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Old 07-18-2014, 03:06 AM   #1
Nonito Smoak
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Default CRUISERWEIGHTS: Analyzing the best victories among the current champs

This thread is to discuss the best victories of the current Cruiserweight champions.

Any way you wish to do so is fine, but I would particularly like to see how you view the significance of the top wins and then how you think the titlists' resumes stack up against each other. Who has weak depth, which victories are underrated to you, which are overrated, which did you score tight or against them in, etc.
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Old 07-18-2014, 03:07 AM   #2
Nonito Smoak
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Default Re: CRUISERWEIGHTS: Analyzing the best victories among the current champs

I'll get the ball rolling...

Here is my opinion of the top victories of YPH, Cap'n Huck, Lebedev, and Diablo. Below each of them I have posed questions. Don't quote what you don't have to! Thanks. I would like to hear how people value performances.

-----

IBF Champion: Yoan Pablo Hernandez, 28-1 w/ 14 KO's
1. 2012 W UD12 Steve Cunningham II
2. 2011 W TD6 Steve Cunningham I
3. 2013 W KO10 Alexander Alekseev
4. 2009 W UD12 Enad Licina
2012 W UD12 Troy Ross

-He does have more notables, but any that are on this level?
-Absent from numbered above and worthy on name/ranking value is Troy Ross. Who did you think won the controversial fight with Ross and do you rank it if you scored against him?

WBO Champion: Marco Huck, 37-2-1 w/ 26 KO's
2013 W UD12 Ola Afolabi III
2009 W UD12 Ola Afolabi I
2009 W UD12 Victor Emilio Ramirez
2014 W TKO6 Firat Arslan II
2010 W SD12 Denis Lebedev

-How would you rank them? I find his terribly hard to properly value.
-Afolabi trilogy and Lebedev fight... Opinions?

WBA Champion: Denis Lebedev, 25-2 w/ 19 KO's
1. 2009 W TKO3 Enzo Maccarinelli
2. 2010 W KO2 Alexander Alekseev
3. 2009 W RTD6 Ali Ismailov
2011 W UD12 James Toney / 2011 W KO10 Roy Jones Jr.
2012 W KO2 Shawn Cox / 2012 W KO4 Santader Silgado

-Which should make it into his "top 5," the 2011 washed up superstars or the 2012 'got to boxrec' guys? (no disrespect)
-How much of your viewing of Lebedev comes from his usually-disagreed-with defeat to Marco Huck?

WBC Champion: Krzyszytof Wlodarczyk, 49-2-1 w/ 35 KO's
1. 2006 W SD12 Steve Cunningham I
2. 2010 W TKO8 Giacobbe Fragomeni II
3. 2013 W TKO8 Rakhim Chakhkiev
4. 2013 W RTD6 Giacobbe Fragomeni III
5. 2011 W TKO11 Danny Green

-Does this list underrate Green? Overrate either Chakhkiev or Fragomeni?
-Does Wlodarczyk have the best current top 5-ish victories of the four titlists?
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Old 07-18-2014, 08:56 AM   #3
Koba
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Default Re: CRUISERWEIGHTS: Analyzing the best victories among the current champs

Good thread NS.

Cruiser is a division which finds it hard to gain a lot of attention almost inevitably being seen as a 'poor man's HW' but there is some decent fighters in there. I'm going out shortly but will try and come back to thread later and break it down a bit better.

In brief though IMO JPH is the most talented amongst the CW titlists, though H2H I'd probably favour Huck over any of the others and Wlod may well have the best resume. Lebedev is undeniably tough and a heavy hitter, but the most limited of the bunch in terms of his skillset IMO.

Then of course there's a few of the semi-decent LHWs moving up in the wake of Stevenson and Kovalevs massacre of the LHW division in 2013 - Bellew, Cleverly and Sillakh (who had basically already made the transition before sliding back down to 175 for the Kovalev fight).

I'm not expecting great things of any of these guys - though Sillakh still has a remarkable talent and may do OK if he can grow a really thick beard and get double-glazing installed.

Then there's the two Africans Mchunu and Makabu (who I'd dearly love to see fight each other - the defensive wizard vs the unstoppable banger) who I think give problems to anyone in the division.

Anyways - gotta go.
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Old 07-18-2014, 12:17 PM   #4
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Default Re: CRUISERWEIGHTS: Analyzing the best victories among the current champs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Koba View Post
Good thread NS.

Cruiser is a division which finds it hard to gain a lot of attention almost inevitably being seen as a 'poor man's HW' but there is some decent fighters in there. I'm going out shortly but will try and come back to thread later and break it down a bit better.

In brief though IMO JPH is the most talented amongst the CW titlists, though H2H I'd probably favour Huck over any of the others and Wlod may well have the best resume. Lebedev is undeniably tough and a heavy hitter, but the most limited of the bunch in terms of his skillset IMO.

Then of course there's a few of the semi-decent LHWs moving up in the wake of Stevenson and Kovalevs massacre of the LHW division in 2013 - Bellew, Cleverly and Sillakh (who had basically already made the transition before sliding back down to 175 for the Kovalev fight).

I'm not expecting great things of any of these guys - though Sillakh still has a remarkable talent and may do OK if he can grow a really thick beard and get double-glazing installed.

Then there's the two Africans Mchunu and Makabu (who I'd dearly love to see fight each other - the defensive wizard vs the unstoppable banger) who I think give problems to anyone in the division.

Anyways - gotta go.
Thanks. I too will return to give my opinion on what you've said.
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Old 07-18-2014, 01:17 PM   #5
Joejr
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Default Re: CRUISERWEIGHTS: Analyzing the best victories among the current champs

Usyk murders them all
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Old 07-18-2014, 01:25 PM   #6
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Default Re: CRUISERWEIGHTS: Analyzing the best victories among the current champs

Diablo has the best top-five grouping of victories, if you disregard Huck's official victory over Lebedev. Otherwise, Huck does.

Hernandez has the best pair of names beaten (Cunningham x2 and Ross) and best three victories.

Lebedev is probably the best h2h of the four, with the weakest resume. (Silgado pretty is underrated though - he gave a decent enough showing against Chakhkiev despite being overweight and on short notice, even though he lost clear & wide...)

So really depending on your criteria and preferences you could shuffle them around in any order and make a supportable case for it.
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Old 07-18-2014, 01:39 PM   #7
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Default Re: CRUISERWEIGHTS: Analyzing the best victories among the current champs

Good thread.

CW doesnt get enough attention IMO, b/c the 4 titlists just arent active enough.

JPH....5 fights in 3 1/2 yrs+
Next fighting 2X Huck victim, 44 yo Firat Arslan

Huck....8 fights in 3 1/2 yrs. To his credit, they have been against excellent competition and many of his fights are razor thin wars.
Next up....decent undefeated contender, Mirko Larghetti.


Wlod....5 fights in 4 yrs and still nothing scheduled. Does have the best and most decisive wins over that period, Chakkiev KO, Frago beatdown, and Green stoppage.

Ledbedev.....5 fights in 3 1/2 yrs. To his credit, he has tried to make solid fights last 2 times out, but picking on shot Jones and the ole rugged JLOT are not impressive wins, and you had a feeling that Toney was gonna CP KO him. Ledbedev looked afraid of JLOT. Still nothing scheduled after G. Jones once again used banned diuretics to make weight.

Of the 4, JPH is the most talented/gifted. Ledbedev has the most heart, Huck the best chin, and Wlod the best resume.

Now, while I'd love to see Huck vs Ledbedev 2, I'd rather see Marco move up to HW where his speed and power, without worrying bout going back down, would carry him to the top 10 without question.

Wlod needs to get fighting or drop his title. There are plenty of newcomers like Mchunu, Mackabu, Cleverly, Bellew, Chakkiev etc who would be glad to represent and defend the WBC CW title more than every 18 months.

Ledbedev needs to avoid Don King like the plaque. Jones started his career as a WW FFS......and here he is at 40 y/o and cant make 200 without cheating......the guy pisses out blues and reds and shiits out speckled eggs. His @sscheeks probably resemble a pin cushion from all the injections. Denis Ledbedev needs to move on from that loss and get to fighting the top talent, not another OLD ROID CHEAT. (RJJ/JLOT/GJ) Fight a few clean Euros or UK fighters....hell, call on Ola....at least he's clean and will give ya a fight.

JPH....a 6'4 SP Cuban with power and defense. WTF is he doing at 200-........he needs to get with a strength and conditioning coach, and follow USS and Huck up to HW.

Of any of the current CW titlists, I'd give him the best shot at beating Wlad. Yet he seems totally content to linger S of HW fighting Huck leftovers.
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