the actual amount of resistance.

I feel boxing is becoming left behind in terms of producing the best possible athletes, and this may possibly be because of its unwillingness to welcome change.
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Old 06-09-2011, 07:54 PM   #20
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

If you spend more than 30% of your time lifting instead of training, you're in the wrong sport.
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Old 06-09-2011, 07:58 PM   #21
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

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Originally Posted by bballchump11 View Post
Lifting weights is good for boxing, but only if you know what you're doing. Also lifting the wrong way can make you stiff and slow and lose flexibility. If you do everything properly, then this won't be and issue.

edit: Also lifting can interfere with skill work and technique if you do it too often and spend time lifting that could have been spend perfecting your moves. Lets say you lift hard 5 days out the week. Your muscles will be too won out to focus on hitting the bag and mitts. So I'd only lift maybe twice a week on the same muscle
very true.

Also bulk muscles tired easy and slows you down.
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:00 PM   #22
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

My old boxing gym coach didn't believe in it. He had me do fast twitch muscle weight lifting and leg workouts.
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:01 PM   #23
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

The are different conditions that a fighter should train.
1. strength 2. endurance 3. Speed and power

Strength can be trained with heavy weights. Exercises must be very short 1-3 reps and very few sets and the rest period should be much higher than with bodybuilding. The focus is quality not quantity. this also prevents fighter becoming too heavily muscle-bound and stiff and prevents too much latic acid build-up.

Endurance is best trained the traditional way of running and boxing work. But some light weight resistance training with a high rep range can work.

Speed and power can be address with plyometric and moving light and medium weights at a fast velocity
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:02 PM   #24
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

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Originally Posted by Bonkers View Post
Wow, those pistols are whooping my ass(I'm 6'1 220, and 25lbs overweight right now). If I were you, I would cycle plyometics(SS cycle), and power work with endurance.

Cycling all the different phases is your best bet now, seems that you have all the absolute strength you need. That book: Periodization for Athletes by Bumpa explains everything really well if you ask me.
thanks man. And yeah I'm 145 pounds so it's not too bad for me
I'll try to do plyometric work like you mentioned. I used to play basketball, so I'm familiar with doing plyo work when increasing my vertical
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:04 PM   #25
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

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Originally Posted by eminentair View Post
It seems to me that strength and conditioning practices are moving forward at tremendous rate. Particuarly, MMA coaches have show willingness to learn from athletes from others sports and seem open to try anything that could improve the performance of their althletes. 100m sprinters and NBA players are also benefiting from more scientific athletic training. (including both heavy and light resistance training)

Boxing, however, is a sport steeped in history and tradition with many fighters and trainers alike, staying loyal to old-school methods and remaining fearfull of resistance training. This is not a suprise considering that early weight training techniques that boxers had adopted were largely borrowed from bodybuilding. Boxers would lift heavy loads at a slow velocity. This is not going to produce good results for a fighter.

A more suitable program would consist of lifting medium-heavy loads and lighters loads but focusing on the velocity of the movement as opposed to the actual amount of resistance.

I feel boxing is becoming left behind in terms of producing the best possible athletes, and this may possibly be because of its unwillingness to welcome change.

Please show me an example of great boxers that lift weights in mid-heavy range you are talking about. Look at the link with Frank Bruno and Mike Tyson. Mike says it...

-Shane Mosley started lifting when he went to WW and JMW, and he looked like shit as a result. When he was a lightweight, fast, powerful, great endurance)
-Early Tyson didn't do weights except shrugs, and he was faster, and much better. When he came out of prison and fought Lewis he did lift and weighed even 20lbs more than in his prime and his speed was effected badly.

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

-ODH when he was in his prime didn't lift and he was very good(I don't remember the name of his best trainer, too many to recall).
-Pavlik vs Martenez he used a Physical Therapist and looked like shit slower and way worse. But when he was doing old school shit, he looked way better.
-Winky Wright started using all kinds of gadgets and trainers, and started to look terrible, I don't know what he was doing before that though.

-BHOP doesn't lift weights all old school shit as the main course. Then some new shit to augment it.
-Lennox Lewis said he doesn't think weight lifting works if I remember on Boxing after dark.
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:07 PM   #26
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Quote:
Originally Posted by eminentair View Post
The are different conditions that a fighter should train.
1. strength 2. endurance 3. Speed and power

Strength can be trained with heavy weights. Exercises must be very short 1-3 reps and very few sets and the rest period should be much higher than with bodybuilding. The focus is quality not quantity. this also prevents fighter becoming too heavily muscle-bound and stiff and prevents too much latic acid build-up.

Endurance is best trained the traditional way of running and boxing work. But some light weight resistance training with a high rep range can work.

Speed and power can be address with plyometric and moving light and medium weights at a fast velocity
Yeah, I agree. Long rest periods are key to restore ATP between sets.
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:25 PM   #27
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

IMO there is no right or wrong. Everyones body and fighting style is different.
Do what works for you, is the best advice that I was ever given to me.
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:28 PM   #28
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

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The old timers would tell ya, that it makes you too stiff, example. When doing sets of curls, do you ever notice how your arms swell up and get tight?
Yes of course this is the point of lifting weights, to break down the muscles so that you can repair them again and make them stronger, which will take about week to happen.

You don't really think people are so stupid that they would lift weights a day or a few days prior to a fight now do you?

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Old 06-09-2011, 08:42 PM   #29
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

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Originally Posted by Bonkers View Post
Please show me an example of great boxers that lift weights in mid-heavy range you are talking about. Look at the link with Frank Bruno and Mike Tyson. Mike says it...

-Shane Mosley started lifting when he went to WW and JMW, and he looked like shit as a result. When he was a lightweight, fast, powerful, great endurance)
-Early Tyson didn't do weights except shrugs, and he was faster, and much better. When he came out of prison and fought Lewis he did lift and weighed even 20lbs more than in his prime and his speed was effected badly.

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

-ODH when he was in his prime didn't lift and he was very good(I don't remember the name of his best trainer, too many to recall).
-Pavlik vs Martenez he used a Physical Therapist and looked like shit slower and way worse. But when he was doing old school shit, he looked way better.
-Winky Wright started using all kinds of gadgets and trainers, and started to look terrible, I don't know what he was doing before that though.

-BHOP doesn't lift weights all old school shit as the main course. Then some new shit to augment it.
-Lennox Lewis said he doesn't think weight lifting works if I remember on Boxing after dark.
damn good points. I'd say weight lifting can't be too harmful to your legs though. The added strength and maybe size would make you faster and bouncier
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:47 PM   #30
bballchump11
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonkers View Post
Please show me an example of great boxers that lift weights in mid-heavy range you are talking about. Look at the link with Frank Bruno and Mike Tyson. Mike says it...

-Shane Mosley started lifting when he went to WW and JMW, and he looked like shit as a result. When he was a lightweight, fast, powerful, great endurance)
-Early Tyson didn't do weights except shrugs, and he was faster, and much better. When he came out of prison and fought Lewis he did lift and weighed even 20lbs more than in his prime and his speed was effected badly.

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

-ODH when he was in his prime didn't lift and he was very good(I don't remember the name of his best trainer, too many to recall).
-Pavlik vs Martenez he used a Physical Therapist and looked like shit slower and way worse. But when he was doing old school shit, he looked way better.
-Winky Wright started using all kinds of gadgets and trainers, and started to look terrible, I don't know what he was doing before that though.

-BHOP doesn't lift weights all old school shit as the main course. Then some new shit to augment it.
-Lennox Lewis said he doesn't think weight lifting works if I remember on Boxing after dark.
damn good points. I'd say weight lifting can't be too harmful to your legs though. The added strength and maybe size would make you faster and bouncier
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