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Old 09-10-2007, 01:41 PM   #46
C. M. Clay II
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Robbi
I fully agree. If anyone can't put a prime Ali in with other selected fighters under the category "greatest pure boxers" then they seriously have a biased problem towards him.


Exactly!
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Old 09-10-2007, 01:44 PM   #47
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This Clay II is like a little boy from a special school (don´t counter now and ask where I get that information from, I think so), always talking shit and parroting things...

this is a boxing forum, shine sometimes at least with a good argument or so, instead of writing such childish verdicts...
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Old 09-10-2007, 01:45 PM   #48
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Luigi1985



This Clay II is like a little boy from a sonder school (dont counter now and ask where I get that information from, I think so), always talking shit and parroting things...

this is a boxing forum, shine sometimes at least with a good argument or so, instead of writing such childish verdicts...
What the heck is a sonder school?
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Old 09-10-2007, 01:48 PM   #49
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

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What the heck is a sonder school?

Excuse me, I meant a special school...


hey, Im no English/ American/ Australian, so writing spelling mistakes are nothing special...
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Old 09-10-2007, 01:59 PM   #50
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Luigi1985
Than you have serious problems with formulating a question rightly, Ali wasn´t a great pure boxer, he lived because of his speed and movements, similar to RJJ...

Cash_718 is completely right what he wrote...
He lived because of his speed and movement, which were ingredients to help him become one of the "greatest pure boxers".

Not similar to Roy Jones, who rarely used the jab, as he mainly led with left hooks and right hands. Although I do concede his speed and movements were very strong aspects of his make-up as fighter. Jones never used the jab effectively enough throughout his career to get selected. Not just being ineffective with the jab, but it was thrown as a range finder to feel his way into range for the leading with power shots. Ali on the otherhand dicated opponents excusively behind the jab and 3-4-5 punch combinations when in his prime.

Saying Ali wasn't one of the "best pure boxers" of all time, is like saying Tyson, Louis, and Hearns were not among the greatest punchers of all-time.
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:02 PM   #51
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Robbi
He lived because of his speed and movement, which were ingredients to help him become one of the "greatest pure boxers".

Not similar to Roy Jones, who rarely used the jab, as he mainly led with left hooks and right hands. Although I do concede his speed and movements were very strong aspects of his make-up as fighter.

Jones never used the jab effectively enough throughout his career to get selected, Ali on the otherhand dicated opponents excusively behind the jab and 3-4-5 punch combinations when in his prime.

Saying Ali wasn't one of the "best pure boxers" of all time, is like saying Tyson, Louis, and Hearns were not among the greatest punchers of all-time.

A great pure boxer is someone like Whitaker, who had a great defense, great footwork, movements, a good guard, good combos, etc., things Ali and RJJ for example had not...
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:07 PM   #52
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robbi
He lived because of his speed and movement, which were ingredients to help him become one of the "greatest pure boxers".

Not similar to Roy Jones, who rarely used the jab, as he mainly led with left hooks and right hands. Although I do concede his speed and movements were very strong aspects of his make-up as fighter. Jones never used the jab effectively enough throughout his career to get selected. Not just being ineffective with the jab, but it was thrown as a range finder to feel his way into range for the leading with power shots. Ali on the otherhand dicated opponents excusively behind the jab and 3-4-5 punch combinations when in his prime.

Saying Ali wasn't one of the "best pure boxers" of all time, is like saying Tyson, Louis, and Hearns were not among the greatest punchers of all-time.
Pay no mind. Luigi is an Ali-hater, plain and simple.
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:10 PM   #53
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

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Pay no mind. Luigi is an Ali-hater, plain and simple.
Any one that doesnt worshipped the very ground Ali walks on is a hater.
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:10 PM   #54
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

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Pay no mind. Luigi is an Ali-hater, plain and simple.

Im no Ali- hater, didnt you notice yet that I hate no fighter? Nobody did something to me, why should I hate someone? Im a realist. Im not picking Ali as the best HW in every single part like you, there are many fighters who were better pure boxers than him, but who probably dont know the definition of the words pure boxer...
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:12 PM   #55
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

Ross, Sweet Pea, Pep, Leonard, Gans, were more pure boxers than Ali.
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:16 PM   #56
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Luigi1985
A great pure boxer is someone like Whitaker, who had a great defense, great footwork, movements, a good guard, good combos, etc., things Ali and RJJ for example had not...
Ali had a great defense, even though he was unorthodox and never had solid fundementals. You just said Ali lived off his movements, yet its one of the categorys you selected yourself when defining a "pure boxer". I'd say Ali ticks all the boxes apart from, a good guard. That shouldn't work against him, as twisting and turning away from shots was his way of defending the oncoming offense from his opponent.

Ali and Jones were all about reflexes and speed. Correct, but the main difference between the two, and its a huge. Ali used his jab often, and with authority. Jones never, as he used it as a range finder to set up lead left hooks, and straight right hands.

You can go on about what defines a pure boxer. But I don't need various in depth paragpahs to explain. Just one word which is the primary weapon over any other: JAB.
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:17 PM   #57
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

ali is gradually starting to be actually just about dismissed by some on here.was he any good at all? i'm not necessarily saying the best but of course he was a great pure boxer.he had a great jab, lightning quick combinations,great footwork and supple upper body movement.not a great infighter granted, but was expert at tying a man up. and of course the great athleticism and speed are part of the package but apparantly those attributes are not meant to count.when he lost those attributes post '70 he did a pretty good job of beating all of arguably the best generation of heavies ever with i'm now wondering with which boxing skills.
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:22 PM   #58
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

Ali beat the 70's bunch with his Chin, Will, Heart, and stinging punchings. He was not ducking and weaving vs Fraizer or Foreman. He was mostly taking hits, and slugging it out. Good or great boxers dont do that.
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:23 PM   #59
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

Very rich thread with good choices but who would be THE consensus greatest pure boxer then?
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Old 09-10-2007, 02:25 PM   #60
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Default Re: Who was the greatest pure boxer of all time?

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Originally Posted by Dempsey1238
Ali beat the 70's bunch with his Chin, Will, Heart, and stinging punchings. He was not ducking and weaving vs Fraizer or Foreman. He was mostly taking hits, and slugging it out. Good or great boxers dont do that.
i agree 100% i wasn't trying to state he suceeded simply with pure boxing,but in amongst all that slugging it out a little bit of boxing skill was being used.just a little bit!
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