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Old 04-26-2009, 06:16 PM   #46
TBooze
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Default Re: Leonard Does NOT Deserve To Be Recognized As 5 Divison Champ!!

I do not understand why people get so excited.

I mean everyone now is at least a two division title holder; a title holder means very, very little....

If we are talking proper World Championships; Leonard won at best two (147 and 160) and has a claim for a third (154).

No fighter in the history of Queensberry Rules, be that Ray Leonard, Tommy Hearns or Roberto Duran has a proper claim for more than three Championships at different weights.
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Old 04-26-2009, 08:09 PM   #47
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Default Re: Leonard Does NOT Deserve To Be Recognized As 5 Divison Champ!!

Ray fought Marvin because he saw Marvin was rusty and getting old with Mugabi and the Hearns fight took a lot out of him. Ray did not come out of retirement and fight Marvin after Hearns. Because for Hearns, Marvin was still sharp.
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Old 04-26-2009, 08:58 PM   #48
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Default Re: Leonard Does NOT Deserve To Be Recognized As 5 Divison Champ!!

The rule has always been that, if both fighters are under the weight, the title is one the line. Since LaLonde and Leonard both weighed under 175 pounds, LaLonde's WBC light heavyweight title was on the line.

The rule is not always followed. Even though both Leonard and Duran, the WBC middleweight titlist, were under 160 lbs when they fought the third time, Leonard was not officially recognized as the WBC middleweight titlist. That fight was for the WBC supermiddleweight title.

All organizations banned the simultaneous holding of championship belts after Armstrong held three at once. This long standing rule by the WBC was waived for Leonard, which calls into question the whole exercise. Since he really can't hold both simultaneously, then which one did he win? Since the super middleweight division is a bullshit weight class, let's say he could claim the light heavyweight title.

And if Duran's WBC middleweight title wasn't on the line, why did the WBC stop recognizing him as their champion?

It's all funny business.

Since LaLonde was only the WBC light heavyweight titlist, and since nobody thought he was worthy of being recognized as having something in common with Moore, Foster, and Spinks, that Leonard won the WBC title should cause everybody to simply sigh. It really is insignificant. Hearns beating Virgil Hill is the far superior accomplishment.

The 154 lbs title is something, I guess, but it is, next to holding the world welterweight and middleweight titles, peanuts.

Leonard, from the standards of sure history, is the two-time welterweight and one-time middleweight champion and, using the old language, a claimant to the light heavyweight and middleweight titles. Give him this and leave Armstrong's accomplishments where they belong.

Whatever Leonard is, he isn't five-division world champion because he only held two world championships. This is undisputed.
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Old 04-26-2009, 11:09 PM   #49
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Default Re: Leonard Does NOT Deserve To Be Recognized As 5 Divison Champ!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gesta View Post
Leonard did show heart to last till the end. The Hagler that beat Sibon was a diferent kettle of fish.
I thought he showed heart in many of his big fights and going back to the olympics, very competitive. Though he never reached the status of all time great, he was one of the best of his own decade and along with Tyson and Hagler, one of the big money makers.

I would rank him higher except that some of his career moves along with what I saw in the Norris fight forces a serious downgrade. If I had to compare it to any other major sporting event it would be like watching superbowls - either 24 or 27.

Come on people, we deserve better
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Old 04-26-2009, 11:37 PM   #50
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Default Re: Leonard Does NOT Deserve To Be Recognized As 5 Divison Champ!!

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Originally Posted by redrooster View Post
I thought he showed heart in many of his big fights and going back to the olympics, very competitive.

Come on people, we deserve better


Maybe the reason Leonard, RRJ or Floyd cop so much shit is because we can all see how good they are, but they at times (more so the latter two)they fail to test themselves more and us fan's are some what cheated out of some really good match up's.
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Old 11-29-2012, 12:07 PM   #51
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Default Re: Leonard Does NOT Deserve To Be Recognized As 5 Divison Champ!!

No, he doesn't, but this is Ray Leonard we are talking about here, a man who can get away with Murder, (and Johnny Gill, supposedly).
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