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View Poll Results: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list? Post a Pol
Buchanon 49 55.68%
Calzaghe 39 44.32%
Voters: 88. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-22-2009, 11:46 AM   #31
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

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Originally Posted by Mantequilla View Post
BUchanan could have made about five hundred WBO defences were it around in his day, and he was allowed to duck Duran, Laguna, Dejesus etc..

then here finally steps up in 1982 well preserved form years of easy fights and secures his legacy with wins over espana, Mancini and a mighty struggle with Arguello that a sizable amount of people thought he lost.
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Old 12-22-2009, 12:17 PM   #32
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

as great a fighter lennox was joe remained unbeaten,lennox was ko'd by hasman when really the guy should have been destroyed by lennox and anyway lennox learnt to box in canada and usa so you cant really say hes the best uk fighter,get real ma man!
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Old 12-22-2009, 12:20 PM   #33
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

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Originally Posted by billy nelson View Post
as great a fighter lennox was joe remained unbeaten,lennox was ko'd by hasman when really the guy should have been destroyed by lennox and anyway lennox learnt to box in canada and usa so you cant really say hes the best uk fighter,get real ma man!
UNBEATEN MEANS **** ALL.

Buchanan was better. Hell, Benny Lynch may have lost a few but his wins over Small Montana and Peter Kane are comparable to the best wins on Calzaghe's resume IMO (especially when you consider that many feel Calzaghe lost against the best fighter he faced, I personally don't, I had Calzaghe winning 114-113 against B-Hop) but undefeated means shit all, otherwise Sven Ottke would be a great. Okay, Calzaghe at least was more impressive than Ottke, but it's the easiest way to get across that undefeated does not necessarily mean 'the best'.

In my opinion anyway
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Old 12-22-2009, 12:21 PM   #34
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

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Originally Posted by billy nelson View Post
as great a fighter lennox was joe remained unbeaten,lennox was ko'd by hasman when really the guy should have been destroyed by lennox and anyway lennox learnt to box in canada and usa so you cant really say hes the best uk fighter,get real ma man!
I'd accept that as a legitimate reason for not ranking Lewis as one of (if not the) best British fighter ever - of course depending on your interpretation.

Of course this principle must also apply to Bob Fitzsimmons.

But Calzaghe above him - sorry pal. No way.

If you can remain unbeaten, whilst fighting a solid list of top line fighters at or close to their primes, plus up and coming contenders - then that is one hell of an achievement.

Arsenal went unbeaten for a full PL season back in 2004 - and are rightly lauded for it. If they did it in the Championship or League 1..... not quite the same.

JC only mixed at world level at the fag end of his career, barring the odd fight here and there. Hardly the makings of an ATG!

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Old 12-22-2009, 01:01 PM   #35
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

It depends on wether you are ranking them on resume or what you actually thought of them as a fighter.

Joe's resume could obviously be better but you can also argue both ways as to wether that was his fault or not.

I judge fighters on their skill, their will to win, their chin and wether they entertain me.

For these reasons I rank Joe highly. I also think Joe would have hung with any SMW at their primes. People will say RJJ would have one in his prime but I disagree from what I saw on both.

There are lots of fighters like this where you are never going to get people to agree on anything.

I sometimes feel these threads are started purely as a forum for people to have a pop at Calzaghe but maybe I'm paranoid!
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Old 12-22-2009, 01:05 PM   #36
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?



Buchanan taking a prime 135 Duran to the 13th eclipses Calzaghes best win
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Old 12-22-2009, 01:08 PM   #37
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

Edwin Viruet, Leoncio Ortiz, Ray Lampin and Vilomar Fernandez did that too. Medal of honour for them all !
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Old 12-22-2009, 01:10 PM   #38
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Old 12-22-2009, 01:19 PM   #39
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

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Originally Posted by Lee Mc View Post
It certainly has but, that said, I think his Ring Championship successes at 168 and 175 judge edge it for me. (But only just).

I think Calzaghe's legacy is going to be based almost soley on those two belts than anything else. Due to Mikkell Kessler's defeat to Andre Ward, Roy Jone's capitulation to Danny Green and Jeff Lacy's inability to win more than a round against Jones his reputation has taken a bit of a beating but, that said, Hopkins' performance against Pavlik and the fact that he, Hopkins, could probably still beat most light-heavyweights in the world, has made Joe Calzaghe's victory over him even more impressive.

Hopkins won that fight easily.
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Old 12-22-2009, 02:13 PM   #40
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

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Are you actually being serious here?

You are usually a fairly clued up poster in terms of knowledge etc.. but this is just bizzare. Buchanan higher and insulting me? Confirm this isn't a wind up.
Bizzare!? How? Clearly a more talented fighter than Joe and is 2 wins over Laguna inferior to one win over Hopkins?
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Old 12-22-2009, 02:24 PM   #41
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

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Originally Posted by Beeston Brawler View Post
****ing hell Billy - if you post some of what your smoking to me it will get here for Chrimbo

Start with Lennox Lewis at the top and work your way down

As for the question........ Buchanan, pretty clearly.

Calzaghe's record looks great on paper but in terms of substance there ain't a great deal - most of his title defences were against has-beens or never-wheres, as for his later wins, Lacy it could be argued never won another fight bar Manfredo, Hopkins IMO beat him, Jones was irrelevant by that stage, though Kessler is a solid win.

To be perfectly frank, his resume is hardly any better than Ricky Hatton's - take out the two losses and substitute them with wins over, say, Witter and Bradley - who might have been alternate opponents at the time..... I'd say Hatton might edge him out, even though Calzaghe is/was more talented.

Placing Joe at the top is basing an awful lot on assumption rather than fact.

Hater. Your just jealous of him.
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Old 12-22-2009, 02:30 PM   #42
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

Jeffro is not a Buchanan fan. I think you even rate Calzaghe above him, don't you Jeffro? That speaks volumes...
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Old 12-22-2009, 02:39 PM   #43
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

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Jeffro is not a Buchanan fan. I think you even rate Calzaghe above him, don't you Jeffro? That speaks volumes...
I have to say yes, I don't see it with Buchanan- Unless i'm missing something laguna is not particuarly impressive. Neither on film or statistically.

Buchanon and Calzaghe share in the fact that both look pretty poor on film (in ATG terms). However due to me having a better knowlege of the 90's and 00's I can at least term some of Calzaghe's victories credible.

I really don't care for either fighter, technically Buchanon h2h is probably better but Calzaghe was a punching machine who we never saw the best of at top level. Its a close call, both are over-rated.

Lewis poons both.
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Old 12-22-2009, 02:41 PM   #44
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?

I put JC above Lennox Lewis...

Firstly JC has always been a British fighter...not a fighter who has represented another Country...

People are talking about JC fighting people when they are way past there best...Would have Lennox have lived with Tyson between 87-89...?...not a chance...

Did Lewis ever school another World Champ the way that JC schooled Lacy...?...
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Old 12-22-2009, 02:44 PM   #45
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Default Re: Do you currently have Calzaghe or Buchanan higher in you British ATG list?



Lacy
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