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Old 08-13-2007, 09:49 PM   #1
quintonjacksonfan
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Default What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

For me it's Haglers win over Hearns. I think if those two never fought Haglers all-tme P4P ranking would be somewhere in between 35-40 instead of 20-25. I think that one fight bumped him up 15 spots in the all-time p4p rankings.
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Old 08-13-2007, 09:53 PM   #2
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Norton's one (Two wins really) against Ali, though Norton isn't too terribly high in a P4P sense to begin with.

Foreman's comeback in general was the sole thing that made him an ATG, his victory over Moorer in particular. Besides that, there was losses to a lot of the best fighters he ever faced... Ali, Morrison, Holyfield, Young and the Briggs blemish. After his first retirement he definitely wasn't viewed like he would be at the end of his second career.
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Old 08-14-2007, 04:27 AM   #3
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Aaron Pryor takes on almost mythical proportions for some with his win over Arguello.
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Old 08-14-2007, 04:44 AM   #4
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

I suspect Louis' victory over Schmeling turned him from a very good fighter into a great and truly great American icon.
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Old 08-14-2007, 04:55 AM   #5
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Quote:
Originally Posted by tobkhan
It´s the same the other way around. Schmeling´s victory over Louis is a legend over here.
Louis built on the Schmeling win, Max was maybe unlucky to not get the Braddock fight, but was never the same fighter post LouisI.

Schmeling no doubt is an icon in Germany, but overall he was no Louis, in the ring anyway. It is a bit like us in Britain worshipping Sir 'enry and Bomber Bruno; two so so fighters who were icons of their era in our country.
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Old 08-14-2007, 04:56 AM   #6
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Quote:
Originally Posted by tobkhan
Itīs the same the other way around. Schmelingīs victory over Louis is a legend over here.
I would have to say this would be my pick.

How to leave Schmeling of a serious list of the best 20 heavyweights ever?

Doing so would be more than permisable if he didn't have that near-peak Louis victory.
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Old 08-14-2007, 05:07 AM   #7
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Lewis's win over a shot Tyson did wonders for his reputation.
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Old 08-14-2007, 05:09 AM   #8
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Quote:
Originally Posted by tobkhan
Well, even without the Louis victory was Schmeling a pretty solid hw and at least a top30 one.
I think you have some work to do to get him into the top 30 without the proof that comes with the victory over a top 2 ATG though.

Quote:
But Schmeling isnīt only an icon because of his boxing but also because of the thing he did outside the ring.
Expand on that?
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Old 08-14-2007, 05:10 AM   #9
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Quote:
Originally Posted by tobkhan
Well, even without the Louis victory was Schmeling a pretty solid hw and at least a top30 one. The Louis victor rises his stock. But Schmeling isnīt only an icon because of his boxing but also because of the thing he did outside the ring.
Yes, that is why he is a big icon in Germany.

Louis is huge because he won the most important fight in boxing history (the Schmeling rematch) and became an a huge icon for America (in a political sense) and perhaps more importantly in the long run, a huge icon for his race and the fight they would have over the next 30 or so years.
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Old 08-14-2007, 05:17 AM   #10
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Lamotta's one win over SRR.
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Old 08-14-2007, 05:46 AM   #11
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Quote:
Originally Posted by tobkhan
Well, became an icon through the Louisīwin, that canīt be denied but his actions outside the ring helped him to stay one and even made him a bigger one. During and shortly after WW2 he was admired for giving up boxing and the live coming by with him beeing a celebrity and joining the armed forces to fight for his country, also for the wrong ideals. After WW2 when the story of him standing to his jewish manager and chechen wife against the pressure of the Nazi regime spread his stock rised again. The story of him hiding and helping to smuggle out two jewish kids during the "Kristallnacht" made him a hero. After WW2 he became very rich because he was the the main distributer of Coca Cola and used his money to help victims of WW2. He also helped out Joe Louis when he had financial problems and finally paid for his funeral.
I think the becoming rich after WW2 is a big part of it. He almost became a sort of symbol for your reconstruction, no?

Max was a good man, no doubt.
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Old 08-14-2007, 01:57 PM   #12
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Tarver over Jones
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Old 08-14-2007, 02:11 PM   #13
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Ironically, it's a couple of defeats which I consider when addressing this. What Duran did against Hagler was astonishing at the time. Check out the footage of Duran against DeJesus, or any other lightweight opponent. Then check out Hagler destroying Sibson, Scypion or Obelmejias. Could Duran have reasonably been expected to have a lead on Hagler after 12, or go the 15 round distance without first hitting the dirt?

Robinson's dominant performance against Maxim is also a remarkable display. Robby had that bout won. Maxim only took three of the 13 rounds contested, and this was a boxer who competed in the HW division through most of his career. He held wins over Jimmy Bivins and Jersey Joe Walcott, and would go on to hand Floyd Patterson his first professional loss. A past peak SRR was schooling him while boxing as a middleweight.

Mentioning Duran again, what he did to Barkley at the age he did it is incredible. Remember, Barkley would go on to kayo and retire Coetzee. (Hmmm....here's a thought. Duran at 126 against Coetzee at 250. Does the teenager who knocked out Marcel dump the bionic hand on his butt?)
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Old 08-14-2007, 02:38 PM   #14
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Harada reaming Jofre.
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Old 08-14-2007, 03:28 PM   #15
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Default Re: What one fight raised a fighters all-time P4P rankings the most

Billy Conn's first fight against Joe Louis.

He has some solid wins on his resume, but I think he'd be largely forgotten if not for the legendary performance against Joe. All of the watching and re-watching of that fight is what has most fans ready to argue with anyone who leaves Conn out of the discussion for top five all-time at light-heavy.
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