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Old 03-02-2010, 10:18 PM   #106
COULDHAVEBEEN
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Default Re: Mundines next fight

You make some sense in your last post 20a87.

But, at nearly 35 and tiptoeing around, seemingly avoiding anything meaningful, and at the same time promising the earth. That's what alienates the critics - both scribes and punters.

The 'Pioneer' name is hilarious, and I hope for his sake it's just tongue-in-cheek. Otherwise it's just plain embarrassing! Especially after the Medley pre-fight debacle. He already seems to have reverted away from it anyway.

Without going overboard quoting from 'World of Boxing' - another plug (I am reading this months edition today), it talks about Green v Mundine II being between Australia's most popular and Australia's least popular boxer.

...who could argue that assessment, and it's not by accident?
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Old 03-02-2010, 10:39 PM   #107
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Default Re: Mundines next fight

Quote:
Originally Posted by 20a87 View Post
I don't mind going back and forth with you guys on the pros and cons of mundine but the way you both have posted your counter points means i cant quote you properly. Nevertheless:
Happy now big fella.

Quote:
Froch was not a worthwhile fight prior to getting the wbc title and even then mundine was on his way down in weight so we can ignore the froch angle.
Froch has been more worthwhile than most of Mandys last 10 or so fights for a long time. Any real top 20 fighter is.
Quote:
Everyone knows falliga was a shit fight both in terms of opponent and spectacle, however his previous fight had been a war, he was limping about the ring and I can understand a gimme fight also it was billed as the road to the rematch.
And at what stage is that rematch now?
Quote:
I wish he had fought lyell just to get at pavlik, who he does have plans for, I reckon hbo pressured kp to fight martinez if not williams.
It seems Mandy fans have to resort to wishing for a lot of things.
Quote:
As far as the mundine weight issue goes he's a middleweight now like it or not, he's been a titlist at the weight. If he drops to 154 I hope he uses the pioneer name as it would go down a storm with boxing fans
You're right, we don't have to like it, and we don't.
Running away from tough fights (by dropping weight) is not the tactic of a true champion. Particularly if that claytons champion has an enormous mouth.
Quote:
We all know he has to step it up in terms of named opponents, I think "the man" wants to (see medley pf interview) aswell.
Are you sure about that? I think he only wants to talk about it.
Quote:
But what boxing fans often neglect to think about is that his job is boxing and boxing is business.
For ****s sake, that's true IF you didn't continually claim you're something that you're not. Or claim that your next big fight is something that never eventuates.

The cunt can fight whoever he wants, but why talk the shit he does?
Yeh yeh, the publicity has people talking bullshit bullshit bullshit.
Quote:
The green fight will happen after the man has a better bargaining position than green but it's been done to death in the last month already.
That's all going to a script written years ago. It's meaningless shit.
Quote:
If I've left anything out I'll add tomorrow its too late here now.

Also The Real Deal Geale is the best
I agree.
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Old 03-03-2010, 05:42 AM   #108
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Default Re: Mundines next fight

Listen, for the rest of his career Mundine will fight safe options. He might talk that he is chasing the best fighter's but we all know he isn't. He will have a couple more nothing fights then have his big $$$$$$$$ rematch with Green then he might call it a day all the while stating how the big guns ducked him. We all know the score with Mundine by now.
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Old 03-03-2010, 06:28 AM   #109
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Default Re: Mundines next fight

I think Mundine's next fight announcement will give us a fair guide of what his future intentions are.

If it's a reasonably well known fighter, who is or has been a legitimate world title contender, like a Randy Griffin, one could imagine he is gearing up for a middleweight showdown.

If it's a 164 pound catchweight fight against some Argie or an Oceania fighter, well it seems like Garth Wood would be next and then a Green rematch.

I certainly hope it's the former.
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Old 03-03-2010, 10:13 AM   #110
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Default Re: Mundines next fight

Quote:
Originally Posted by COULDHAVEBEEN View Post
You make some sense in your last post 20a87.

But, at nearly 35 and tiptoeing around, seemingly avoiding anything meaningful, and at the same time promising the earth. That's what alienates the critics - both scribes and punters.

The 'Pioneer' name is hilarious, and I hope for his sake it's just tongue-in-cheek. Otherwise it's just plain embarrassing! Especially after the Medley pre-fight debacle. He already seems to have reverted away from it anyway.

Without going overboard quoting from 'World of Boxing' - another plug (I am reading this months edition today), it talks about Green v Mundine II being between Australia's most popular and Australia's least popular boxer.

...who could argue that assessment, and it's not by accident?
I don't think his 2009 was as bad as people like to make out, the taylor fight was entertaining albeit a scrappy win, the seemingly fan favourite geale was scalped by "the man" and I agree falliga was awful but ultimately understandable to a degree. Yes he needs the big fights if he's to appease the naysayers but its easier said than done to land big fights.

As far as being the pioneer goes I reckon most of his spiel is tongue in cheek like the constant crack-er comments etc but it seems to fly over most peoples heads on here, he's a funny guy.

The world of boxing have it right green is pretty unpopular.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sox View Post
Happy now big fella.


Froch has been more worthwhile than most of Mandys last 10 or so fights for a long time. Any real top 20 fighter is.

And at what stage is that rematch now?

It seems Mandy fans have to resort to wishing for a lot of things.

You're right, we don't have to like it, and we don't.
Running away from tough fights (by dropping weight) is not the tactic of a true champion. Particularly if that claytons champion has an enormous mouth.

Are you sure about that? I think he only wants to talk about it.

For ****s sake, that's true IF you didn't continually claim you're something that you're not. Or claim that your next big fight is something that never eventuates.

The cunt can fight whoever he wants, but why talk the shit he does?
Yeh yeh, the publicity has people talking bullshit bullshit bullshit.

That's all going to a script written years ago. It's meaningless shit.

I agree.
Dont buy into the froch hype, he is not much of a draw in the uk and his pascaltitle fight only got 1million views on primetime terrestrial tv, prior to that he was overshadowed by khan, haye, calzaghe, thaxton, enzo etc Even with the super six he has his own channel cos noone wants to buy the rights to his fights.

The rumour with the geale rematch was that he wanted more money etc and the tasmanian card didnt justify the bucks. Its a fight for a title later in the year probably and will be bigger as a result. You wish geale had beaten mundine but it didnt happen.

He hasnt lost for a good while, I dont reckon he doesn't think he's the best. Why does any boxer say they are the best?

Green is on mundines strings and yes the script is being followed but the split green wants won't happen

Quote:
Originally Posted by dominator View Post
I think Mundine's next fight announcement will give us a fair guide of what his future intentions are.

If it's a reasonably well known fighter, who is or has been a legitimate world title contender, like a Randy Griffin, one could imagine he is gearing up for a middleweight showdown.

If it's a 164 pound catchweight fight against some Argie or an Oceania fighter, well it seems like Garth Wood would be next and then a Green rematch.

I certainly hope it's the former.
agreed.
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Old 03-03-2010, 03:48 PM   #111
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Default Re: Mundines next fight

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Originally Posted by 20a87 View Post
I don't think his 2009 was as bad as people like to make out, the taylor fight was entertaining albeit a scrappy win, the seemingly fan favourite geale was scalped by "the man" and I agree falliga was awful but ultimately understandable to a degree. Yes he needs the big fights if he's to appease the naysayers but its easier said than done to land big fights.
Crap, take a drop in pay. If you continue to win, you get higher pay. It's easy and that's how the BEST do it.
Quote:
As far as being the pioneer goes I reckon most of his spiel is tongue in cheek like the constant crack-er comments etc but it seems to fly over most peoples heads on here, he's a funny guy.
Not sure on that, he doesn't have the intelligence to be intentionally funny.
Quote:
The world of boxing have it right green is pretty unpopular.
Green is beginning to annoy me almost as much as Mandy.
Quote:
Dont buy into the froch hype, he is not much of a draw in the uk and his pascaltitle fight only got 1million views on primetime terrestrial tv, prior to that he was overshadowed by khan, haye, calzaghe, thaxton, enzo etc Even with the super six he has his own channel cos noone wants to buy the rights to his fights.
I haven't bought into the Froch hype. I don't rate him much at all, however he is still better than the majority of the bums Mandy has fought in the last few years, which was my point.
Quote:
The rumour with the geale rematch was that he wanted more money etc and the tasmanian card didnt justify the bucks. Its a fight for a title later in the year probably and will be bigger as a result.
See, it's all about money again. You seeing a pattern forming here?
Yet you, the rest of his gullible fans, and himself, still claim he's the best and wants to fight the best.

Open your eyes, it's right in front of you.
Quote:
You wish geale had beaten mundine but it didnt happen.
I know Geale did win, and the second lot of judges agree with me.
Just because the panel of judges were hand picked for the night, Mandys tape kept giving him time, and a knockdown wasn't ruled when it should have, doesn't give him a win in my eyes.

No matter which way anyone sees it, they went toe to toe, something which few people thought Geale could do. I knew he could and I even lost money because of the crap that went on.

It's the Mandy huggers who are pissed, because Mandy was cought with his pants down.

And that my friend is why Mandy wants no part of Geale again.
Quote:
He hasnt lost for a good while, I dont reckon he doesn't think he's the best. Why does any boxer say they are the best?
Of course you won't lose if you mainly fight nobodies.
And yes, it's nice to be confident, however doing it so publicly, so often, only makes you to be a fool when the lies never come true.
Quote:
Green is on mundines strings and yes the script is being followed but the split green wants won't happen
Yep, dollars again, the sign of a real champion.

It's ok to be a fan of someone, but to believe all that is said and then support a liar, that's not being very realistic now is it?
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Old 03-03-2010, 04:15 PM   #112
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Default Re: Mundines next fight

[quote=20a87;6230451]...the seemingly fan favourite geale was scalped by "the man"...

Denial is a common trait amongst Mundine supporters.

'Seemingly' fan favourite Geale! ... Don't want to spoil a good Mundine story with facts, but Geale is popular. Mundine is not.

...and 'scalped'! ... Again, don't want to spoil a good Mundine story with facts, but that fight couldn't have possibly been closer. As shown by the scoring of the judges on the night and the score by 3 more judges after the protest (final count was 3 judges for each fighter).

And we saw how keen Mundine was for a re-match with the man he 'scalped'! Preferring to dump the title belt and go on a starvation diet rather than face the 'unpopular' Geale again!

Yes he needs the big fights if he's to appease the naysayers but its easier said than done to land big fights.

...and that's exactly where this discussion began, ie Todd declaring in a national magazine that Duddy & Froch were Mundine's for the taking, and he chose instead...........Falliga!!

As far as being the pioneer goes I reckon most of his spiel is tongue in cheek

...let's hope so! Nobody could really be that dumb!

like the constant crack-er comments etc but it seems to fly over most peoples heads on here, he's a funny guy.

The world of boxing have it right green is pretty unpopular...

...did I mention denial earlier!!

[/quote]


See comments above.
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Old 03-03-2010, 05:25 PM   #113
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Default Re: Mundines next fight

CHB...just a few things mate...timing in boxing is everything...getting in without being hit...picking your target as it moves and even making fights.

I'm not saying these fights werent on the cards at some time mid to late 2009 but timing making fights is hard mate


1. No chance Mundine could have fought Froch...he was tied into the super 6 from August 2009

2. As mentioned Duddy was coming off a loss in late April 2009 to Lyell

3. Mundine had his fight set with Geale for late may 2009 so he's not even looking at a fight let alone Duddy.

4. You may not remember however both Geale and Mundine were chasing Lyell within 2 weeks of the IBO title fight....early June 2009...so Mundine looking for Lyell...he just won the title so he wanted to fight the winner not the loser

4. Anyway after the Duddy win Lyell had his own plan....don't lose as he was promised an IBF shot V Sylvester early 2010...he took 2 keep buys fight with guys rated 261 and 411 at MW

5. So you say why not Duddy.....Highly respected sources in the industry confirmed that Mundine was chasing Pavlik hard with his new IBO belt....history showed that while Arum said no he left the door open....Mundine did try again several times however Pavlik made the fight with Espino. Yes Arum decided to fight a guy ranked 30 instead of Mundine at 5.

6. So Mundine was chasing the best in the division June July....that's why the Froch fight didn't come off ( remember Froch beat Taylor early may (Mundine started looking for Pavlik early June after he won the IBO belt) ......anyway the super 6 was made July so the Mundine Froch fight would have been canned in favour of Froch taking on the super 6

6. July/ August Mundine started to look for plan C...as Plan A..Pavlik and Plan B..Lyell fell over...it was too late to go back for Froch because he signed with the super 6

7. August Mundine decided to go to 154 and announced to the IBO (not made public) he will fight at 154.....the proposal was scraped due to half of the Mundine camp thinking he wont make weight...dont know what the IBO was thinking

8. September the proposed fight at 154 was back on the cards..still unofficial against Rob Medley...and a keep busy fight was made on a dual feature card on Tazzy to promote Geale v Mundine II for April 2010

9. After the fight in October Mundine and Grange did the deal to fight Rob at 154 early 2010...it was then made public

So mate...I could have spent a bit more time and tried to bullet proof this timeline so I have more than likley produced a bit of self-ownage but my point is timing to make fights is why Froch never got made

Duddy was never going to get made after his loss

For the record the Falinga fight was crap...first fight of Mundines that I have not seen
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Old 03-03-2010, 05:49 PM   #114
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Default Re: Mundines next fight

Some reasonable points Ash.

But Todd is far better connected than me or you, and wouldn't have wasted his, or everybody else's time, getting Duddy & Froch organised if it just wasn't going to fit. What would he or anyone else have to gain from it?

Falliga is a good example, but there have been other Mundine fights that have amounted to total wastes of time. Surely a Duddy, even off a loss, was going to be more productive than Falliga etc.

Mundine hasn't convinced anyone of the merits of trying to starve down to 154. The Medley bout, with no useful title up for grabs, was almost as big a waste of time for a guy nearly 35 as Falliga!

Mundine just seems to be the 'unluckiest' Aussie fighter ever for getting decent fights set!
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Old 03-03-2010, 05:53 PM   #115
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Yeah, its almost as if he isn't really trying.
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Old 03-03-2010, 05:58 PM   #116
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Yeah, its almost as if he isn't really trying.


More akin to bad management.
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Old 03-03-2010, 07:02 PM   #117
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Crap, take a drop in pay. If you continue to win, you get higher pay. It's easy and that's how the BEST do it.
Not sure on that, he doesn't have the intelligence to be intentionally funny.
Green is beginning to annoy me almost as much as Mandy.
I haven't bought into the Froch hype. I don't rate him much at all, however he is still better than the majority of the bums Mandy has fought in the last few years, which was my point.
See, it's all about money again. You seeing a pattern forming here?
Yet you, the rest of his gullible fans, and himself, still claim he's the best and wants to fight the best.

Open your eyes, it's right in front of you.
I know Geale did win, and the second lot of judges agree with me.
Just because the panel of judges were hand picked for the night, Mandys tape kept giving him time, and a knockdown wasn't ruled when it should have, doesn't give him a win in my eyes.

No matter which way anyone sees it, they went toe to toe, something which few people thought Geale could do. I knew he could and I even lost money because of the crap that went on.

It's the Mandy huggers who are pissed, because Mandy was cought with his pants down.

And that my friend is why Mandy wants no part of Geale again.
Of course you won't lose if you mainly fight nobodies.
And yes, it's nice to be confident, however doing it so publicly, so often, only makes you to be a fool when the lies never come true.
Yep, dollars again, the sign of a real champion.

It's ok to be a fan of someone, but to believe all that is said and then support a liar, that's not being very realistic now is it?
To hint at mundine being a coward is weak considering he's faced some big hitters in his career, you cannot knock him for making money and its not like he hasn't had a title recently albeit an ibo belt.

If you think geale won then thats ok so long as you realise mundine won in real life, he sat the real deal down and landed the cleaner shots and hurt his body if he had his pants down it was a good job he won geales belt to keep them up.

To dismiss his recent opponents as nobodies is crazy (falliga aside) and his talk is no worse than pbf and other fighters out there.
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Old 03-03-2010, 07:07 PM   #118
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[quote=COULDHAVEBEEN;6232646]
Quote:
Originally Posted by 20a87 View Post
...the seemingly fan favourite geale was scalped by "the man"...

Denial is a common trait amongst Mundine supporters.

'Seemingly' fan favourite Geale! ... Don't want to spoil a good Mundine story with facts, but Geale is popular. Mundine is not.

...and 'scalped'! ... Again, don't want to spoil a good Mundine story with facts, but that fight couldn't have possibly been closer. As shown by the scoring of the judges on the night and the score by 3 more judges after the protest (final count was 3 judges for each fighter).

And we saw how keen Mundine was for a re-match with the man he 'scalped'! Preferring to dump the title belt and go on a starvation diet rather than face the 'unpopular' Geale again!

Yes he needs the big fights if he's to appease the naysayers but its easier said than done to land big fights.

...and that's exactly where this discussion began, ie Todd declaring in a national magazine that Duddy & Froch were Mundine's for the taking, and he chose instead...........Falliga!!

As far as being the pioneer goes I reckon most of his spiel is tongue in cheek

...let's hope so! Nobody could really be that dumb!

like the constant crack-er comments etc but it seems to fly over most peoples heads on here, he's a funny guy.

The world of boxing have it right green is pretty unpopular...

...did I mention denial earlier!!

[/quote]


See comments above.
From all accounts geale didnt exactly raise the roof in his home town. And mundine beat him to say geale won is true denial.

Mundine is a v.funny, entertaining promoter - hardly dumb.

I think ashley pretty much set the record straight for the other points.
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Old 03-03-2010, 07:08 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashley View Post
CHB...just a few things mate...timing in boxing is everything...getting in without being hit...picking your target as it moves and even making fights.

I'm not saying these fights werent on the cards at some time mid to late 2009 but timing making fights is hard mate


1. No chance Mundine could have fought Froch...he was tied into the super 6 from August 2009

2. As mentioned Duddy was coming off a loss in late April 2009 to Lyell

3. Mundine had his fight set with Geale for late may 2009 so he's not even looking at a fight let alone Duddy.

4. You may not remember however both Geale and Mundine were chasing Lyell within 2 weeks of the IBO title fight....early June 2009...so Mundine looking for Lyell...he just won the title so he wanted to fight the winner not the loser

4. Anyway after the Duddy win Lyell had his own plan....don't lose as he was promised an IBF shot V Sylvester early 2010...he took 2 keep buys fight with guys rated 261 and 411 at MW

5. So you say why not Duddy.....Highly respected sources in the industry confirmed that Mundine was chasing Pavlik hard with his new IBO belt....history showed that while Arum said no he left the door open....Mundine did try again several times however Pavlik made the fight with Espino. Yes Arum decided to fight a guy ranked 30 instead of Mundine at 5.

6. So Mundine was chasing the best in the division June July....that's why the Froch fight didn't come off ( remember Froch beat Taylor early may (Mundine started looking for Pavlik early June after he won the IBO belt) ......anyway the super 6 was made July so the Mundine Froch fight would have been canned in favour of Froch taking on the super 6

6. July/ August Mundine started to look for plan C...as Plan A..Pavlik and Plan B..Lyell fell over...it was too late to go back for Froch because he signed with the super 6

7. August Mundine decided to go to 154 and announced to the IBO (not made public) he will fight at 154.....the proposal was scraped due to half of the Mundine camp thinking he wont make weight...dont know what the IBO was thinking

8. September the proposed fight at 154 was back on the cards..still unofficial against Rob Medley...and a keep busy fight was made on a dual feature card on Tazzy to promote Geale v Mundine II for April 2010

9. After the fight in October Mundine and Grange did the deal to fight Rob at 154 early 2010...it was then made public

So mate...I could have spent a bit more time and tried to bullet proof this timeline so I have more than likley produced a bit of self-ownage but my point is timing to make fights is why Froch never got made

Duddy was never going to get made after his loss

For the record the Falinga fight was crap...first fight of Mundines that I have not seen
Best post i've seen on the aussie forum (aside from my own)
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Old 03-03-2010, 07:09 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by COULDHAVEBEEN View Post
Some reasonable points Ash.

But Todd is far better connected than me or you, and wouldn't have wasted his, or everybody else's time, getting Duddy & Froch organised if it just wasn't going to fit. What would he or anyone else have to gain from it?

Falliga is a good example, but there have been other Mundine fights that have amounted to total wastes of time. Surely a Duddy, even off a loss, was going to be more productive than Falliga etc.

Mundine hasn't convinced anyone of the merits of trying to starve down to 154. The Medley bout, with no useful title up for grabs, was almost as big a waste of time for a guy nearly 35 as Falliga!

Mundine just seems to be the 'unluckiest' Aussie fighter ever for getting decent fights set!


The "unluckiest aussie fighter' title goes to Meehan


If we knew the dates these fights were proposed for it would be a bit easier to say......I can only think that Todd tried to get Froch after his win against Taylor in May......to try and set a fight for Aug/ Sept provided Mundine beats Geale also in May.

Timing was perfect by the looks of this.....however...

At the same time Mundine was chasing Number 1 at 'MW".....THAT MADE MORE SENSE THAN GOING BACK TO 'SMW".....Mundine did try to get Pavlik with his new IBO belt....by the time Pavlik fell through it was too late to get Froch and he was already signed for the super 6.

Like I said mate....the Falinga fight sucked...I did not watch it

However knowing how things work behind the scenes you must know that the deal with Medley and Geale was done months in advance so Mundines next 3 fights were marked out well in advance.

Geale is now off to win the IBO title back or get the IBF title....make no mistake...when he gets one of these titles....Mundine
will fight him again

Yes I agree fighting Duddy would be much better that Falinga....you would need to look at risk reward and where you heading with the win...when I look at these you can understand why they wanted Lyell (Pavlik connection JL)
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