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Old 08-26-2007, 03:37 AM   #1
Russell
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Default Mike Weaver - His power

Seems like his 41 (2 record is pretty misleading, both as a show of how hard a punch he carried and also his quality as a fighter.

Some bad breaks, I think... Like the Dokes fight being stop as a result of a referee over-reacting due to the Mancini/Kim match weeks before, among other bad breaks.

Thoughts on him as a fighter, and on his power?
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Old 08-26-2007, 04:39 AM   #2
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Default Re: Mike Weaver - His power

Very good power, just sometimes his ability to land his big shots was lacking. If he'd been able to polish up his technique ever more he would've registered more KOs.

I liked Weaver as a fighter and a person. While his chin could be a liability and he wasn't the most refined of fighters, he was a hard-working, brave and a big hitter.
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Old 08-26-2007, 05:10 AM   #3
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Default Re: Mike Weaver - His power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flabby Gut
I remember him putting Carl 'the truth' Williams to sleep with one vicious lefthook. Weaver was stunned and Williams rushed in to finish the job and got starched himself. I really liked Weaver. A warrior and seemed like a really nice, laidback guy out of the ring. He was from Diamond Bar, California.
As for me, I didn't see Weaver as being stunned at all, but playing possum to deliberately sucker Williams into his hook. He timed it, and as soon as Carl landed with another left, Hercules uncorked his hook inside The Truth's right. It seemed to me that the only one in that arena who didn't realize that Mike was setting him up for that was Williams himself.

Attacking with a predictably incessant one-two pattern can be a very dangerous indulgence. Better to double up on hooks, or vary from each combination to the next for unpredictability. (Duran did this masterfully against Palomino, as chronicled in Sports Illustrated's fine coverage of their match.) Having a true "killer instinct" means knowing when an opponent is in genuine distress, or merely baiting a trap. Williams did not have a servicable "killer instinct," nor did Earnie Shavers (who was duped by Ali into thinking Muhammad wasn't seriously hurt when Earnie in fact had seriously rung his bell).

Dempsey had a fantastic killer instinct. When he knew his prey was going to rise up from a knockdown, he'd shadow his quarry in anticipation of their beating the count. But when he dropped Brennan in their title scrap, floored Jack Sharkey, and decked Firpo for the final time, Jack walked away, because he knew they weren't going to beat the count of ten after those knockdowns.

There's a story that Weaver discovered his apptitude for packing a big punch when he flattened a drill sergeant in the military. Early in his career, he had a reputation as having little staying power, but he impressed Gil Clancy tremendously with his wire to wire domination of Scott LeDoux in Minnesota. Then he sealed his reputation with his back to back one punch championship knockout wins with each hand on the road against Tate and Coetzee. In South Africa, Gerrie was not able to get Mike off his feet, cementing Weaver's reputation as somebody who could take a punch. Then he took Tillis out of the unbeaten ranks with a 15 round decison, a verdict over a fine up-and-coming mobile stylist.

While the fourth estate in boxing has never given Mike his due, he's received tremendous and well-deserved respect and fan support among the ESB Classic posters who remember him, and should always enjoy a secure reputation on fan based forums like this one. A quiet, unassuming, modest classy character, just the sort of gentleman boxing needs to elevate it's image today. He treated failure and success with equal dignity.
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Old 08-26-2007, 11:39 AM   #4
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Default Re: Mike Weaver - His power

And always stayed in excellent condition, too. He took his training very seriously.
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Old 08-27-2007, 04:08 AM   #5
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Default Re: Mike Weaver - His power

I've heard Tyson mention that he thought Weaver was one of the hardest HW punchers of the 1980's. As Damon said.... Weaver always showed up in gr8 shape, which is alot more than most of the 1980's HW's can claim.
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Old 08-27-2007, 06:51 AM   #6
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Default Re: Mike Weaver - His power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duodenum

While the fourth estate in boxing has never given Mike his due, he's received tremendous and well-deserved respect and fan support among the ESB Classic posters who remember him, and should always enjoy a secure reputation on fan based forums like this one. A quiet, unassuming, modest classy character, just the sort of gentleman boxing needs to elevate it's image today. He treated failure and success with equal dignity.
Amen to that, bro.

I have always had a particularly soft spot for Weaver, partly because he came to these parts three times to fight, and I was privileged enough to watch him fight live one time.
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Old 08-27-2007, 08:16 AM   #7
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Default Re: Mike Weaver - His power

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Originally Posted by fists of fury
Amen to that, bro.

I have always had a particularly soft spot for Weaver, partly because he came to these parts three times to fight, and I was privileged enough to watch him fight live one time.
Of course you well know what I'm about to describe, so this is for the benefit of newer fans to the sport who are less familiar with him.

Anybody who is percieved as having improved themselves, and made the most of what they had, ought to be highly regarded for that. Weaver certainly fits the bill, dramatically surpassing what the so-called "experts" in boxing predicted for him. He was originally considered a muscular looking tanker whose physique concealed a lack of conditioning, and who faded late with little endurance. He converted that weakness into a strength, and ironically came to be more widely percieved as a slow starter. He posted some fine decision wins for all the power he had. His performance over Scott LeDoux was a fine 12 round display of jabbing and boxing skill. A real road warrior, winning his biggest victories in his opponents hometowns.

Joey Curtis robbed him of his WBA title after barely a minute against Dokes. In their very next match, he gave Dokes 15 rounds of hell, and deserved to have his title restored (not a likely outcome against a Don King fighter). After his brilliant TKO win over Carl Williams, he suffered another another devastating single round loss to Bonecrusher Smith. Yet he kept on going, and nearly four years to the day that Smith blasted him out, he found himself in first round trouble against Bonecrusher again, but climbed off the deck to go the full 12 rounds. For a particular competitor to go the distance against two different opponents who have previously posted one round stoppages over them is a rare demonstration of mental toughness and resilience.

He was 41 years old when he decisioned 27 year old Smokin' Bert Cooper over 12 rounds for something called the NBA Heavyweight Title, and 44 when he successfully defended it over the 12 round distance for the final time. This is somebody who has been very candid about how advancing age has sapped him of his abilities. Yet over 15 years elapsed between the time he took fine 28 year old 15-0-0 prospect Bill Sharkey out of the unbeaten ranks, to his win over Cooper. That's a pretty impressive run for somebody who the boxing press originally derided as a tomato can. (Sharkey could well have been a cruiserweight champion had he come along a few years later, and he was used as an example of why such a division was needed, by advocates of the idea.)

One top of all that, he's also an excellent piano player, like many other boxing champions who are fine musicians. (That makes perfect sense, with the timing and rhythym required for both.)
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Old 08-27-2007, 02:38 PM   #8
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Default Re: Mike Weaver - His power

I know a guy who says he was in the gym with Weaver and Alex Garcia. He blames Garcia's sparring with Weaver for Garcia's sudden collapse as a contender. He thinks the hard sparring sessions took too much from Garcia. The guy says that Weaver just hit too hard for anyone to take his shots on a regular basis.

Duodenum, I agree with your post, but beating Bert Cooper could be an accomplishment or it might not be, depending on Cooper's lifestyle at the time of the fight. Bert is a woulda, coulda, shoulda kind of fighter, who let his lifestyle wreck his boxing career. Bert had talent, and anytime he chose to dedicate himself to boxing he could give anyone trouble. Other times, he was just there for a check. When Bert did train, the sparring sessions with Oliver McCall are legendary.
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Old 08-27-2007, 06:10 PM   #9
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Default Re: Mike Weaver - His power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkeye
I know a guy who says he was in the gym with Weaver and Alex Garcia. He blames Garcia's sparring with Weaver for Garcia's sudden collapse as a contender. He thinks the hard sparring sessions took too much from Garcia. The guy says that Weaver just hit too hard for anyone to take his shots on a regular basis.
Yeah, I don't think Kenny Norton nicknamed Mike "Hercules" just because of his physique.
Quote:
Duodenum, I agree with your post, but beating Bert Cooper could be an accomplishment or it might not be, depending on Cooper's lifestyle at the time of the fight. Bert is a woulda, coulda, shoulda kind of fighter, who let his lifestyle wreck his boxing career. Bert had talent, and anytime he chose to dedicate himself to boxing he could give anyone trouble. Other times, he was just there for a check. When Bert did train, the sparring sessions with Oliver McCall are legendary.
True enough. Bert had to be one of the most exasperating contenders of his era to follow the career of. However, Mike had to perform successfully over 12 rounds before an audience in order to decision Cooper, and that's a rather challenging achievement to fabricate, somewhat different from a quick knockout. Leading up to Weaver/Cooper, Bert had floored Holyfield and Moorer, won two straight after that, and quickly followed up the loss to Weaver with a decision win. Based on that, the fact that it came in the midst of a six match winning streak for Mike, and Cooper's age and recorded weight at the time, the record (admittedly culled from boxwreck.com) would seem to indicate it was a good win for Mike. (And yeah, I vividly remember, "My head is buzzing!")

Last edited by Duodenum; 08-27-2007 at 09:06 PM.
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