My top 10 Heavyweights

[cross_trainer]

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. John L. Sullivan
4. James J. Jeffries
5. Tom Cribb
6. Lennox Lewis
7. Max Schmeling
8. Mike Tyson
9. Tom Johnson
10. Jem Mace


This was very difficult. Period 1750-2007, excluding the pioneers like Broughton. Rated according to accomplishments in their own era.

[hopkinsfan07]

Originally Posted by McGrain

Well, you'd actually find it earlier in this thread, but as you ask (any excuse)

1) Ali
2) Louis
3) Liston
4) Johnson
5) Lewis
6) Jeffries
7) Frazier
Holmes
9) Hollyfield
10) Tyson
----------------
11) Foreman
12) Dempsey
13) Marciano

I do have a habit of changing things around.

Nice avatar man.

good list im glad you rate Liston and Lewis high most i fell underate them i have Marciano 11th and Dempsey 13th so are lists are very close only thing i am against is were you place Holmes but still great list

[McGrain]

Originally Posted by cross_trainer

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. John L. Sullivan
4. James J. Jeffries
5. Tom Cribb
6. Lennox Lewis
7. Max Schmeling
8. Mike Tyson
9. Tom Johnson
10. Jem Mace


This was very difficult. Period 1750-2007, excluding the pioneers like Broughton. Rated according to accomplishments in their own era.

Very good, brave list.

I'm chasing these guys now, got that Bare Fists for starters. He references The Illiad in the new Intro, I love that fight.

[cross_trainer]

Queensberry only:

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. James J. Jeffries
4. Lennox Lewis
5. Max Schmeling
6. Mike Tyson
7. Larry Holmes
8. Rocky Marciano
9. Jack Johnson
10. Jack Dempsey

[TBooze]

Originally Posted by cross_trainer

9. Tom Johnson

Sure he came up short against Naseem, but you still take him to beat Foreman!!!













Come on mate, play the game, we know you are darn good, but we are talking Queensberry Rules...

[McGrain]

Originally Posted by hopkinsfan07

good list im glad you rate Liston and Lewis high most i fell underate them i have Marciano 11th and Dempsey 13th do are lists are very close only thing i am against is were you place Holmes but still great list

Yes; our lists are pretty similair. Holmes' position is problematic - but shuffling 6-11 is tough for me, they move a lot. Holmes is on a down Tyson is on the up just now.

If you want to see my Middlweight top ten it's in my Charley Burley and Bernard Hopkins thread a bit further down the page.

[McGrain]

Originally Posted by cross_trainer

Queensberry only:

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. James J. Jeffries
4. Lennox Lewis
5. Max Schmeling
6. Mike Tyson
7. Larry Holmes
8. Rocky Marciano
9. Jack Johnson
10. Jack Dempsey

Another good one - let's hear about Schmeling's high placement (I have him at 15).

Jeffreis above Johnson?

[McGrain]

Originally Posted by Sweet Pea

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Lewis
4. Holmes
5. Johnson
6. Foreman
7. Tyson
8. Dempsey
9. Liston
10. Marciano
11. Frazier
12. Holyfield
13. Jeffries

I am questioning whether Rock is top 10 or not. I have him anywhere between 6 and 12 honestly.

Personally I can't see the rock anywhere in that list but at the bottom. It's a nice one though. I'd always see Jeffries above some of these guys, too.

[hopkinsfan07]

Originally Posted by cross_trainer

Queensberry only:

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. James J. Jeffries
4. Lennox Lewis
5. Max Schmeling
6. Mike Tyson
7. Larry Holmes
8. Rocky Marciano
9. Jack Johnson
10. Jack Dempsey

Schmeling in 5th what are your reasons for this i had him at 17th in my list of 20

[cross_trainer]

Originally Posted by hopkinsfan07

Schmeling in 5th what are your reasons for this i had him at 17th in my list of 20

This is the one I expected some problems with.

Schmeling probably should have won the second Sharkey fight--he certainly was the more effective fighter--remained a pretty good champion during his reign, and holds the single greatest win in heavyweight history over anyone (prime or near prime Joe Louis). It outranks Joe Frazier's win over Ali by a slight margin. Great counterpuncher as well.

He was, moreover, prevented from facing Braddock, which he had a right to, and probably would have won.

(Come to think of it, Frazier should rank higher based on this criteria as well).

[cross_trainer]

Originally Posted by TBooze

Sure he came up short against Naseem, but you still take him to beat Foreman!!!













Come on mate, play the game, we know you are darn good, but we are talking Queensberry Rules...

That's why I gave you two lists.

I rate Hamed as #4 on my heavyweight list for defeating Johnson, by the way. It's just that he's invisible.

[TBooze]

I think it is time In put this debate to rest

My top 40

40: Cleveland Williams
39: Zora Foley
38: Tommy Burns
37: Michael Spinks
36: James Douglas
35: James Braddock
34: George Godfrey
33: Jimmy Bivens
32: Max Baer
31: Jerry Quarry
30: Tim Whitherspoon
29: Bob Fitzsimmons
28: Jack Sharkey
27: Sam McVey
26: Joe Jeanette
25: Vitali Klitschko
24: Peter Jackson
23: Ken Norton
22: Joe Walcott (Jersey)
21: Gene Tunney
20: Riddick Bowe
19: Floyd Patterson
18: Max Schmeling
17: Ezzard Charles
16: Sammy Langford
15: Harry Wills
14: James Corbett
13: Sonny Liston
12: Joe Frazier
11: Mike Tyson
10: Lennox Lewis
9 James Jeffries
8: Jack Dempsey
7: Rocky Marciano
6: Evander Holyfield
5: Larry Holmes
4: Jack Johnson
3: George Foreman
2: Joe Louis
1: Muhammad Ali

[cross_trainer]

Originally Posted by TBooze

I think it is time In put this debate to rest

My top 40

40: Cleveland Williams
39: Zora Foley
38: Tommy Burns
37: Michael Spinks
36: James Douglas
35: James Braddock
34: George Godfrey
33: Jimmy Bivens
32: Max Baer
31: Jerry Quarry
30: Tim Whitherspoon
29: Bob Fitzsimmons
28: Jack Sharkey
27: Sam McVey
26: Joe Jeanette
25: Vitali Klitschko
24: Peter Jackson
23: Ken Norton
22: Joe Walcott (Jersey)
21: Gene Tunney
20: Riddick Bowe
19: Floyd Patterson
18: Max Schmeling
17: Ezzard Charles
16: Sammy Langford
15: Harry Wills
14: James Corbett
13: Sonny Liston
12: Joe Frazier
11: Mike Tyson
10: Lennox Lewis
9 James Jeffries
8: Jack Dempsey
7: Rocky Marciano
6: Evander Holyfield
5: Larry Holmes
4: Jack Johnson
3: George Foreman
2: Joe Louis
1: Muhammad Ali

Good list.

[McGrain]

Originally Posted by cross_trainer

This is the one I expected some problems with.

Schmeling probably should have won the second Sharkey fight--he certainly was the more effective fighter--remained a pretty good champion during his reign, and holds the single greatest win in heavyweight history over anyone (prime or near prime Joe Louis). It outranks Joe Frazier's win over Ali by a slight margin. Great counterpuncher as well.

He was, moreover, prevented from facing Braddock, which he had a right to, and probably would have won.

Interesting and ferocious logic.

Problem is, every other guy on the list would hand Schmeling his head 9/10. Secondly, i feel you're overating the version of Louis that Schmeling beat. But if you're happy with near peak, I am too.

I think the Ali Frazier beat was a better fighter. Louis is THE example of a fighter who was better as soon as he got that belt around his waste.

Agree that Schmeling should've got his shot, and would have been favourite.

[TBooze]

Originally Posted by cross_trainer

That's why I gave you two lists.

I rate Hamed as #4 on my heavyweight list for defeating Johnson, by the way. It's just that he's invisible.

Excuse my language but f*** you, we both know Naseem is pick'em against Ali.

Sure some will say I said this because of the bubbles in my head, others will point out the three bottles of wine I have had this evening, but we know I have a point!