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Old 12-23-2008, 03:06 PM   #31
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

No, Brazil would be back with the rest of the pack, or behind actually. Which fits in with your "point", if we take Calzaghe's best wins away he's the same as Erdei and Ottke

Yeah...congratulations on this incisive comment...but he has those wins. Calzaghe was an undisputed champion, they never were. Calzaghe is a two weight champion, they never were. Calzaghe has the wins over Kessler, Lacy and Hopkins, they don't. Maybe you can see where you are going wrong.

You never actually had a legit point. It was based on taking away wins, which is the biggest sack of shit as far as trying to discredit somebody. In your imaginary world things must be great.
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Old 12-23-2008, 03:10 PM   #32
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

I was highlighting the fact that Calzaghe's resume lacks any real depth in top quality, and is only 2 wins from that of other boxers ie Ottke, Erdie, DariosZ, Dutchboy sam etc etc. Those two wins are not that outstanding either. That is a perfectly valid point to make.
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Old 12-23-2008, 03:16 PM   #33
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

It still doesn't even make sense, when you take away those wins you take away being an undisputed champion which is a career achievement and counts for more than just a win.

It's a completely pointless thing to start taking wins away to make points. Perhaps you can take away a few and I'll add a few make believe wins.

Take the resumes as they are. It's far more logical and sane. Any depth or lack of it will be self evident when you look at the real world resume, not the JonOli "I wish the resume looked like this" resume.
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Old 12-23-2008, 03:24 PM   #34
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

Rubbish. I never took anything away, I took them as they are, and credited the wins separately (as a whole). I was simply breaking his resume down. I stand by my original statement. It highlights the lack of depth and is a perfectly valid point to make. I'm just sorry you are unable to see it.
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Old 12-23-2008, 03:29 PM   #35
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

I'm able to see real world resumes. I think I might have to call you Cole, after the little boy in "The Sixth Sense". Do the imaginary people tell you about these fake resumes?

Why its so difficult to be able to look at how many good wins and come to a conclusion on the depth without taking wins away and then comparing the new fake resume to others...well its one of lifes mysteries for sure.
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Old 12-23-2008, 03:35 PM   #36
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

I'm not taking anything away, but it is you who appears to want to wipe 95% of Calzaghe's resume, and not debate or discuss it. I have credited his best wins, and then gone on to look at the rest of his resume.
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Old 12-23-2008, 03:40 PM   #37
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

You hardly credited him with anything. You took his best wins (and achievements) away from him and then tried to compare and contrast it against lesser fighters. I wouldn't like to see you when you are discrediting

I don't mind talking about any of Calzaghe's resume, although its got past the point where I care to do it as much as I did. When Calzaghe's good wins, decent wins etc are totaled up I'm pretty aware the rest of it isn't so good considering he has 46 fights. I don't need to make a disingenous point to prove that, its fairly evident.
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Old 12-23-2008, 03:54 PM   #38
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

I've just tried Jonoli's technique of taking best wins off a resume, how does Hatton's look to you Jonoli, with a few wins taken off?
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Old 12-23-2008, 04:04 PM   #39
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

I don't think Hattons resume is all that great, and besides he doesn't make the top four greatest British boxers ever off the back of it.

*and I know it's not purely based on resume, but I bet the author has placed a lot of value in that 0*
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Old 12-23-2008, 04:08 PM   #40
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

*and I know it's not purely based on resume, but I bet the author has placed a lot of value in that 0*[/quote]

So he should
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Old 12-23-2008, 04:08 PM   #41
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

Go easy on your mums Christmas sherry, lads.
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Old 12-23-2008, 04:12 PM   #42
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

Quote:
*and I know it's not purely based on resume, but I bet the author has placed a lot of value in that 0*

So he should
Not really.

It's not hard to build a padded record like Calzaghe's.
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Old 12-23-2008, 04:14 PM   #43
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonOli View Post
I just don't get the Calzaghe thing. He has a resume with is more or less replicated by many, many, average to good boxers (Ottke, Erdie, Darios etc etc) with a win over Kessler (still unproven at the top), and a recently twice beaten 43 year old Hopkins nailed on the end. How on earth does that make you the fourth Greatest Brit ever well ahead of Lewis.

This isn't an official list by Ring anyway, it's just one blokes Ring blog.

At the peak of his achievments now Calzaghe is only rated as no3 in the world (4 if you count Floyd). No way is thar far ahead of Lewis, imo. Swap him and Lennox and the list starts to look a bit better, imho.

What was the highest P4P ranking that Lewis ever achieved? Was he ever in the top 5. Not that P4P rakning really matter, Lewis has a superior recored and names/performances than JC and does deserve a higher placing.

Lewis is the best modern Brit.
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Old 12-23-2008, 04:27 PM   #44
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

HW always get ranked poorly in p4p lists, but you are right it's not that relevant. I was just pointing out really that it's not that great if the man who is currently ranked the 4th best (if you count Floyd) in the world, is our 4th Greatest ever fighter. It doesn't say a huge amount for British boxing.

I agree with you anyway though, I think Lewis is the best modern day Brit. If people think Calzaghe ranks higher, then fair enough, everyone has a different opinion.
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Old 12-23-2008, 04:38 PM   #45
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Default Re: From Ring mag website: 10 greatest British fighters of all time

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Originally Posted by onourway View Post
Not really.

It's not hard to build a padded record like Calzaghe's.

I would have thought it is very hard to fight that many fights over that length of time and still not lose a single one.
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