Never Gymless: Opinions

[Ischbaad]

Originally Posted by MrSmall

One on one, no, have no interest too. I explained myself above!
Thread wasn't about him though, was about his book.
Have you?

Fair enough. I have spoken to him on his forum on numerous occassions and found him to be very polite and helpful.

I've never actually read his Facebook statuses, so who knows, maybe he is a bit of a cunt. But he doesn't seem that way on his forum.

[Matt Ldn]

I dont wanna quote your post because its pretty long (which i thank you for taking the time over). The problem i have is that because i used to go gym purely for bodybuilding i had no real aims and its only this year where i realised that i wanted to focus on conditioning/strength for boxing/jiu jitsu and other sports im interested in that i have really focussed goals, with the asthetic gains secondary. So i dont have much to compare it to but didnt wanna waste 3 months following something that was well known as ineffective compared to another system.

Will give it a thorough read and try and apply it as much as possible over the summer and properly look at the results for once thanks for the feedback.

[Primate]

Originally Posted by MrSmall

He's selling a product by giving out basic, effective and easy-to-do workouts and ideas, which are pretty good, but they are in NO way his own ideas or unique in any way to him. And big surprise, you get good results from following the principle of WORKING HARD with some solid movements and exercises? Shocker.

While I don't particularly disagree with you, he says all the time that the stuff he preaches is nothing new, it's part of the 'old school' theme. As far as "selling a product" his books and DVDs are an excellent source of info, they are cheap as hell and well produced, it's kinda hard to argue with that. There's nothing really new under the sun, he's just put it into an easily accessible package.

And he's not nearly as bad as a lot of other internet fitness gurus who will charge you just to hear their opinion, he has a lot of info on his site for free and while I don't read his blog with any regularity, some of his longer articles are great.

I think the thing that does irritate me is that the whole "home-made = HARD CORE" thing is really played out. There's a thread over their at the moment about making olympic plates out of concrete. I honestly can't see how that's any easier or cheaper than just buying a few plates, it's not you can't get them second hand, and they're iron, so they last forever. I think that's more of a problem with his dedicated followers than with Ross himself (the organic vegetable crazies are by far the funniest).

He says quite a lot of offensive stuff on Facebook as his statuses and comes across as a very narrowminded guy, and then 50 guys suck his dick and laugh about it, but there is a theme of having a big chip on his shoulder, no time for anyone else who isn't like him, and no acceptance of other ways of life. Something that really was the icing on the cake was when he said "stupid people should be put down, period." something very similar to that, I fucked him off from my list after that sort of ridiculous thing. It was about some woman parking or something really mundane. Do I want to learn anything from that sort of individual? He can fuck right off.

If I judged everyone by their facebook posts I'd have a pretty grim view of the world.
I've corresponded with him one on one via email and he's seemed like a friendly, helpful guy, facebook posts aside.

[Johnboy2007]

I can see your points Mr Small. I found the book useful read but yeh your right its nothing new. I actually liked the theory and write ups before the routines in infinite intensity but once again nothing new. Probably a good introduction for someone like me who wants to get more into the knowledge side of things.

My philosophy on learning anything is to read everything work out what is useful and disregard what isnt.

While we are on the subject maybe some of the ESB gurus could suggest books and sources by other trainers/ conditioning coaches. I was going to post this under another thread might still do actually.

[brown bomber]

Cheers mate interesting thta

[MrSmall]

Originally Posted by Ischbaad

Fair enough. I have spoken to him on his forum on numerous occassions and found him to be very polite and helpful.

I've never actually read his Facebook statuses, so who knows, maybe he is a bit of a cunt. But he doesn't seem that way on his forum.

I have spoken to him a bit there too, and of course he will be nice. But the impression I get from his posts elsewhere, is not the sort of person I'd agree with in other matters of life. Nothing against the training though, and the forum is a decent one!

Originally Posted by Matt Ldn

I dont wanna quote your post because its pretty long (which i thank you for taking the time over). The problem i have is that because i used to go gym purely for bodybuilding i had no real aims and its only this year where i realised that i wanted to focus on conditioning/strength for boxing/jiu jitsu and other sports im interested in that i have really focussed goals, with the asthetic gains secondary. So i dont have much to compare it to but didnt wanna waste 3 months following something that was well known as ineffective compared to another system.

Will give it a thorough read and try and apply it as much as possible over the summer and properly look at the results for once thanks for the feedback.

That's absolutely fine, and it IS an effective system. You could put something together yourself very similar, but its a decent plan to follow (the 50 day thing you mean?), give it a shot! I think I've gone through the Infinite Intensity program more or less, don't really remember the results though.

Originally Posted by Primate

While I don't particularly disagree with you, he says all the time that the stuff he preaches is nothing new, it's part of the 'old school' theme. As far as "selling a product" his books and DVDs are an excellent source of info, they are cheap as hell and well produced, it's kinda hard to argue with that. There's nothing really new under the sun, he's just put it into an easily accessible package.

And he's not nearly as bad as a lot of other internet fitness gurus who will charge you just to hear their opinion, he has a lot of info on his site for free and while I don't read his blog with any regularity, some of his longer articles are great.

I think the thing that does irritate me is that the whole "home-made = HARD CORE" thing is really played out. There's a thread over their at the moment about making olympic plates out of concrete. I honestly can't see how that's any easier or cheaper than just buying a few plates, it's not you can't get them second hand, and they're iron, so they last forever. I think that's more of a problem with his dedicated followers than with Ross himself (the organic vegetable crazies are by far the funniest).

If I judged everyone by their facebook posts I'd have a pretty grim view of the world.
I've corresponded with him one on one via email and he's seemed like a friendly, helpful guy, facebook posts aside.

I found the books to be of good quality too.
oh god, the RAW VEGAN guys. I pretty much agree with you on all the points your brought up my friend, I haven't spoken to him via email or anything. I guess I might be a bit harsh on the guy but some of the stuff he posted was genuinely offensive, I expect that sort of thing from some immature teen, not a guy like him. So I was probably doubly disappointed from that too, in that I held him in regard and then turned out to be a regular douche.

Originally Posted by brown bomber

Cheers mate interesting thta

But hey, what do I know? If you get along with the bloke, so be it.

[withoutwire]

Interesting topic, agree pretty much with mr. Small and primate, good posts!

[P.4.P.G.O.A.T.]

Originally Posted by MrSmall

Decent books about training with no gyms, sure.
The guy himself is a prick though, so this puts me off reading his books anymore.
as a beginner it was cool but ultimately its nothing magic and a lot of innovation just to be different rather than effective.

You certainly could be right - but I've written to him a few times and he's always seemed gracious in his responses. I think Ross's books are amazing - you can't go wrong with his routines.

[patch1983]

And everything has to be homemade, otherwise its not hardcore and effective. Sure its a lot cheaper and usually just as good, but damn. Its not a great deal better than the bodybuilding mags, huge amount of supplements, use this coconut shoulders routine for 8 weeks. Instead its the equivalent but for conditioning/fighting sports.

What are you on about? He uses barbell, dumbbells, trap bar, power rack etc etc. Yes he has some homemade stuff on his site but he never claims they are better.

But did you really need him to tell you that a good way to condition yourself is by doing circuits of simple bodyweight exercises, or run some sprints, or jump rope, or hit the bag? Or to get stronger do some explosive lifting, or do some advanced bodyweight variations?

There is a lot of shit in fitness mags and on the internet. When I was younger I had no idea how to train. His books helped a lot.

BUT realise that its the equivalent of any other personal trainer by pushing the BODYWEIGHT WORKOUTS, BOXING CONDITIONING, SLEDGEHAMMER TRAINING, and all that shit that people love to hear about and will make them OLD SCHOOL.

Again, what are you going on about? He is not pushing anything.

He's selling a product by giving out basic, effective and easy-to-do workouts and ideas, which are pretty good, but they are in NO way his own ideas or unique in any way to him.

When did he ever claim they were unique to him. He has often stated where and who he got his ideas from.

Plus there is the added benefit that his whole shpiel is that you don't need weights to get stronger, so nearly noone gets injured, but most guys on his forum are really not very strong at all in the scheme of things, they are strong compared to guys that don't train anything for strength, but again, they didn't need Ross's methods to get stronger, they needed to get some fucking work done.

Again, what are you going on about?
He himself uses weights as do most people on his forum. All he says is just beacuse you don't have weights does not mean you can't get stronger. Look at the workout logs on the site. There are people who just strength train. There is a bodybuilder on there etc.

Plus, with hard work, you can achieve any results, without having to do "ross training",

Ross says there is no such thing as rosstraining. Just principles that work and you should ajust your training depending what you are training for.

He's just a guy earning his living off of very basic and very effective methods that any half decent gym or trainer in the world would tell you to do.

The books and dvds prob don't make him much money. Training his athletes is how he earns his money (not just boxers)

[patch1983]

As for his facebook stuff. I cant say I found anything he says offensive

[MrSmall]

Agree to disagree then on some things mate.
The workouts are pretty solid though, we can all agree on that, and the books are decent too.

[patch1983]

Its not a case of agreeing to disagree. You are making flat out lies about him

[MrSmall]

Who are you, his lawyer? Why would I make up lies?
I have an opinion, I stated it, that's all it is.
Sorry if you don't like it.
I can disagree with your points and we can go round in circles, but the thread was about the book, which is a good one. People asked me what I thought of him, I said it, the thread wasn't about me liking the guy or not so lets not drag that out any more. My gripe isn't about the actual training, I take it you see that?
You can PM me if you REALLY care that much and we can talk about it more.

[viru§™]

Originally Posted by patch1983

Its not a case of agreeing to disagree. You are making flat out lies about him

He isn't lying. What he finds offensive may be different to what you find offensive. Where's the lie?

[MrSmall]

And by selling books, dvds, having ads on his site, he is making money! What was a lie there?

And like fitness mag routines, the followers will defend them to the death as the only way of life! Just like the paleo diet zealots, etc.

And he doesn't encourage barbell exercises at ANY point in his books, he prefers home made equipment or bodyweight stuff, and that's fine, but that IS pushing a certain type of training, that isn't a lie either.

His workouts ARE effective, that isn't a lie.

And people AREN'T very strong with his methods in the scheme of things, but they will be stronger than people that do some bodybuilding crap of 6 tricep exercises, that isn't a lie either.