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Old 09-26-2007, 01:48 PM   #16
Darien
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

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Originally Posted by The Kurgan
True. American Olympic athletes had just as ready access- if not moreso- to steroids and other "performance enhancing" substances as Soviet, East German and Bulgarian athletes, but were drastically inferior in most sports. The difference was that there were two big differences between American and Eastern European training: 1, the Soviets etc. picked their athletes from a very young age, put them in special sports-schools, and gave them both intense physical training and a huge degree of sports-focused training (which gave Eastern Bloc athletes a far degree of knowledge and initiative than their more robotic Western counterparts); and 2, speaking as someone who has done a lot of Russian/Bulgarian weightlifting routines, their train far harder. The Smolov squat routine, for instance, is about 11 weeks of high intensity, high frequency, high volume training.

These methods produced some of the most amazing results in sports history: the GDR by the 1970s and 1980s usually got significantly more gold medals than the USA, despite having only 16 million people and much smaller budgets for their training. The USSR won pretty much every Olympics; even after they broke up, the CIS (which didn't even contain every Soviet Republic) smoked the world at the 1992 Olympics. These nations were, in short, bad-ass factories that produced intelligent and supremely fit athletes.

The problem is that, if you're the "right" human shape, like Pavel or the Soviet track-and-field athletes, this will indeed give you a life-long healthy body. Pavel has to be getting on now, but there isn't a neck on this site that he couldn't snap in seconds (before doing some pull-ups on a wall and swinging some kettlebells around). If you're the "wrong" human shape, ie. out of the parameters that human organs and bones are designed for, like Vitali or Maskaev, there's probably trouble afoot. It doesn't help that many Eastern European fighters are getting a bit old, and old bodies are less capable of dealing with their intense training.

But injuries are hardly purely found amongst Eastern European boxers. Calzaghe has china hands, but is a Welshman of Italian descent. Holyfield, if you'd believe him, has barely ever had a fight without some injury or sickness, and he's an African-American. I suppose one thing that Holyfield, Calzaghe, Vitali, Maskaev etc. etc. all have in common is that they're gym-rats, which for all its benefits has its cost for the physical constitution.
Excellent post!
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Old 09-26-2007, 01:51 PM   #17
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

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Originally Posted by Relentless
i wouldn't be surprised if that was really true.
how gullible are you?
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Old 09-26-2007, 01:52 PM   #18
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

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Originally Posted by magnificentdave
What do you guys think of this statement?
Bob Arum is a ****ing idiot.
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Old 09-26-2007, 01:54 PM   #19
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

I don't know. I don't particularly care for the Eastern European fighters cuz of their boring styles and personalities but I'm not gonna speculate on whether they were using steroids or not. I am aware of how their sports program works and I will say that those guys work their asses off and take their boxing very seriously. It's no surprise that they've enjoyed the kind of olympic and professional success that they have to this point.
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Old 09-26-2007, 01:56 PM   #20
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

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Originally Posted by TanstA
Must be mad that Russians are the top dogs.

I can't speak on Vitali but Chagaev and Maskaev are natural heavyweights. They aren't ripped like Holyfield.

I dont even understand why he would even get into this.

The majority of russian athletes during the USSR days were naturally athletic. Nobody was fed anything.

If athletes wanted to bulk up, they could on their own just like people over here.
The fact remains that Eastern Europeans are genetically big strong people. Look at the strongman competitions, boxing, tennis, hockey, etc.. Even the fastest and strongest non black runners and b-ball players are from there.
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:00 PM   #21
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

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Originally Posted by Cruiser1
I don't know. I don't particularly care for the Eastern European fighters cuz of their boring styles and personalities but I'm not gonna speculate on whether they were using steroids or not. I am aware of how their sports program works and I will say that those guys work their asses off and take their boxing very seriously. It's no surprise that they've enjoyed the kind of olympic and professional success that they have to this point.
Boring styles? ... as in Golota-Bowe, Lewis-Vitaly? or Wlad's bombs? that's boring? And I don't understand what you mean by boring personalities... because they're class act athletes and they don't wear skirts in the ring? or act like rapper pimps?
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:02 PM   #22
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

I am of the opinion that the benefit of starting training at a young age, is that a young man's body can take SO much more than an older man. Mistakes can be fixed, you can be pushed VERY far.
When you get to the point far, far away from where you started, when you get older you will be that normal bit more aged and less athletic than your younger days, but your younger days will be that much better than the other guy's younger days.
Just a thought!
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:03 PM   #23
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

It wouldn't surprise me either. Not just Soviet athletes, but athletes from all over the globe.
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:07 PM   #24
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

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Originally Posted by Loufatski
Boring styles? ... as in Golota-Bowe, Lewis-Vitaly? or Wlad's bombs? that's boring? And I don't understand what you mean by boring personalities... because they're class act athletes and they don't wear skirts in the ring? or act like rapper pimps?
Of course man. How could I forget? Class act athletes who give their mandatories the run around and pull out of their fights at the last minute after cancellations or trying to outright avoid them. Stop picking at my posts. Just take a look at any press conference. They're ****ing BORING! These guys have zero personality. There must be some truth to what I'm saying cuz u responded and ur reaching with Bowe/Golota cuz Golota is a nutcase. He didn't even win either fight against Bowe. He couldn't finish him off cuz he's a mental case. Same with Vitali who had Lewis ready to go. He's not a mental case, just a bullshitter who can take notes from his brother on how to be a champion.
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:15 PM   #25
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

Has nothing to do with roids, US "atheltes" use them just as much, if not more, anyway. The injuries have something to with intense physical training over a long period of time. If you push your body to the limit from a young age for like 20 years it will eventually take its toll when you're approaching 40. US "athlets" usually just sit on their fat ass because they believe training is for talentless losers.
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:24 PM   #26
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

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Bob Arum: You know something, also, you’re going to see, at least for the next few years, a lot of injuries occurring in training to those fighters who were raised in the Soviet system. The reason for that is, as young athletes, they were fed steroids and their bodies are breaking-down from the steroids.
Well, considering how the "Soviet" system collapsed 17 years ago, unless this new crop was given roids at like age 6, I think it's a stupid, unsubstantiated statement.

I have no idea how clean the Russian and satellite republic programs are today, but just by looking at these guys, you'd have to not suspect roids.

Arum shouldn't just make statements out of his ass with zero documentation. Hate that.
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:39 PM   #27
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

might be true
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:45 PM   #28
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

i think streiods are more prevelant among all fighters. more so then we probably think. I have just learned to accept it. you are not going to stop them
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:45 PM   #29
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

It may be true in some cases but not all.
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Old 09-26-2007, 02:48 PM   #30
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Default Re: Soviet Fighters- Injuries

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Originally Posted by Cruiser1
Of course man. How could I forget? Class act athletes who give their mandatories the run around and pull out of their fights at the last minute after cancellations or trying to outright avoid them. Stop picking at my posts. Just take a look at any press conference. They're ****ing BORING! These guys have zero personality. There must be some truth to what I'm saying cuz u responded and ur reaching with Bowe/Golota cuz Golota is a nutcase. He didn't even win either fight against Bowe. He couldn't finish him off cuz he's a mental case. Same with Vitali who had Lewis ready to go. He's not a mental case, just a bullshitter who can take notes from his brother on how to be a champion.
This guy falls into the insecure/jealous Pole category.

Dont mind him.
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