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Old 09-27-2007, 03:07 PM   #46
Zakman
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by Boinko
Zakman, I'm starting to think you're not actually a real person, but a spam generator that automatically posts the same thing over and over in any thread that has Taylors name in the title.

Still waiting on the evidence that proves this HBO conspiracy you keep mentioning...
The evidence is right there in Taylor's record - he didn't get one, he didn't get two, he got THREE highly disputed decisions in a row. Once you can attribute to chance, maybe even twice you could attempt to explain away with other theories. Three in a row for the latest HBO flagship, and against established ATG fighters?? Don't be naive!

And, no I'm no spam generator - just a boxing fan who is OUTRAGED at the corruption underlying Taylor's unjustified seizure of the middleweight title. Fortunately, Kelly Pavlik will bring justice with his fists Saturday night. He's not just fighting for the title, he's fighting for the integrity of boxing itself!
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:07 PM   #47
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by Pimp C
Taylor is more tested than Pavlik IMO. Power is so overrated on ESB that's it's not even funny. People always tend to underrate things like defense, footwork and ring generalship all far more important than just power. Taylor was tested in the later rounds by an ATG in Hopkins in their first fight that but Pavlik facing an overrated limited crude slugger in Miranda is a harder test? When will people learn that power isn't the end all be all in boxing.
Pav is more tested against harder punchers, not better fighters.
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:07 PM   #48
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by Pimp C
Taylor is more tested than Pavlik IMO. Power is so overrated on ESB that's it's not even funny. People always tend to underrate things like defense, footwork and ring generalship all far more important than just power. Taylor was tested in the later rounds by an ATG in Hopkins in their first fight that IMO is a much harder test than facing an overrated limited crude slugger in Miranda. When will people learn that power isn't the end all be all in boxing.
They often learn the lesson after the fight is over. I'm quite expecting the fight with Pavlik to go the distance.
Right now, Kelly's performance against Miranda is in everyone's mind, and it's given Pavlik this status as a massive puncher who can't be stopped. Well, there is no way in hell that Jermain is going to employ a strategy like Miranda did. Miranda was incredibly sloppy and one dimensional. It doesn't mean Pavlik wasn't impressive, because he was, but I'm not using that fight as a guage of what'll happen on Saturday.
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:11 PM   #49
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by Zakman
The evidence is right there in Taylor's record - he didn't get one, he didn't get two, he got THREE highly disputed decisions in a row. Once you can attribute to chance, maybe even twice you could attempt to explain away with other theories. Three in a row for the latest HBO flagship, and against established ATG fighters?? Don't be naive!

And, no I'm no spam generator - just a boxing fan who is OUTRAGED at the corruption underlying Taylor's unjustified seizure of the middleweight title. Fortunately, Kelly Pavlik will bring justice with his fists Saturday night. He's not just fighting for the title, he's fighting for the integrity of boxing itself!
Again, that is not evidence, it's speculation.

As I've asked before, since you've mentioned both Hopkins fights as being gift decisions, please watch the first fight and tell we in what rounds Harold Lederman scored for Taylor that absolutely without certainty should have went to Hopkins. The fight is on Youtube. I'm not saying the Lederman decision is the end all be all, but it was very reasonable in my opinion.
And if you can't pinpoint any particular rounds, then it's a clear indication that the fight was close enough that a Taylor decision was justified.

Do you think a Taylor decision in their first fight was fair, even though you may not have scored it that way yourself?
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:15 PM   #50
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by Boinko
They often learn the lesson after the fight is over. I'm quite expecting the fight with Pavlik to go the distance.
Right now, Kelly's performance against Miranda is in everyone's mind, and it's given Pavlik this status as a massive puncher who can't be stopped. Well, there is no way in hell that Jermain is going to employ a strategy like Miranda did. Miranda was incredibly sloppy and one dimensional. It doesn't mean Pavlik wasn't impressive, because he was, but I'm not using that fight as a guage of what'll happen on Saturday.
Not to mention that Miranda's there to be hit! His defense is his face!!
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:16 PM   #51
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by Boinko
I'm quite expecting the fight with Pavlik to go the distance.
Right now, Kelly's performance against Miranda is in everyone's mind, and it's given Pavlik this status as a massive puncher who can't be stopped. Well, there is no way in hell that Jermain is going to employ a strategy like Miranda did. Miranda was incredibly sloppy and one dimensional. It doesn't mean Pavlik wasn't impressive, because he was, but I'm not using that fight as a guage of what'll happen on Saturday.
Right on the money, couldn't agree with you more. I think everyone is just jumping on that wagon based on the fight with Miranda. People need to realize, Taylor ain't going to come out like a careless drunk brawler like Zertuche or Miranda.
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:17 PM   #52
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

While Taylor has the obvious edge in experience I find it funny and ironic that in all of his tests, he does not have experience with a big puncher like Pavlik.

This fight may prove to be a newer experience for Taylor than for Pavlik in that regard.
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:20 PM   #53
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

Your right Taylor hasnt fought anyone with his power but,Taylor will not throw blows with this guy..hes gonna move around and frustrate him untill pavil leaves himself open then taylor will attack
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:22 PM   #54
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Your right Taylor hasnt fought anyone with his power but,Taylor will not throw blows with this guy..hes gonna move around and frustrate him untill pavil leaves himself open then taylor will attack
With Manny Steward in his corner now, I also expect to see him tying Pavlik up a lot, especially early on in the fight.
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:22 PM   #55
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by Ambition_Def
While Taylor has the obvious edge in experience I find it funny and ironic that in all of his tests, he does not have experience with a big puncher like Pavlik.
This fight may prove to be a newer experience for Taylor than for Pavlik in that regard.
That's why both men will be tested in their own way on Saturday. However, many still feel Taylor's tests overall as a boxer have been more difficult, and he has succeeded (maybe not as impressive as some would like); thus, giving him the title as the "undisputed middleweight champion of the world"
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:25 PM   #56
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by bachatu
That's why both men will be tested in their own way on Saturday. However, many still feel Taylor's tests as a boxer have been more difficult, and he has succeeded (maybe not as impressive as some would like); thus, giving him the title as the "undisputed middleweight champion of the world"
Which is why it's such an intriguing fight. The predictions seem to be split down the middle.
I'm getting more and more pumped for it.
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:28 PM   #57
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

Yeah I havent been this pumped for a fight in a long time... we need more fights like this in boxing. What is best is that its not on PPV... the way it should be.
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:32 PM   #58
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by Boinko
With Manny Steward in his corner now, I also expect to see him tying Pavlik up a lot, especially early on in the fight.
That won't work against Pavlik, he'll have to get too close.

You tie up short guys.
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:34 PM   #59
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

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Originally Posted by Boinko
Do you think a Taylor decision in their first fight was fair, even though you may not have scored it that way yourself?
No, I do not - and indeed it is the first Hopkins decision that gave rise to my outraged, which has only been compounded by the others. Hopkins was a long-time champ, and in a close fight should have - and WOULD have were it not for the influence of HBO and Hopkins' unpopularity with the boxing establishment - been given the benefit of the doubt on the scorecards. That he was not goes against all boxing tradition, and really caused me to question the legitimacy of this decision.

This was only compounded by the decision in the second fight, which, while seemingly closer, in my view should have gone to Hopkins. And then, the Wright fight, imo, simply sealed the deal - there is CLEARLY something rotten going on here.

I hate how this sport is corrupted by the influence of powerful TV networks and the big promoters like King. That's why I can't stand fighters like Ruiz or Taylor who attain statuses they wouldn't have otherwise achieved without the undue influence of corrupting forces. I will say this for Taylor, however - unlike Ruiz, at least he has SOME boxing ability. It won't be enough for him to beat a hard-hitting true middleweight like Pavlik, however.
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Old 09-27-2007, 03:34 PM   #60
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Default Re: Has Jermain Taylor Been Tested as Pavlik Was Tested Against Miranda?

it is true that Pavlik will be the first big puncher that Taylor has fought...and it's a test that i believe Taylor is prepared to pass, and look good doing it...Pavlik won't fight Taylor the same way he fought Miranda, he's seems to smart to make that mistake cuz Taylor would eat him with uppercuts on his way in, like he did to Joppy...Pavlik will box with Taylor aggressively, looking to land his right hand, but Taylor's speed will allow his jab to land first and control the pace...

even in a brawl Taylor's speed and athleticism gives him the advantage over Pavlik because Pavlik will be the more hittable fighter between the 2...i see Taylor stopping Pavlik because Pavlik will go above and beyond to get the victory, which will result in him taking big chances just to land his own power...people forget that Taylor has power also, but the difference here will be speed
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