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View Poll Results: How many matches would Archie Moore win vs the listed ten all time greats at 175 ?
1 0 0%
2 1 2.78%
3 0 0%
4 2 5.56%
5 8 22.22%
6 9 25.00%
7 8 22.22%
8 6 16.67%
9 2 5.56%
10 0 0%
Voters: 36. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-02-2007, 06:08 AM   #1
Mendoza
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Default How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters all time greats at light heavyweight! Take the poll. I thought the Liston thread was a success, however I get the hunch some posters voted 1 or 10 for personal reasons. You can vote however you choose this time, but it’s a public thread.

The ten fighters are:

Bob Fitzsimmons
Sam Langford
Jack Dillion
Tommy Loughran
Gene Tunney
Maxie Rosenbloom
Ezzard Charles
Bob Foster
Mike Spinks
Roy Jones
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Old 10-02-2007, 06:59 AM   #2
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

I voted for 7.

The ones I think he would lose to are Langford, Charles and Spinks. I think that Jones and Tunney are around 50/50 but I lean towards Moore.
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Old 10-02-2007, 07:46 AM   #3
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McGrain
I voted for 7.

The ones I think he would lose to are Langford, Charles and Spinks. I think that Jones and Tunney are around 50/50 but I lean towards Moore.
Intersting. If you think Morre likely losses three, and the other two are close to " 50/50 ", it is unlikely he wins both of the " 50/50 matches ". It might be best to say he wins one of the 50/50 matches, and vote for " 6 ".
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Old 10-02-2007, 07:58 AM   #4
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendoza
Intersting. If you think Morre likely losses three, and the other two are close to " 50/50 ", it is unlikely he wins both of the " 50/50 matches ". It might be best to say he wins one of the 50/50 matches, and vote for " 6 ".
Statistically you are undoubtedly correct - i based my vote upon which fighter I would be leaning towards on the respective fight-nights, and all things being equal I would go for Moore in these fights.
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Old 10-02-2007, 08:01 AM   #5
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

I'd go for 4-5

Bob Fitzsimmons - Moore probably slicker but this is a 50-50 with Fitz amazing power and Archies chin

Sam Langford - Langfords pressure and compact punching would get to Moore imo.

Jack Dillion - Moore UD

Tommy Loughran - Moore UD, that little bit better

Gene Tunney - I'd edge towards Tunney UD but a true battle of slick boxing where Moore

Maxie Rosenbloom - Moore UD

Ezzard Charles - Charles wins AGAIN

Bob Foster - 50-50 KO either way, edge towards Moore, maybe both get kd'ed

Mike Spinks - Spinks UD

Roy Jones - Jones makes Moore look like Toney
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Old 10-02-2007, 08:06 AM   #6
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerPuncher
Bob Fitzsimmons - Moore probably slicker but this is a 50-50 with Fitz amazing power and Archies chin
Of course power was only part of Fitz's lethal equation. It also seems he was very clever about bringing people onto those shots, controlling the space. Here he is in with a fighter who is likely to be able to out-smart him. I think Moore has the smarts to stay out of trouble for the UD.

Quote:
Roy Jones - Jones makes Moore look like Toney
I could see why Jones might be a reasonable pick over Moore but with Moore's edge in power-chin ration at this weight the fight would have to go an awful lot like you've suggested for Jones to win - and I don't see it. Jones made a weight-drained Toney look pretty bad but Moore is to smart to get involved in that kind of action IMO. Once again I think that Moore's smarts could save him from that kind of loss. If he can bring Jones onto him he can stop him. I think he could do it.
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Old 10-02-2007, 09:36 AM   #7
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

Nine! But only if he wasn't affected by the wear and tear of each fight, and if Moore was at his peak. And by saying he'd 'win' them, I mean I would favour him. Moore might be 80/20 over Bob Fitzsimmons but 60/40 over Gene Tunney.
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Old 10-02-2007, 10:25 AM   #8
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

5 or 6.

I'd give Langford, Charles, Spinks, Jones and Tunney all a good chance of defeating him (though it wouldn't be easy by any stretch).

Moore beats the others at LHW, although Fitz's power might just prove an equaliser in their matchup.
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Old 10-02-2007, 12:36 PM   #9
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

I think he would win all besides Charles, Langford, Jones (terrible match stylistically for Moore) and maybe Tunney although I would favor Moore slightly.
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Old 10-02-2007, 12:44 PM   #10
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

The two who would give him the most trouble are Jack Dillon and Ezzard Charles.
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Old 10-02-2007, 01:26 PM   #11
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McGrain
1. Of course power was only part of Fitz's lethal equation. It also seems he was very clever about bringing people onto those shots, controlling the space. Here he is in with a fighter who is likely to be able to out-smart him. I think Moore has the smarts to stay out of trouble for the UD.

2. I could see why Jones might be a reasonable pick over Moore but with Moore's edge in power-chin ration at this weight the fight would have to go an awful lot like you've suggested for Jones to win - and I don't see it. Jones made a weight-drained Toney look pretty bad but Moore is to smart to get involved in that kind of action IMO. Once again I think that Moore's smarts could save him from that kind of loss. If he can bring Jones onto him he can stop him. I think he could do it.
I seriously think Moore is 1 of the most overrated P4P fighters ever based on his longevity. His performance against the very best seems to come up short time and again and he lost to many smaller fighters. Yes he is an excellent fighter but a class lower than the ultra elite of the sport

1. I'm not an expert on Fitz, he was an excellent fighter by all means.

2. RJJ did have a habit of making very good fighters look a class below. And RJJ would be every bit the puncher in this fight as Moore was.

Why do people talk about RJJs chin and neglect to mention Moores chin problems? Moore was ko'd 7 times, including ko losses in his prime and ko'd by Bivins, Booker, Morrow, Charles, Patterson, Marciano. RJJ hit harder than most of these and his speed and accuracy means he will land more.
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Old 10-02-2007, 01:42 PM   #12
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerPuncher
I seriously think Moore is 1 of the most overrated P4P fighters ever based on his longevity. His performance against the very best seems to come up short time and again and he lost to many smaller fighters. Yes he is an excellent fighter but a class lower than the ultra elite of the sport

1. I'm not an expert on Fitz, he was an excellent fighter by all means.

2. RJJ did have a habit of making very good fighters look a class below. And RJJ would be every bit the puncher in this fight as Moore was.

Why do people talk about RJJs chin and neglect to mention Moores chin problems? Moore was ko'd 7 times, including ko losses in his prime and ko'd by Bivins, Booker, Morrow, Charles, Patterson, Marciano. RJJ hit harder than most of these and his speed and accuracy means he will land more.

Fair points. Fitz, Foster, Jones, Langford, and Spinks hit just as hard as or harder than some guys who put Moore down and out. Moore could very well lose some of these matches by knockout.

I think Moore wins about 5 or 6 matches here. None of the matches would be easy for Moore.
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Old 10-02-2007, 03:19 PM   #13
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendoza
Fair points. Fitz, Foster, Jones, Langford, and Spinks hit just as hard as or harder than some guys who put Moore down and out. Moore could very well lose some of these matches by knockout.

I think Moore wins about 5 or 6 matches here. None of the matches would be easy for Moore.
The opposite is also true of everyone except Spinks. Moore hit as hard or harder than men who ko'd Fitz, Foster, Jones, and Langford. And Spinks did not meet nearly as many tough punchers as Moore and Langford did.

I picked Langford, Tunney, Charles, and Spinks to beat Moore, and I think that he should be the underdog against Tunney and Charles. Langford, though, is a very close call. His record is as speckled with defeats as Moore's and in the end Moore's winning and knockout percentages were considerably better, even discarding all the NC and draws on Langford's record. I judge Moore as having a real good chance with Langford.

Last edited by OLD FOGEY; 10-03-2007 at 03:44 AM.
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Old 10-02-2007, 06:01 PM   #14
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

beats loughran, Rosenbloom. dillion, foster,
loses to Fitz, langford, Tunney, Charles, Jones(?) spinks....
or all ten could be the other way around. Damn, this was hard.
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Old 10-02-2007, 06:21 PM   #15
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Default Re: How many does Archie Moore win vs the following ten fighters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerPuncher
Why do people talk about RJJs chin and neglect to mention Moores chin problems? Moore was ko'd 7 times, including ko losses in his prime and ko'd by Bivins, Booker, Morrow, Charles, Patterson, Marciano. RJJ hit harder than most of these and his speed and accuracy means he will land more.
Much of what you say is true but what must be said is that Moore literally dozens of contests with top 1% opposition. Jones had, what - arguably one? Count weight-drained Toney for two. Of course he was KO'd a few times.

Moore is the puncher in this fight. He is the all-time KO king fighting at his best weight. Jones is an all time talented slickster fighting one weight above his best, the same weight where he was KO'd by fighters a whole level below the guys who KO'd Moore.

I don't object to your pick - Jones is a monster H2H, and anyone claiming to be 100% sure about this one on fight night is a mook - but I do think you underestimate Moore a little bit.

Have another look at him when you get time.
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