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Old 09-30-2013, 06:27 PM   #31
choklab
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

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Originally Posted by markclitheroe View Post
choklab..glad u appreciated the Tyrell v Riddick contest..when u see alot of poor contests over the years you really look back and appreciate how good these guys were.
Glad you thought Biggs put up a good effort...i think he gets a bad press for some reason reason..all that gets mentioned is his early drug habit and underachievement,he certainly didnt look like a man who was doing the wrong things outside the ring v Bowe..i just can't
figure out why he took so many tough fights on the bounce almost.
you mention the Damiani fight his first after tyson almost a year break as he had plastic surgery on his cut so had to have time to heal,Damiani was his last fight with Duva and for me it was a crazy one to take,Tyrell got another bad cut and it was stoped,Tyrell reckons he would have outboxed damiani but the fight looked close and Damiani looked strong but it was a stupid fight to take, again was it for the money? to get his career on track he shouldve had 2 or 3 easier fights.interesting what you say about being harder to fight on the outside Tyrell always started his fights dancing and landing jabs but it never lasted long, so maybe he wasnt fit enough to fight his best style...does that make sense ??
Once a challenger makes it to the money fights he often stays in the money fights. A former challenger is quite saleable as a stepping stone for other contenders. he can look to Gatecrash the title scene by winning another big fight or return to the prospect circuit. Sometimes the decision is not just the fighter. Often he has investors who have sponsored him this far without making a profit. They might want to pull the plug on supporting another campaign through the ranks. Maybe the fighter himself needs to support a lifestyle he can no longer afford? The trail into the money fights is a life's work, it can be a brave choice to turn down big chances having already got that far.

I think Jimmy Braddock said it best, it was something like "when you are evenly matched you are in there to win. if your ability matches the other guy and its a little better than his you win. If it dosnt it's to his advantage. "sometimes you get the breaks, sometimes you don't. If you get the breaks your there, your up on top, if you don't your on the bottom".

I don't no the circumstances surrounding why exactly Biggs chose such fights but maybe they only look like bad decisions in hindsight? Not all fighters have the luxery of being able to to choose a sensible route back to the title after failing in a first titleshot.

Last edited by choklab; 10-01-2013 at 03:27 AM.
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Old 10-01-2013, 03:24 PM   #32
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

thanks for that choklab....do u think his inability to keep the fights at range was down to fitness deficiencys ? in the first round v tyson he looked great but by round three he was flat footed and mixing it and coming off worse...a pattern he repeated in several fights.I am not an expert but he clearly didnt have the power to outmuscle the top guys.
someone said he wasnt mentally strong enough and often got drawn into the other guys fight style.
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Old 10-01-2013, 06:42 PM   #33
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

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Originally Posted by markclitheroe View Post
thanks for that choklab....do u think his inability to keep the fights at range was down to fitness deficiencys ? in the first round v tyson he looked great but by round three he was flat footed and mixing it and coming off worse...a pattern he repeated in several fights.I am not an expert but he clearly didnt have the power to outmuscle the top guys.
someone said he wasnt mentally strong enough and often got drawn into the other guys fight style.

Sometimes it's just luck. In the Amateurs Tyrell had it. In the pros it ran out. Once you get over a level where everyone on a good day can beat anyone it's down to who was lucky enough to be at their best, lucky enough not to get injured, lucky enough to react the right way at the right time, lucky enough to not be rusty, lucky enough to have an excuse., etc, etc.

It is easier to just say it was down to not having his mind right, not being strong enough. or being drawn into the wrong kind of fight. It kind of is the short answer anyway so it is not entirely incorect.

I heard that there was a rush to get Tyrell to the title before he went off the rails, that was the excuse used as to why after only 15 fights or so he was kind of fast tracked. Maybe that is a good explanation, I don't know because sometimes a whole lot of growing up and maturing is put on hold that it is a justifiable excuse. He did have a long amateur career.

I think matchmaking has a lot to do with it. Like I say maybe there was justification for the way TYrell was matched because he had pedigree. However for all his talent a fighter needs to have absolutely mastered one level before moving onto the next. Biggs did seem to get himself into wars but he also seemed to get a lot of "live" fights. The balance has to be right whereby the prospect learns without putting miles on the Clock.
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Old 10-02-2013, 05:12 PM   #34
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

Thanks choklab...by 'live fights' do you mean fights where both guys have a real chance ?
Interesting to read your views once again.
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Old 10-03-2013, 09:59 AM   #35
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

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Seen most of Ty's fights...but this one not on youtube..anyone viewed it and how ?
Probably saw it on 'sportsnight' at the time but seems a lifetime ago....Quite how Tyrell lost that is beyond me..jab and move..the fight was made for him against a slow opponent.
Tyrell says he had a heavy cold and ran out of gas.
Sadly for a fit looking guy he often did ( run out of gas-ideas)
Anyway i 'll always be a fan of Tyrell's ...apart from all he is a real genuine bloke
thought he showed more courage than any other prime Tyson
opponent....anyway any idea how to watch this fight with Mason ?
Thanks...
I saw it at the RAH Biggs had pretty much fallen apart after Tyson crushed him. Against Mason he showed a few flashes of hand-speed and quick movement but as I remember Mason just walked through him. Here is a link to the fight,if it isnt as I described forgive me, it was a while ago .

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]


Biggs was on the gear by this time.
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Old 10-03-2013, 02:30 PM   #36
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

Thanks mcvey..very kind although someone posted it earlier in the thread..but many thanks for you taking the trouble...as you can tell ive read alot about Tyrell..interesting you say he was on drugs by then..he swears he has been clean since end of 1984..whst is your source of that info ? he seems to get alot of bad press about his lifestyle..it may be right ? i just think he took several hard fights close together Tyson Damiani Mason..then after a few lower grade wins Bowe ( his best effort IMO) then Lennox.Think he was very talented but lacked power.Mason didnt walk through him..i think Biggs would have outpointed him but failed through lack of fitness which was an own goal really.
Thanks again.
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Old 10-03-2013, 02:56 PM   #37
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

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Thanks mcvey..very kind although someone posted it earlier in the thread..but many thanks for you taking the trouble...as you can tell ive read alot about Tyrell..interesting you say he was on drugs by then..he swears he has been clean since end of 1984..whst is your source of that info ? he seems to get alot of bad press about his lifestyle..it may be right ? i just think he took several hard fights close together Tyson Damiani Mason..then after a few lower grade wins Bowe ( his best effort IMO) then Lennox.Think he was very talented but lacked power.Mason didnt walk through him..i think Biggs would have outpointed him but failed through lack of fitness which was an own goal really.
Thanks again.
I think the info came from the Duva camp.I liked Biggs he had skills and heart, but not enough power.
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Old 10-03-2013, 04:13 PM   #38
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

Totally agree...plus lack of stamina..which for a guy who didnt seem to come into fights overweight was puzzling. he always seemed to start fast and end up flat footed and trading blows by round three.
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Old 10-03-2013, 04:46 PM   #39
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

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He made a Gorilla type scream as he stepped back, and then Mason finished it.
Laughed out loud, in real life.
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Old 10-03-2013, 05:25 PM   #40
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

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Originally Posted by markclitheroe View Post
Thanks choklab...by 'live fights' do you mean fights where both guys have a real chance ?
Interesting to read your views once again.
Yes I would say so. To groom a fighter of potential to reach his full potential the match Making has to be perfect.

He has to master 6 rounds before 10 rounds and in doing so must learn from fighters good enough to offer resistance without creating life and death wars.

The advantage needs to be 80-20 for confidence then 70-30 to learn something. The real art is finding a match that looks 50-50 on paper but the ambitions of the opponent actually provide 70-30 because he is disadvantaged in size, age or preparation. His pedigree offer seasoning with less risk. Records can be misleading. Often managers sign the worst guy with the best record but this won't pan out since the record is often so bogus the opponent cannot offer anything. It dosnt pay to match a prospect against too many punchers.

I remember Biggs getting David Bey, renaldo snipes and Jeff simms and all three were trying hard to beat biggs. Knock him out in fact. Around the same time the best learning fights Tyson could get were Tillis, Mitch green and Jose Ribalta who offered less hellfire and punching power. They were not quite the dangermen that Biggs was getting.

I can remember Bey looking half hearted against joe bugner in Australia but going berserk against Biggs. Same with SNipes. He was a rough handfull too and wild man Simms was on a big win streak too. Some how the people behind the champions always seem to know what guy is going to turn up on the night. Maybe it's bad luck? All I know is these guys tried to kill Biggs and just went through the motions when booked elsewhere.
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Old 10-03-2013, 05:37 PM   #41
markclitheroe
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

You have great knowkedge of Tyrells career..didnt think anyone else would be bothered !
So from what you are saying..he was badly matched ?
I have always thought he fought a hell of an apprenticeship in those first 15 fights when he was unbeaten...maybe being an olympic gold winner sets your bar high ?
Funnily enough our own Anthony Joshua starts out this week..couldnt imagine a Snipes Bey Simm type fighter on his radar anytime soon..yes..on top of Tyson Damiani Mason Bowe Lewis..this is where i have been coming from...never seen a fighter matched so hard.Poor guy never had a chance to consolidate.
Thanks again..
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Old 10-04-2013, 02:25 AM   #42
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Default Re: Tyrell Biggs v Gary Mason

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Originally Posted by markclitheroe View Post
You have great knowkedge of Tyrells career..didnt think anyone else would be bothered !
So from what you are saying..he was badly matched ?
I have always thought he fought a hell of an apprenticeship in those first 15 fights when he was unbeaten...maybe being an olympic gold winner sets your bar high ?
Funnily enough our own Anthony Joshua starts out this week..couldnt imagine a Snipes Bey Simm type fighter on his radar anytime soon..yes..on top of Tyson Damiani Mason Bowe Lewis..this is where i have been coming from...never seen a fighter matched so hard.Poor guy never had a chance to consolidate.
Thanks again..
Yes matched fairly tough and unlucky most opponents "woke up" for him.
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Old 10-05-2013, 11:14 AM   #43
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Thanks choklab..think we have covered the subject now...will have to watch out for the documentary about Tyrell that is due out next year...thanks for all your feedback..much appreciated.
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