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Old 01-01-2009, 01:45 PM   #1
brown bomber
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Default The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

I think that a linear heavyweight Champion is key to keeping the sport alive. We have had a huge period of inactivity with this title... Thus the heavyweight boredness we are experiancing....

Louis beats Braddock
Louis retires
Charles beats Walcott
Walcott beats Charles
Marciano beats Walcott
Marciano retires
.....
Patterson beats Moore
Liston beats Patterson
Ali beats Liston
Frazier beats Ali
Foreman beats Frazier
Ali beats Frazier
Spinks beats Ali
Ali beats Spinks
Ali retires
.......
Holmes beats Norton
Spinks beats Holmes
Tyson beats Spinks
Douglas beats Tyson
Holyfield beats Douglas
Bowe beats Holyfield
Holy beats Bowe
Moorer beats Holy
Foreman beats Moorer
Briggs beats Foreman
Lewis beats Briggs
Rahman beats Lewis
Lewis beats Rahman
Lewis Retires...

Does the Haye Vs Klitchko fight mark the crowining of THE LINEAR champ or woud the winner need to beat Vlad?

Thoughts?
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Old 01-01-2009, 01:48 PM   #2
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

If Haye beats Vit then I'd crown the winner of him or Wlad linear. If Vit beats Haye then we're back to square one because Vit vs. Wlad will never happen.
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Old 01-01-2009, 01:50 PM   #3
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

We need David Haye to win for the good of boxing.

I agree entirely with the sentiments of Gaz, if Haye beats Vitali a fight between himself and Wlad would determine the new lineal Champion at HW.

If Vitali and Wlad went at it right now it would determine this....but they never will.

Therefore, we need Haye to defeat Vitali to set up this mega fight with Wlad!

Support David Haye for the good of boxing damn it!
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Old 01-01-2009, 01:54 PM   #4
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

It's weird, The Ring Heavyweight strap has been vacant for a while, and will probably remain so while Wlad & Vitali are 1 & 2

They should throw it in the mix for ether Wlad-Arreola or Vitali-Haye

I'd definitely say the winner of the latter is the linear Heavyweght Champ, but it won't be as clear-cut as it should be.
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Old 01-01-2009, 01:59 PM   #5
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

I argued that Vitali was the linear champ after beating Sanders...
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Old 01-01-2009, 02:03 PM   #6
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff thomas View Post
I argued that Vitali was the linear champ after beating Sanders...
There was an argument for that at the time...and people forget that. However, I personally felt that guys like Byrd and Ruiz had achieved too much not to be factored into the reckoning and that Vitali had to go through them first to fully gain recognition.

Things are different now of course, with Wlad now having two of the belts and Vitali having another.

If Haye and Wlad fight, 3 of the belts are suddenly held by one guy...the claim becomes too strong, they would be the legitimate 'man' in the division.
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Old 01-01-2009, 02:04 PM   #7
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

'Linear title' doesn't mean anything if it's just a case of everyone picking their own champion based on subjective opinions.

Unifying the three major belts should be the objective test for establishing a new lineage.
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Old 01-01-2009, 02:09 PM   #8
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

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Originally Posted by Cobbler View Post
'Linear title' doesn't mean anything if it's just a case of everyone picking their own champion based on subjective opinions.

Unifying the three major belts should be the objective test for establishing a new lineage.
In the past I wouldn't have agreed but we've never had this situation before so I think you right.
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Old 01-01-2009, 02:13 PM   #9
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff thomas View Post
I argued that Vitali was the linear champ after beating Sanders...

Yep, you could make that case but I don't think at the time the winner of the Wlad/ Sanders/ Vit series had a solid enough claim. Looking back at how results have panned out since it would have made sense but you don't have the benefit of that at the time.
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Old 01-01-2009, 02:58 PM   #10
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff thomas View Post
I argued that Vitali was the linear champ after beating Sanders...
The irony is that he probably had a more sturdy claim than Marvin Hart did.

The heavyweight lineage as it is generaly acepted is ridled with inconsistencies.
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Old 01-01-2009, 03:00 PM   #11
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

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Originally Posted by janitor View Post
The irony is that he probably had a more sturdy claim than Marvin Hart did.

The heavyweight lineage as it is generaly acepted is ridled with inconsistencies.
Seems like unification is the only answer.... would you include valuev in the mix?
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Old 01-01-2009, 03:19 PM   #12
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

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Originally Posted by jeff thomas View Post
Seems like unification is the only answer.... would you include valuev in the mix?
I think that the Klitschko brothers are so far ahead of the rest of the field that if they fought the winner would have to be recognised as the lineal champion. Unfortunately they will never do this.

I think that Wladamir Klitschko leads the field so clearly that anybody who beat him would have a fair claim.

What I have learned from boxing history is that lineage depends on public acceptance more than anyting else. There is no consistency to how lineage has been reestablished historicaly. Whenever the champion retires there are always a number of title claims put forward by diferent contenders and most sink without trace. If the public buys it then it makes it into the history books.
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Old 01-01-2009, 03:20 PM   #13
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff thomas View Post
Spinks beats Ali
Ali beats Spinks
Ali retires
.......
Holmes beats Norton
This part is an example of how the linear title is devalued if not subject to an objective test.

Holmes beat Norton before Ali retired, for a title that Spinks had held and vacated to fight Ali.
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Old 01-01-2009, 03:30 PM   #14
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobbler View Post
This part is an example of how the linear title is devalued if not subject to an objective test.

Holmes beat Norton before Ali retired, for a title that Spinks had held and vacated to fight Ali.
But Holmes beat the returning Ali as well.
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Old 01-01-2009, 03:36 PM   #15
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Default Re: The Linear Heavyweight title: What next?

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But Holmes beat the returning Ali as well.
That was more than two years later.
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