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Old 06-09-2011, 08:51 PM   #31
sunderland lad
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

personally i think weight training complements boxing, so long as you dont overdo it. i mean its all about building muscle and losing fat, which is a good thing for boxing isnt it? it means you have more power when you punch, also your muscles will recover better.
also working your abs for instance means you can take a body shot better
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:54 PM   #32
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

I've seen BHOP doing barbell squats, does that count as lifitng eights?
i've also seem floyd mayweather pulling on some somesort of cable machine(lat pull down)
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Old 06-09-2011, 09:02 PM   #33
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonkers View Post

Check out Periodization training for athletes from T. Bumpa, this guys stuff is what everyone else is really copying IMO.

As for the stiffness, look at Pascal, he looks like a little Holyfield, and he has no conditioning, and I feel it has to do with the inordinate amount of Muscle tissue he has in upper body. Andre Berto too. Always fighting is spurts. Now compare that to Aaron Pryor or Joe Frazier, this guys bodies didn't look half as nice, but could throw punches for days. Henry Armstrong, Joe Louis... the list goes on and on
Yep: Bompa is the guy to read for weightlifting training techniques and science.

Bompa may have worked with/learned from some Eastern European sources. I can't remember.
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Old 06-10-2011, 12:48 AM   #34
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

some very very good points

i like the discussion

i agree that the triditional bodybuilding approach may not be best for
fighting,

but i was talking about lifting weights in general, also even in bodybuilding
there are a ton of approaches to all of this,


i am always interested in these types of training

the only thing that worries me about
the 2-3 reps super heavy sets

is that
1. you are not a weightlifter, it is easy for you to get injuried
because of lack of muscle streaght and or power techique

2. by resting like 5 mintues between sets.
how do you not get cold aka cool down
adding a risk of injury


i am actually very curious about answers to this???????????????????????



also to those who say lifting can make you bulky and slow

maybe if you over do it


but i have a question for

no one dare question running but i will

run every day for long distances
and see how your legs feel....(espically your knees)

and see how strong you are.....

easy test
run a long distance
then go lift weights, you will see how much weaker you are.....

or go spar, see that you legs will feel like 2 sticks
espically if your a heavier guy


again i am not debating the fact that running is for you
just that people always point
the worst affects of lifting
but never of running.......

just like you can say over lifting can kill your stamia
over running will do the same to your streaght
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Old 06-10-2011, 10:45 AM   #35
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

When you say 'weightlifting' it usually refers to olympic lifts so be careful with that.

Then there is powerlifting and then there is bodybuilding type resistance training.

Olympic lifts are fantastic for every athlete, you work both force and velocity at the same time which results in large power outputs.

Powerlifting with heavy weights works on the force part of the force-velocity curve which can increase power. It's difficult to improve speed so one way to increase power is to increase maximum strength. With powerlifting you are working the biggest, strongest muscles in your body.

Bodybuilding exercises in the 6-12 rep range are next to useless for a boxer, the only advantage of training that way might be in the off season to prepare the body a little bit for the real work later on.

Most of the force in sporting movements comes from the recoil of tendons. To improve the stretch and efficiency of tendons you should perform stretch shortening cycle exercises (plyometrics). They will provide you with the biggest increases in power and you won't have to worry about hypertrophy which is useful with a sport like boxing where you usually have to make weight and have a good strength to weight ratio.

There is nothing wrong with weights and they can help your boxing, but the thing that improves your boxing more than anything is boxing. Specificity is very important, above everything else. So weights aren't necessary.

If you did have time to incorporate weights for boxing I would suggest a periodised plan. If you wanted to do the same thing every week then I'd suggest 1 maybe 2 sessions of Powerlifting exercises using contrast training (that is using a plyometric type movement after a strength type movement that is similar in terms of muscle activated) and perhaps some complimentary exercises such as shrugs, bent over rows and side bends (to strengthen muscles that are neglected but are important in boxing). Then I'd suggest 2 sessions devoted to olympic lifts and their variations. Then fit in one or two plyometric only sessions.

Obviously all that takes up alot of time and energy. All you really need for boxing is boxing training. Weights don't make you slow and stiff, you will become slow and stiff however if you always train slow, build large quantities of muscle by doing bodybuilders reps and if you neglect stretching exercises. The lesson there is to vary your training, work your velocity and your force.
Remember above all else, skills pay the bills.
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Old 06-10-2011, 11:46 AM   #36
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Weight training should be seen as an additional way or tool to acheive a specific goal e.g. Increase Power, increase size, increase Anerobic endurance (there are better alternatives) or increase general conditioning. Your weight session should reflect what you are trying to achieve i.e. right weight, right reps, right muscles and right frequency.

If you use weights and have no plan or understanding why you're using them then you will not have the desired results.
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Old 06-10-2011, 12:00 PM   #37
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

It makes you slow. The single one thing no fighter wants. Also, you gas more look at Haye he gases every fight.
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Old 06-10-2011, 01:39 PM   #38
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joan_Guzman View Post
It makes you slow. The single one thing no fighter wants. Also, you gas more look at Haye he gases every fight.
No, it doesn't. It makes you faster if you train correctly, muscles contract faster and stronger.

The thing about Haye gassing is completely irrelevant to weight training. I could say this "If Hatton loses another fight I'm going to blame it on his roadwork" That sounds as stupid as what you said. You can't pick out a single part of his training and say he gasses because of xxxxxxxx just because you take issue with that part of his training.

I'm sure there was a thread before where you claimed the same thing even after pages of you just repeating the same thing with multiple people, including myself, telling you you're wrong. Are you really that ignorant?

Last edited by viru§™; 06-10-2011 at 02:20 PM.
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Old 06-10-2011, 05:59 PM   #39
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joan_Guzman View Post
It makes you slow. The single one thing no fighter wants. Also, you gas more look at Haye he gases every fight.
I actually think Haye is one of the best conditoned fighters around. The reason why Haye sometimes seems gassed is because he is a big guy throwing fast, powerful punches. He fights with intensity. It's easy for a guy like Calzaghe to punch all night throwing slappy arm punches.
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Old 06-11-2011, 12:59 AM   #40
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joan_Guzman View Post
It makes you slow. The single one thing no fighter wants. Also, you gas more look at Haye he gases every fight.
haye dosnt really do weight lifting, he does strength training while incorporating weights in to the basics like weighted pull ups and weighted ab exercises while also doing plyometrics like clap push ups, forms of depth jumps, medicine ball throws and more.

i really dont consider any of those things similar to the weight lifting discussed in this thread, and dont really see any reason to bring haye and his gassing into this thread.

hey, perhaps you can find some source showing that haye does squats and power cleans to prep for a match but i cant find any of the such.
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Old 06-11-2011, 02:31 AM   #41
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSDQXfQML34&feature=related[/ame]


you dont really need to understand russian, every excerise is shown

some involve weights and others dont

very interesting video and system
basically you do a full round of one
and then switch
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Old 06-11-2011, 03:30 AM   #42
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

You need all kinds of training in boxing,and all should be used....but as regards weights if used right you will get strong muscles,strong bones,strong ligaments,strong joints that will repair faster and easier.....but you have to take into consideration big muscles require a lot of oxygen to feed them in a fight......and when you get older remember you carry fat around,muscle carry's you around.....
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Old 06-11-2011, 07:09 AM   #43
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Quote:
Originally Posted by armhard View Post
You need all kinds of training in boxing,and all should be used....but as regards weights if used right you will get strong muscles,strong bones,strong ligaments,strong joints that will repair faster and easier.....but you have to take into consideration big muscles require a lot of oxygen to feed them in a fight......and when you get older remember you carry fat around,muscle carry's you around.....
Getting stronger doesn't necessarily mean more muscle.
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Old 06-11-2011, 07:26 AM   #44
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Quote:
Originally Posted by viru§™ View Post
Getting stronger doesn't necessarily mean more muscle.
Yep very common mistake. Most people think to add strength you have to increase muscle mass but that simply isn't true.
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Old 06-11-2011, 10:06 AM   #45
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Default Re: weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????

Quote:
Originally Posted by highguard View Post
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]


you dont really need to understand russian, every excerise is shown

some involve weights and others dont

very interesting video and system
basically you do a full round of one
and then switch
plyo is plyo weight lifting is weight lifting.....i must have missed the part with the olympic lifting, power lifting, and or body building.

the thread is "weight lifting...why such different views on it in boxing???????" not "plyometrics...why such different views on it in boxing???????" not "Strength Training...why such different views on it in boxing???????"

the video you posted really is nothing different then what boxers have always been doing and has nothing to do with your argument. Why such diffrent views? well most boxers and coaches agree strength training with plyometrics is quite good....there really arnt all that many different views.

lets try to keep to the argument at hand instead of making strawman arguments.
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