Who was the most popular boxer to never win a world title?

[Beeston Brawler]

I think matchmaking is one of the reasons American followers always take the piss out of British boxers.

Our guys, even now, are so badly matched they often get to 25-0 (20 KO's) without facing an opponent capable of hitting them back.

The padding of these records gets them up the rankings before being brutally exposed at world level - see Jennings, Lockett etc for that.

Surely quality is what is more important than fighting every six weeks - Lennox Lewis had only 20 or so fights before going for the world title after just over three years as a pro, but in that time had cleaned house domestically and in Europe.

Ricky Hatton and Joe Calzaghe never really cleaned up domestically either, before going for world titles in their 39th fight - I don't recognise the WBO btw.

[AlFrancis]

Originally Posted by silverking

I don't recall Mason being as big a household name as Cooper & Bruno, who were known even by non-boxing fans. Doubt many people in the UK would remember him much today,whereas Cooper & Bruno in their heyday, were regular guests on TV shows as was another 60's British heavy Billy Walker.

Mason came from the Terry Lawless stable which was well known for building up fighters against non-threatening opposition. He was favoured to beat Lewis when they met, though I never knew why.

A lot of Bruno's popularity stems from his appearances on the BBC, who showed all his fights, many live. His knockabout relationship with commentator Harry Carpenter also helped. Carpenter tended to exaggerate the importance & calibre of his opponents which tended to turn Bruno into a world beater in the eyes of casual fans.

Cooper was very popular, a sort of housewives favourite. He was indeed a modest nice guy. He was well know long before the Ali fight though his knockdown of the great man turned him into a national icon. It was really the highlight of his career. His fights were regularly on TV which helped. In fairness he was a very good boxer & did have a knockout left hook. Unfortunately he was far from durable, cut easily & was knocked down many times in his career . I think the highest he was ever rated at world level was 2, though he was never good enough to match the leading US heavies. Definitely too good for the British & European crop of his era though.

The Bugner fight was a bad decision, most including myself thought Cooper won & poor old Joe, who started out popular but quickly became unpopular because of his cautious style & inablity to really deliver never recovered.

Yes Billy Walker was real big box office, also known as the golden boy and blond bomber. This was partly down to the BBC as well who screened an England vs USA amateur match which England won 10-0. Billy was the heavyweight and knocked out the 6foot4 Cornelius Perry to make himself a national hero overnight.

[essexboy]

Originally Posted by Beeston Brawler

I think matchmaking is one of the reasons American followers always take the piss out of British boxers.

Our guys, even now, are so badly matched they often get to 25-0 (20 KO's) without facing an opponent capable of hitting them back.

The padding of these records gets them up the rankings before being brutally exposed at world level - see Jennings, Lockett etc for that.

Surely quality is what is more important than fighting every six weeks - Lennox Lewis had only 20 or so fights before going for the world title after just over three years as a pro, but in that time had cleaned house domestically and in Europe.

Ricky Hatton and Joe Calzaghe never really cleaned up domestically either, before going for world titles in their 39th fight - I don't recognise the WBO btw.

I like this . But its not just Britain where this is happening, just look at some American fighters who get exposed after building an impressive record, Jeff Lacy being a case in point. In Britain you should clean out your division of all domestic rivals before being allowed to move onto the world scene so we can see how good they really are and perhaps add some experience along the way. Lets face it you learn more in a tough twelve rounder than you do in an early knockout, its not impressive to watch but your being tested.

[Beeston Brawler]

The public aren't daft though - I'd much prefer a tough ten rounder for no title than an early blowout for the WBO inter-alphabetty title.

Every show now is full of mismatches, that all go to points. If by some miracle a journeyman is competitive he gets robbed by the referee anyway

Americans are generally much better matched, and an early loss or two doesn't do the fighters any harm. A lot lower % of American fighters to fight at world level get exposed than ours, I'd say.

[djm]

Originally Posted by Beeston Brawler

The public aren't daft though - I'd much prefer a tough ten rounder for no title than an early blowout for the WBO inter-alphabetty title.

Every show now is full of mismatches, that all go to points. If by some miracle a journeyman is competitive he gets robbed by the referee anyway

Americans are generally much better matched, and an early loss or two doesn't do the fighters any harm. A lot lower % of American fighters to fight at world level get exposed than ours, I'd say.

I wouldn't agree with that - it's pretty universal to keep your guy's 0 pretty carefully protected. It worked for Aereola who never fought at a level above even, say, a UK domestic one and gets his shot (credit where it's due, though, Chambers has taken risks AND recovered from a loss). A guy like Berto was carefully managed to as easy a title-shot as possible. But in general, at most weights, there probably is a larger skill range to work within and hence better matchups.

There are weights, too, such as SMW/CW where your standard top-15 Euro-based fighter is better matched than a US-based one. They just don't get the credit for it over here.

[Beeston Brawler]

Yes - I think Arreola and Berto are examples of your theory.

Berto has proven at least that he is a good fighter in the period since he won the title, beating a better Urango pretty much as well as Hatton beat a green one, and shading (on the judges cards at least) an awkward Collazo.

Arreola is just a clubfighter - that will be proven next time around.

On your last point, which is very true, I'd like to see more fighters look to clean out the division at European level after winning their national titles - rather than defending the national titles multiple times or stepping up to world level too fast. A great advantage of being US based is the amount of opposition at appropriate levels to progress properly.

[ThinBlack]

Frank Fletcher is a good mention.

[Andyland]

Gaspar Ortega......the Friday night fights favorite

[thistle1]

Originally Posted by essexboy

For me it was Michael Watson and Herol Graham but I'm not sure they were universally popular.

for WATSON, beautiful boxer and all things considered may well have done it.

Graham overrated and had 2 or 3 shots so you can't really do him anymore courtesy!

Probably LEN HARVEY!!!

[Minotauro]

In England certainly Henry Cooper. Could very well be the most popular English boxer ever.

[lora]

Originally Posted by thistle1

for WATSON, beautiful boxer and all things considered may well have done it.

Graham overrated and had 2 or 3 shots so you can't really do him anymore courtesy!

Probably LEN HARVEY!!!

Watson had shots too and lost them all as well, you know.

In fact he had one more in his prime than Graham did imo.

[Senor Pepe']

Earnie Shavers,,,,,,,,,Everybody liked 'The Dark Destroyer'

George Chuvalo........A fan favorite

Jerry Quarry and Zora Folley were quite popular later in their careers.

Jose Luis Urtain in Spain

'Bepi' Ros in Italy

Henry Cooper in Great Britain

[KidDynamite]

Gerry Cooney

Was lauded as the next great "white hope" yet never accomplished anything

[LittleRed]

Has to be Charley Burley. Ray Robinson, a very popular boxer, was offered a career high payday to fight him something that could only happen if Burley was a big box office draw. Ray turned him down...

[Saltzy]

Butterbean is a great call actually. World wide recognition but never a serious contender.