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Old 05-07-2009, 07:15 AM   #1
McGrain
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Default Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Anybody know the details of this fight? I've read that it was a draw, and that Dempsey lost, but i've also read that Dempsey was badly injured to the body in this fight, is that correct?

If so, does anybody know how he boxed to the finish? How did he go about defending himself to make the line? Was he aggressive or did he box defensively?

If Jack hadn't peaked yet, how far do you consider he was from his peak?

Any info appreciated, thanks.
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Old 05-07-2009, 08:34 AM   #2
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Salt Lake Tribune, July 16, 1916
Jack Dempsey, the Salt Lake heavyweight,
who has been causing such a
stir among New York fans since he left
here recently, last night won by a big
shade over John Lester Johnson, one of
the toughest negro fighters in New York.
In their ten-round bout before the Harlem
Sporting club, according to a telegram
received bjr Dempsey's manager. Jack
Price, who has returned to Salt Lake
owinj? to the sickness of his mother.
The telegram also stated that the
match with Gunboat Smith, which was
!o take place In the near future, has
been called off. No reason was given.
but Price volunteared the Information
that after Dempney's victory over Johneon,
whom all the heavies in New York
havo been dodging. Smith decided it
would be to his advantage to call off ths
match.
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Old 05-07-2009, 03:48 PM   #3
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Thanks man! A win for Jack!

Nothing about Jack's being hurt. Did I make a mistake with that?
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Old 05-07-2009, 04:23 PM   #4
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

It would be surprising if Salt Lake City newspapers didn't have it for Dempsey, considering who they received the report from. As Jack Kincaid's name is mentioned at boxrec, that means several NY newspapers he looked up had it a draw or were split evenly as to the winner. The other wire report had Johnson winning easy.
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Old 05-07-2009, 04:27 PM   #5
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Nice detail.

I have Johnson winning also, though Boxrec has a draw.

You know if Dempsey was hurt during this fight Senya?
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Old 05-07-2009, 04:31 PM   #6
SuzieQ49
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

I have read more than one newspaper article in which states Johnson broke 3 of Dempsey's ribs. I wonder if its just a coincidence that after this fight, Dempsey never took on another Black fighter again.

Here is what boxrec has:

Opinions as to the winner were divided. For instance, one report said that "Dempsey failed to live up to the reputation that he earned in Salt Lake City, and was an easy mark for the local boxer." But another said "Neither boxer was ever in danger, but at the finish Johnson was very tired from the heavy punishment he received in the mid-section and around the head."
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Old 05-07-2009, 04:33 PM   #7
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Quote:
You know if Dempsey was hurt during this fight Senya?

John Lester Johnson broke Dempseys ribs. According to Dempsey himself, after this fight he started to go to the body more because he realized how effective it was used against him, and he became one of the more nastiest body punchers of all time.
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Old 05-07-2009, 04:38 PM   #8
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Yeah, that's what I heard too, two-three ribs.

I wonder how Dempsey delt with such injuries though? Any details concerning how he boxed?

Also, this guy ran from Langford like a dog from what I understand.
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Old 05-07-2009, 04:40 PM   #9
ChrisPontius
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Quote:
Originally Posted by mattdonnellon View Post
Salt Lake Tribune, July 16, 1916
Jack Dempsey, the Salt Lake heavyweight,
who has been causing such a
stir among New York fans since he left
here recently, last night won by a big
shade over John Lester Johnson, one of
the toughest negro fighters in New York.
In their ten-round bout before the Harlem
Sporting club, according to a telegram
received bjr Dempsey's manager
. Jack
Price, who has returned to Salt Lake
owinj? to the sickness of his mother.
The telegram also stated that the
match with Gunboat Smith, which was
!o take place In the near future, has
been called off. No reason was given.
but Price volunteared the Information
that after Dempney's victory over Johneon,
whom all the heavies in New York
havo been dodging. Smith decided it
would be to his advantage to call off ths
match.
Dempsey won according to his manager. Surprising.
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Old 05-07-2009, 04:46 PM   #10
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

I said it before, Ill say it again. After suffering broken ribs in this Draw, Dempsey never got in the ring with a black man again. According to Boxing Historian Kevin Smith, Joe Jeanette even got in the ring with Dempsey in 1918. Dempsey refused to engange with Jeanette and walked out of the ring while the crowd Booed.
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Old 05-07-2009, 04:54 PM   #11
ChrisPontius
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuzieQ49 View Post
I said it before, Ill say it again. After suffering broken ribs in this Draw, Dempsey never got in the ring with a black man again. According to Boxing Historian Kevin Smith, Joe Jeanette even got in the ring with Dempsey in 1918. Dempsey refused to engange with Jeanette and walked out of the ring while the crowd Booed.
According to a newspaper article, he "gave boxing a black eye" when he did that. The amazing thing is not so much that statement itself, but when you consider that this happened in a society where 90% of the white men were racist pieces of shit, it's really shocking that they did not stand up for their guy, but booed him, even in the report afterwards.
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Old 05-07-2009, 05:01 PM   #12
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisPontius View Post
not so much that statement itself, but when you consider that this happened in a society where 90% of the white men were racist pieces of shit, it's really shocking that they did not stand up for their guy, but booed him, even in the report afterwards.
See, there was rampant racism, but for a lot of people it seems sports was excused. Certainly periodicals like The Police Gazette were of the opinion that there was no place for racism in boxing and that white men should meet the best challanger rather than the best white challenger.

I think the colour line was drawn by the promoters and boxers more than anyone.

Paraphrasing John Sullivan: "If a white guy is drawing the colour line he's scared of a black guy."
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Old 05-07-2009, 05:05 PM   #13
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Quote:
Originally Posted by McGrain View Post
See, there was rampant racism, but for a lot of people it seems sports was excused. Certainly periodicals like The Police Gazette were of the opinion that there was no place for racism in boxing and that white men should meet the best challanger rather than the best white challenger.

I think the colour line was drawn by the promoters and boxers more than anyone.

Paraphrasing John Sullivan: "If a white guy is drawing the colour line he's scared of a black guy."
Sullivan must have been afraid of Peter Jackson then. He certainly wasnt afraid of George Godfrey though, he tried two-three different times to fight him, and Godfrey was one of the top black challengers in the world.
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Old 05-07-2009, 05:07 PM   #14
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

He knew he could not beat Jackson. Godfrey, however, he felt he could beat.
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Old 05-07-2009, 05:09 PM   #15
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Default Re: Jack Dempsey-John Lester Johnson, July 1916

Jackson came later in John's career of course.

Promoter's, too were keen on the Line. Helps them hold onto the title!
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