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View Poll Results: If they all fought each other who has the best chance of walking out undefeated
Mike Tyson 17 33.33%
Evander Holyfield 3 5.88%
Riddick Bowe 1 1.96%
Lennox Lewis 30 58.82%
Voters: 51. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-20-2007, 08:48 PM   #1
ironchamp
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Default Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

At thier absolute best who has the best chance of coming out undefeated (if thats even possible) assuming they all fought each other in a tournament.
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Old 08-20-2007, 08:52 PM   #2
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

Not Holyfield, that's for sure.
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Old 08-20-2007, 09:37 PM   #3
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

id say Lennox Lewis because he did beat all of them at one point and in primes i still think he would beat them all
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Old 08-20-2007, 09:47 PM   #4
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

I don't think any of them would walk out of a tournament against each other in their prime unblemished. Bowe lost to Holyfield and beat him twice, so that excludes both of those guys. Lewis drew with a very past prime Holyfield and was beaten by Mccall and Rahman, therefore we can scratch him off the list as being invincible. Tyson was probably the most impressive during the hay day of his reign, but who knows if the Mike who fought Berbick is going show up, or the one who fought Douglas.
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Old 08-20-2007, 10:12 PM   #5
ironchamp
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

Looks like Tyson and Lewis seem to be the consensus.
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Old 08-20-2007, 10:30 PM   #6
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

Quote:
Originally Posted by hopkinsfan07
id say Lennox Lewis because he did beat all of them at one point and in primes i still think he would beat them all
That is sound reasoning. I can't object to your choice but here is my thinking...

NOT Riddick Bowe because I think Lewis would likely beat him, Tyson would be the favorite, and Holy could go either way.

NOT Mike Tyson (sigh) because Holyfield would beat him.

It's between Lewis & Holy. I'm gonna go with Holy, here is why. Although Lewis would beat more of the other ATGs (incidentally maybe not with just Tyson & Bowe) from Dempsey to Holmes, head to head, I actually pick a young Holyfield to outwork and outpoint a prime Lewis (any version). His speed, reflexes, youthful resilience, prime boxing skills, etc would allow him to deal with the bigger and more powerful Lewis IMO.

Lewis is 60/40 against Tyson; 70/30 against Bowe; 30-70 against Holy; Holy is 50/50 against Bowe; 70/30 against Tyson; 70-30 against Lewis

As you can see, Holy wins marginally. I don't pick Lewis because I think Holy beats him and Tyson has a real good shot.
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Old 08-20-2007, 10:43 PM   #7
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

Intersting tourament...what a treat it would be...all in their primes. Ok, my 2 sents...Tyson has the msot natural talent, foot speed, hand speed and leverage from which his power was crafted, defensive head movement, chin, desire (prime), conditioning, determination...so I would take him if pressed but every fighter has their Achilles heal..so, here is what I say,,remember PRIME:

Tyson can clearly beat everyone except Holyfield, whose style would/could present problems (or make him look foolish..the thought "if Bert Cooper could" comes to mind)

Holyfield can beat everyone except Bowe who is a stylistic problem

Bowe can beat everyone accept Tyson

Lewis, despite his deep talent, lacked agression and the killer instinc when faced with pressure..so although he may be the best technical fighter of the bunch (well, may being the operative word) he would be the weakest link of the tourney
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Old 08-20-2007, 10:46 PM   #8
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

Quote:
Originally Posted by hobgoblin
That is sound reasoning. I can't object to your choice but here is my thinking...

NOT Riddick Bowe because I think Lewis would likely beat him, Tyson would be the favorite, and Holy could go either way.

NOT Mike Tyson (sigh) because Holyfield would beat him.

It's between Lewis & Holy. I'm gonna go with Holy, here is why. Although Lewis would beat more of the other ATGs (incidentally maybe not with just Tyson & Bowe) from Dempsey to Holmes, head to head, I actually pick a young Holyfield to outwork and outpoint a prime Lewis (any version). His speed, reflexes, youthful resilience, prime boxing skills, etc would allow him to deal with the bigger and more powerful Lewis IMO.

Lewis is 60/40 against Tyson; 70/30 against Bowe; 30-70 against Holy; Holy is 50/50 against Bowe; 70/30 against Tyson; 70-30 against Lewis

As you can see, Holy wins marginally. I don't pick Lewis because I think Holy beats him and Tyson has a real good shot.
Interesting analysis...

Truthfully I think

Bowe beats Holyfield but loses to Tyson and Lewis

Lewis beats Bowe but gets stopped by Tyson and loses a razor thin decision to Holyfield. I am one to believe that Holyfield would have always struggled with Lewis. Though a young version had the workrate to pull it off.

Holyfield barely beats Lewis, loses to Bowe and loses to Tyson as well. I believe that Holyfield aged much better than Mike and as a result was able to beat Mike via smarts.

I think Tyson beats them all but I welcome disagreements.
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Old 08-20-2007, 10:51 PM   #9
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

I respect your opinion....well thought out...however, i see Lewis as the weak link...an agressive Holyfeild could tame him, and Tyson as the strong player, especially focussed and properly trained, only Holyfeild can frustrate him potentially...but..yes..Holy aged better than Mike, and had a great fight plan versus an overconfident, head hunting Tyson...
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Old 08-20-2007, 10:55 PM   #10
ironchamp
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

Quote:
Originally Posted by carll68
I respect your opinion....well thought out...however, i see Lewis as the weak link...an agressive Holyfeild could tame him, and Tyson as the strong player, especially focussed and properly trained, only Holyfeild can frustrate him potentially...but..yes..Holy aged better than Mike, and had a great fight plan versus an overconfident, head hunting Tyson...
Incidentally who did you vote for?
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Old 08-20-2007, 11:02 PM   #11
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

Quote:
Originally Posted by carll68
I respect your opinion....well thought out...however, i see Lewis as the weak link...an agressive Holyfeild could tame him, and Tyson as the strong player, especially focussed and properly trained, only Holyfeild can frustrate him potentially...but..yes..Holy aged better than Mike, and had a great fight plan versus an overconfident, head hunting Tyson...
Exactly. And given that guys like McCall and Rahman blew him out early, it's hard to imagine that at least one of these guys in their primes wouldn't knock him out. In fact, I think they all would.
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Old 08-20-2007, 11:04 PM   #12
carll68
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

I voted for Tyson....with confidence, although Holy would/could pose problems.. the jab and mover was not really the way to beat Tyson as many think a la Tillis and the Anomoly that was Douglas...who fought a tremendous fight against a unprepared Tyson......Conversally, Holy had the style..and chin...to make a fight of it....IMHO....I also agree, as I read on another board, that Tyson would have defeated Larry Holmes, who, make no msitake, was a great chanpion...

Lewis was a talent to be sure...however in my minds eye, he was ill suited for the agression - speed - power -detemination of Tyson. Bowe would try to bang with him (Tyson), and be to slow. Holy would severly out hustle Lewis, Bowe would out punch him, and had the intangibles. heart/chin, to beat lewis..we often forget how good Bowe really was....
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Old 08-20-2007, 11:08 PM   #13
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

Lennox Lewis
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Old 08-20-2007, 11:10 PM   #14
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zakman
Exactly. And given that guys like McCall and Rahman blew him out early, it's hard to imagine that at least one of these guys in their primes wouldn't knock him out. In fact, I think they all would.
I can also see that Zack...and..its very hard for me to see Holy or Bowe or Tyson getting wacked in this tourney....
Lewis was the best of his era...but his era was not that good....and he rarely made short work of his opposition to "wow" the fans, (sans the Golota debacle, and a Tyson beatan Razor) and quite frequently got in trouble himself
Todays scene is better in my opinion....
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Old 08-21-2007, 01:36 AM   #15
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Default Re: Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis and Bowe

I think Holyfield had the best chance to pull it off -

I'd rate them like this
1. Holyfield
2. Tyson
3. Bowe
4. Lewis


Holyfield - 75/25 to beat Lewis
A 37 year old Holyfield fought a very close fight with Lewis in the rematch - and by this point Holyfield didn't have near the workrate he did in his prime. Lewis would always present some problems for Holyfield (size, jab, 84 inch reach) but I think Holyfield outworks Lewis to a close but clear UD. Lewis was supposedly prime in those 2 fights against Holyfield and still he never seriously hurt Evander, and you throw in the fact that while Lewis was an impressive accomplished champion - he was clearly the least agressive of the four fighters listed. Lewis's chin was questionable and clearly that makes him the least likely to win this thing.

Holyfield - 55/45 to beat Bowe
Probably the toughest win for Evander but I'd still favor him slightly over Bowe. While Bowe won their first matchup, I still only had Bowe winning 115-112 the last time I watched it - Holyfield was certainly in that fight. Holy won 115-112 the last time I watched their 2nd fight. Obviously the key here is would Holy box Bowe or try to war too much like he did in the first fight? That's the question - but since this is a prime discussion I would assume that we are getting the best Holyfield so I'll say he uses more of the gameplan of the 2nd fight and he edges Bowe in a close decision.

Holyfield - 60/40 to beat Tyson
This would be an amazing fight, but Holyfield had the counterpunching style and granite chin to give even a prime Tyson all sorts of challenges. No doubt Tyson would be harder to hit than he was in 96, no doubt Tyson's stamina would be better than 96, but Holyfield to me was always a better and more diverse fighter than Tyson was. Prime Tyson was incredible, but he had to fight coming forward and even in his prime was open to getting hit - perfect for Holyfield's counterpunching style. Again he had the chin to withstand the early Tyson barrage. Holyfield would probably back Tyson up some like he did in 96 which would frustrate Tyson. And I think as the fight goes on Holyfield starts to wear Tyson down with jabs and left hooks and he stops him by the 12th. Great fight though and no doubt Tyson could win.

So I like Holyfield because he had the best chin of the four fighters so I don't see him being knocked out, and his workrate and offensive skills in his prime were arguably the best of the bunch. The only thing a prime Holyfield lacked was the one punch KO power that the other 3 had. But prime Holyfield still KO'd his fair share of fighters, and a past prime Holyfield knocked down Bowe and knocked out Tyson.

[b]After Holyfield, prime Tyson has the best shot.

Tyson 85/15 to beat Lewis
Lewis's chin was questionable and a prime Tyson would get to it within the first four rounds and put him out. If 2nd tier fighters like McCall and Rahman could put Lewis out with one punch, then prime Tyson certainly could and likely would. I know Lewis was in with punchers like Ruddock and Tua and others, but honestly those 2 losses can't be ignored. No other ATG heavy has those kinds of defeats - that's enough to give me concern. Lewis's chin was certainly not weak (I have seen the YouTube video), but I would say it was questionable and that is enough to give Tyson a big edge in this one. Lewis does present some problems no doubt - big size and reach advantage, and Lewis could score some uppercuts probably - but again not enough that I'd pick him to win. If Lewis pulls it off, it is probably by a close decision. But to me this is the easiest fight to pick of the bunch.

Tyson 65/35 to beat Bowe
Fascinating fight, I give Bowe a better chance than Lewis to beat a prime Tyson because he had a better chin and was much more agressive than Lewis. Bowe could hit Tyson on the outside with his jab, and was a great in fighter and would score pretty big there as well. Either way this fight would be over within the first 6 rounds of the fight. But Tyson had better defense and I think eventually he puts Bowe out. Great fight though.

Bowe 50/50 to beat Lewis
This is the most difficult fight to pick a winner in. In 93 I am pretty confident Bowe would have knocked Lewis out. In 95 I am pretty sure that Lewis would have knocked Bowe out. But prime v. prime either man has a shot. Certainly Lewis had the massive right hand and the unquestionably superior defense, but Bowe's chin and agression and his own power could no doubt put Lewis in trouble as well.

Either way, the reason I rank Bowe's chances as better than Lewis's is that he would have a much better chance to beat Holyfield and Tyson than Lewis would. Against each other, not sure either way.

Great queston though - just wish we could have seen some of these fights.
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