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Old 09-14-2007, 12:12 AM   #1
cardstars
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Default Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

Don't get me wrong here - I am also a Pavlik fan. He is an extremely fun boxer to watch. But a good point can be made that Taylor has fought the obviously better fighters and he may be better suited for the highly anticipated fight. Regardless of whether you think Taylor won or lost those fights, he has had much better competition. What do the Pavlik fans out there have to say about this? I highly doubt Taylor will stand and trade with Pavlik and Taylor has the speed to hit and run, so how does Pavlik win? If it goes to the cards we all know Pavlik is more than likely screwed, so how does Pavlik get his knockout?
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Old 09-14-2007, 12:44 AM   #2
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

Quote:
Originally Posted by brains
should i have read your thread? the title seems pretty worthless...Is there a reason , in your retarded logic, that Kelly Pavlik must beat boxers you have heard of in order to fight Jermain Taylor? Is it a requisite to have defeated some overrated has been in order to get a title shot?
Someone is always looking for a fight on this forum - your not going to get it! I just want opinions on how people see Pavlik getting the knockout (which seems to be the concensus choice). OBVIOUSLY he deserves the shot at it, but how does he win? I'm looking for more than just "knockout round 8", such as the post above yours
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Old 09-14-2007, 01:20 AM   #3
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

Anyone guessing who will win the fight is spitting in the wind. these are 2 great fighters and whoever is the better man on the 29th will win. it will certainly be exciting i cant wait..i was debating staying home and watching dawson vs romanian adrian on tv but had to go to atlantic zityyyyyyyyy
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Old 09-14-2007, 01:34 AM   #4
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

I say, if he beats Taylor??? That's the start of hi run!!!!


Miranda wasnt bad and everyone starts and progresses!! Pavlik's reached the limelight and if he captures??


What can you say against it??


Bring on the best after that
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Old 09-14-2007, 02:27 AM   #5
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

i believe pavlik will get his nose bloodied etc in stalking taylor in the early going, but i really feel that with pavliks combination of power, speed (in his hard one off shots), and decent reasonably sound boxing skills/defense, he will get closer and closer to taylor as the rounds go on.

if taylor's bad habit of carrying his guard low continues in this fight i think a combination on his chin will deck him and then pavlik will be all over taylor if he manages to get up. and he wont survive it if that happens as pavlik continues to prove he has great stamina. one of his biggest assets in any fight i feel. if taylor taste the power and wisely puts his guard up high i can see pavlik landing some impressive body shots. taylor is fit and no doubt will be able to absorb some of those shots, but for a very tall middleweight in pavlik, it's surprising it's a part of his arsenal. so either way pavlik WILL get to taylor via accumilation. headshots if taylor is frustrated, and bodyshots if taylor is in survival mode. the one thing that stands out with i think of pavlik from what i've seen is he has killer instinct. hence his great ko record.

also taylor relies too much on his atheletic ability to get in and out of a shootout/*******. in some ways he does more things wrong than pavlik! hands down low, telegraphs right hand, chin up high. crosses his feet etc.

also people think pavlik for the most part wings shots. in fact, it's taylor who wings shots more often than not. pavlik throws from every angle that i know of but yes he does get wild at times. but that still doesn't negate from the fact he can (and often) throws quick straight shots down the pipe.

after the spinks fight im am convinced taylor's power is quite average. also bernard managed to rattle taylor late in the first fight, and light hitting winky managed to pin him into a corner.

now while these fighters are good i must admit i doubt their capacity at the time of fighting taylor. ouma, winky and spinks are from junior mid or even welterweight! and bernard hopkins is now riding on his legend. as i said in some other posts. there seems to be a Seniors Tour going on these days because people are still amazed at what hopkins etc can do.... hopkins was never a big ko puncher but hurt taylor despite being 40! and his good win against tarver is good because tarver is nearly 40 himself! then he struggles a bit against winky who is much smaller and mid 30's. tarvers only big win came against a faded oldman jones! so it makes taylors life and death struggles with these PAST legends look great. hell, Ali, larry holmes etc where beaten by average fighters when they were ancient... so why should taylor be considered far superior to pavlik in "quality opponents" when they are old men?

tyson was ko'ed by mcbride. does that make mcbride a threat to wladimir? of course not!

taylor and pavlik are on the same level but with different strengths and weaknesses. however, i think pavliks desire is much stronger than taylors and that is what this fight will be won on.

so i say pavlik throws over a 100 punches per round. continues forward non-stop. he might get battered a little in the process but fighting while constantly going backwards will tire taylor fast. i also think taylor has been lulled into a sense false sense of security. just because pavlik isn't a "name", doesn't mean he wont wreck his world.

if anything, taylor fighting shells of former fighters and powder puff hitters from welterweight, has only softened him up. he will get a shock if he tries to trade. and if he hits and run, pavliks stamina will win that war too.
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Old 09-14-2007, 02:41 AM   #6
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

if anything, taylor fighting shells of former fighters and powder puff hitters from welterweight, has only softened him up. he will get a shock if he tries to trade. and if he hits and run, pavliks stamina will win that war too.[/quote]

Excellent post!

Most of you guys probably know more than I do, which is why I had to ask what your thoughts were cause I keep reading how Taylor has had the better competition, trainer, etc. If I was to give my opinion on how he hypothetically gets his knockout I would have said that Pavliks constant pressure eventually wears out Taylor who gets caught with his hands down once and thats all it takes. But then again what do I know?
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Old 09-14-2007, 04:50 AM   #7
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

People said the same stuff before Pavlik beat Miranda's ass. While Pavlik hasn't fought any A+ guys, Jermain Taylor has not fought any good punchers either. Taylor has fought some pretty tough, good fighters. It's not like he is being thrown into the deep end of the pool after being in the kiddie side. Guys like Zertuche,Zuniga and Miranda are respectable fighters.
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Old 09-14-2007, 05:13 AM   #8
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

For one, wever never seen Pavlik go 12 rounds. His a big guy and making the 160 lb limit cant be easy for him. Secondly he invests alot in his punches so he can possibly drown if Taylor takes it to the late rounds. Another thing, if you notice, Pavlik squares up alot and stops moving when he punches, Taylor hower moves well when fighting and his fast. So I think Taylor can get in and out and rack up a point victory. Im picking Taylor by SD but ill be rooting for Pavlik.
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Old 09-14-2007, 05:20 AM   #9
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

This fight kind of reminds me of when my man Ricky Hatton won the junior welter title against Tszyu. You've got a champion who is obviously more proven having faced high level competition against a challenger who is undefeated and whilst he has fought some decent opponents (for Zertuche, Zuniga and Miranda read Philips, Tackie, Magee and Oliveira) is stepping up to an entirely new level. Hatton rose to the challenge, can Pavlik?

The first thing that struck me about Pavlik is the guy is the biggest damn middleweight I have ever seen. He can obviously hit and Taylor won't be used to being the smaller man in the ring. That said, I just have a feeling Taylor, as is his wont, will find a way to win again. Don't know why, but should be a good one anyway.
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Old 09-14-2007, 07:25 AM   #10
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

Pavlik is only 25. He has fought more fights than Taylor at a much younger age. Of course a lot of them were stay busy and stepping fights. The same could be said of Taylor before he got to B-Hops. Pavlik has climbed the ladder one rung at a time, including 2 WBC eliminator bouts on HBO, and now it's rightly his turn to have a crack at the Championship. Just like Taylor and a lot of other Champions once you've reached the top of the ladder you're resume will get stronger and stronger.
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Old 09-14-2007, 07:27 AM   #11
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

2 WBC eliminator bouts on HBO! EXACTLY! The world will see soon.
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Old 09-14-2007, 07:53 AM   #12
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

If the fight stays on the outside its Jermaines fight. Taylors superior speed, athleticism and jab is leagues above Pavlik.

Pavlik has the worse defense and the slowest opponent taylor has fought since before he became champ. Expect Taylor to land allot more shots flush and expect to Taylor looking powerful, which he is when he lands flush. Taylors speed will also mean he should get his shots off first

Pavlik is being overated as a puncher, hes a good puncher but his main asset seems to be his pressure and stamina. We will look to pressure and keep a high volume up of constant aggression from round 1-12. This will give Taylor literally 100s of countering opportunitys.

Its an interesting 1 and I'm expecting Taylor to win and he might even get his first KO as champ.
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Old 09-14-2007, 08:15 AM   #13
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Default Re: Pavlik fans - what do you have to say about his lack of great opponents?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PACZ
2 WBC eliminator bouts on HBO! EXACTLY! The world will see soon.
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