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Old 09-12-2007, 05:07 AM   #31
Maxmomer
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

Quote:
Originally Posted by tobkhan
So, letīs summerize the picks till now in no order:

Satterfield
Marciano
Schmeling
Louis
Dempsey
Johannson
Slavin
Maher
Langford
Foster

I would like to throw in Floyd Patterson. What do you think of the modern day cruiserweights? Is there anybody since the founding of the division who is up there with his power?
You left off Choynski. As for Patterson, he does have an impressive knockout record and some of his KO's were ****ing beautiful.
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Old 09-12-2007, 05:42 AM   #32
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

In the <200lb category, I vote Marciano (by a mile) for dirty power, Patterson for clean power, and Louis for the best combination of the two...

Quote:
Originally Posted by tobkhan
So, letīs summerize the picks till now in no order:

Satterfield
Marciano
Schmeling
Louis
Dempsey
Johannson
Slavin
Maher
Langford
Foster
Choinsky

I would like to throw in Floyd Patterson. What do you think of the modern day cruiserweights? Is there anybody since the founding of the division who is up there with his power?
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Old 09-12-2007, 05:54 AM   #33
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

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Originally Posted by tobkhan
I edit him in.
I'd say that's a pretty damn good list so far.
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Old 09-12-2007, 05:58 AM   #34
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

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Originally Posted by janitor
I apreciate your reservations and I am certainly not arguing that Schmeling hit harder than Louis. The fact that Baer said this dose however suggest that Schmeling was a serious puncher.

Baer was generaly magnanimous in defeat and made no excuses when he lost to Jimmy Braddock despite the fact that he broke both hands.
What about Holmes saying various fighters hit harder than Tyson? Clays right about the bitterness of some fighters which sometimes does not make them impartial

What about Barrera saying Hamed hits harder than Pacman? I agree with him but Barrera never took 1 of Hameds powerpunches flush the whole night they fought
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Old 09-12-2007, 05:59 AM   #35
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

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Originally Posted by PowerPuncher
What about Holmes saying various fighters hit harder than Tyson? Clays right about the bitterness of some fighters which sometimes does not make them impartial
Baer never struck me as the bitter type, unlike Holmes, who very much was that type. I don't think Baer took boxing serious enough to be bitter about losing, and I never heard of him saying anything bad about Louis. You can't compare Barrera and Holmes to Baer, they're completly different people, and everyone handles defeat in their own way. Some man up, give their opponents due respect and take it, some make excuses and try to undermine their opponents abilities.

Last edited by Maxmomer; 09-12-2007 at 06:31 AM.
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Old 09-12-2007, 07:19 AM   #36
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

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Not the bony overrated Dempsey, that's for sure. Maybe if he actually beat some quality opponents (or one, even), he might be deserving of all this praise.
Every word you say makes you sound more retarded than the one before.
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Old 09-12-2007, 07:57 AM   #37
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

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Originally Posted by Duodenum
Punch for punch, I can't think of any of Joe's opponent's, off hand, who rated him as the hardest hitter for a single shot, and that apparently includes Uzcudun, Braddock and Schmeling, who were on the receiving end of the three hardest indivdual blows Louis ever delivered. But what makes Louis the best puncher in division history was his technical execution of all the types of punches he used, and his ability to put them together. (Years ago, I read a vividly articulate description of what it was like to be hit by Louis, related by Buddy Baer. I'm sure finding it online would not be too difficult.) Louis could drop and take out adversaries which much harder punchers had no success eliminating. The mechanics of his delivery also assured a consistent force of impact. Definitely a textbook case study in How to Do It.
Well said. I think Louis hand speed and accuracy added to his power. As for who hit the hardest between 180-200 pounds, I would say Dempsey. When Dempsey hit his man clean, the other guy often went down right away.

Willard, and Fripo were durable guys. Dempsey dropped them as soon as he landed something serious. If this is not the sign of a great puncher, I don’t know what is. With Marciano, Louis, Langford and others, their opponents tended to take a bit more bombs before going down in many cases.
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Old 09-12-2007, 08:12 AM   #38
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

we forgot Fitz. I know he want over 180 but neither were Choynski, foster, langford, satterfield or maher for most of their fights. one other point, some guys hit hard with all their shots( heavy-handed a la Tom Sharkey while say Tommy Gomez was a one-shot merchant)
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Old 09-12-2007, 08:41 AM   #39
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

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Originally Posted by PowerPuncher
What about Holmes saying various fighters hit harder than Tyson? Clays right about the bitterness of some fighters which sometimes does not make them impartial
Yes, but far too many other opponents of Earnie Shavers back Larry's claims of his power being supreme to dismiss them.

Renaldo Snipes surprised Holmes, and clearly had him more seriously wobbled than Shavers did, but is there anybody who uses the fact of Holmes falling twice after getting clobbered by Rennie's right as proof that Snipes his harder than Shavers? When Holmes stated that Shavers hit harder than Tyson, there could have been others who had faced Earnie in the ring, either in competition or sparring, who would have either supported or contradicted Larry's assessment, for all Homes knew.

Recall Leroy Caldwell's famous quote: "Shavers hit harder than Lyle and Foreman combined." Are Tyson's supporters making the claim that Tyson surpassed Shavers in power?
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Old 09-12-2007, 08:46 AM   #40
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

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Originally Posted by janitor
For pure one punch power Bob Satterfield might be a good choice.

Excellent choice, Janitor!
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Old 09-12-2007, 03:26 PM   #41
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

Quote:
Originally Posted by janitor
I could argue that Schmeling droped Louis and hurt him with a singl clean overhand right he landed in the fourth round from which Louis never recovered and that nobody else who droped him actualy had him in trouble.
So he wasn't landing his right hand in the previous rounds regularly? And he needed another half a hundred clean right crosses to the jaw to finish Louis? You are putting yourself into a corner with your own arguments.

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Louis lander over 250 against Max Baer.
I suppose you are somehow connected to association of jobless blind people that is called 'Compubox'?

Quote:
Maybe Blackburn was just trying to talk Schmeling down before the fight. In private he spoke verry highly of him.
He pointed out something everyone could see. That Schmeling needed a helluva clean right hands to stop Louis. I certainly don't see Sullivan, Fitzsimmons, Dempsey, Marciano, Foreman, Shavers, Tyson, Lewis, Tua, W. Klitschko, etc requireing over a half hundred of their best punches landed clean to the jaw to stop somebody.
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Old 09-12-2007, 04:15 PM   #42
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxmomer
Your right hand is overrated.
ohhh BWOID
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Old 09-12-2007, 11:31 PM   #43
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

Quote:
Originally Posted by janitor
I apreciate your reservations and I am certainly not arguing that Schmeling hit harder than Louis. The fact that Baer said this dose however suggest that Schmeling was a serious puncher.

Baer was generaly magnanimous in defeat and made no excuses when he lost to Jimmy Braddock despite the fact that he broke both hands.
Yes, Baer was not a bitter loser at all, particularly towards Louis. He gave Joe all kinds of unabashed credit on numerous occasions, including the famous occasion on which he stated that he defined fear as "standing across the ring from Joe Louis and knowing he wants to go home early."
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Old 09-13-2007, 03:22 AM   #44
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

[quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Senya13
So he wasn't landing his right hand in the previous rounds regularly? And he needed another half a hundred clean right crosses to the jaw to finish Louis? You are putting yourself into a corner with your own arguments.
If you go back and watch the fight you will see that Schmeling had the worse of the early rounds and might even have been foxing a bit. Then in the 4th he caught Louis with something he did not see coming and then turned the fight around.

Whatever the case it is circular logic to judge his power by the number of shots he needed to put Louis away. This would only be a logical line of argument if a number of other fighters had put him away with a lesser number of shots.

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I suppose you are somehow connected to association of jobless blind people that is called 'Compubox'?
Again go back and watch the film.

Quote:
He pointed out something everyone could see. That Schmeling needed a helluva clean right hands to stop Louis. I certainly don't see Sullivan, Fitzsimmons, Dempsey, Marciano, Foreman, Shavers, Tyson, Lewis, Tua, W. Klitschko, etc requireing over a half hundred of their best punches landed clean to the jaw to stop somebody.
Since none of these guys fought Louis you don't know how many punches they would need to put him away. Even guys like Tyson ocasionaly go head to head with an oponent and the fight still goes the distence.

How many shots did David Tua need to put away Ike Ibeabuchi out of interest?

Could anybody even be bothered to count the number of shots he landed?
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Old 09-13-2007, 03:42 AM   #45
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Default Re: Power 180-200 pounds

Quote:
Originally Posted by janitor
If you go back and watch the fight you will see that Schmeling had the worse of the early rounds and might even have been foxing a bit. Then in the 4th he caught Louis with something he did not see coming and then turned the fight around.
Are you saying that Schmeling didn't land clean right crosses to the jaw at all prior to that?

Quote:
Again go back and watch the film.
A film where Joe Louis landed 250 clean flush punches to the jaw of Max Baer? You must have some edited version that is looped to repeat every clean punch that landed several times.

Quote:
How many shots did David Tua need to put away Ike Ibeabuchi out of interest?
Could anybody even be bothered to count the number of shots he landed?
Clean left hooks flush to the jaw of Ibeabuchi?
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