Boxing  

Forum Home Boxing Forum European British Classic Aussie MMA Training
Go Back   Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Boxing Training/Amateur Boxing


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-19-2010, 05:24 PM   #16
LP_1985
JMM beat Pac-Man 3 Times
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Vicente Carrillo Fuentes Organization HQ, Home of Team Mexico
Posts: 15,044
vCash: 75
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

Quote:
Originally Posted by keure View Post
where im at the pro coaches are only there in the am, the nights are amateur hour and there is a distinct difference in the coaches and the atmosphere, and its not right, because you need a proper foundation from the beginning in boxing to be succesfull, i got pretty lucky because the first gym i went to was a small hardcore gym in an inner city, where there were never more than 6 or 7 of us at a time so everyone got proper attention specifically the ones that were just starting
have u boxed pro then. sometimes when its just seniors with only have 4 or 5 but sometimes 8 9 10. only been to 1 gym so cant compere to others
LP_1985 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 01-19-2010, 05:28 PM   #17
luciuslim
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: The Cliffs of Denver
Posts: 1,137
vCash: 1150
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

i agree with your post to a point , a lot of guys who have maybe had a few amerature fights and watch boxing on tv all of a sudden think that they are qualified to guide a young boxer through the ropes, but it also depends a lot on where you live obviously known "boxing citys" will have more dedicated trainers and also you have to look around a lot from personal experience i know that there are certain trainers that are just not going to fit with you.
luciuslim is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 05:35 PM   #18
roversbowers
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: bristol, england
Posts: 1,473
vCash: 2844
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

some interesting comments here
roversbowers is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 05:44 PM   #19
snakevanduff
newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: uk
Posts: 18
vCash: 1000
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

Quote:
Originally Posted by bald_head_slick View Post
That is basically out of the question in the States. Isn't there a retirement age and pay system for retirees in the UK? Also, isn't public transit pretty good? Not so in the States.

Retire and for most folks it is welcome to poverty. Not too many old folks that can even think of working for free. Here a bus ride is like an hour in each direction for 5 minutes by car. Insane.
yes there is , we look after our oldies lol. i think it has more to do with the area i live in (south wales) . there's several gyms in my local area all within 25 minutes walk and the gym my little brother trains at has several trainers who work 9-5 jobs but still coach in the evenings three times a week . i trained in a few martial arts before i went boxing and always felt it was more of a buisness rather than pure love of the sport . same can be said for our amature football and rugby coaches .
looking at this thread i feel pretty lucky to of grown up where i did .

i know what some guys were said in previous posts though , whenever i go home i try and go with my bro to the gym and i get tottaly left alone and i do feel a bit out of place at the ripe old age of 23 which is a shame .
snakevanduff is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 05:48 PM   #20
Rhino718
M.O.B.
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,870
vCash: 1000
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

I do some boxing and agree that the trainers in there gyms are like every other business person that I have come across. They want a lot of customers and want to do little work. But to a point I kind of understand where they are coming from. Most of the people they train are not serious, and are far from potential world champions. So the combination is very bad. All these guys do is give a little cardio session and put little emphisis on technique. I was fortunate to learn from a close friend who competed in the NY golden gloves. I look in awe when I see some people in the gym trowing the widest punches ive ever seen, not moving thier head at all and not even tucking their chins with there hands up. IMO a serious person would have to start very young and train with people who care for no $ involved.
Rhino718 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 05:50 PM   #21
20a87
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,365
vCash: 3071
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

In the uk the coaches do it for the love of the sport but this I find is possible because gyms are not open all day maybe 2 hours or something
20a87 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 05:55 PM   #22
nip102
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 987
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

Quote:
Originally Posted by 20a87 View Post
In the uk the coaches do it for the love of the sport but this I find is possible because gyms are not open all day maybe 2 hours or something
same in ireland plus there seems to be more gyms opening up here
nip102 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 05:57 PM   #23
nip102
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 987
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

Quote:
Originally Posted by luciuslim View Post
i agree with your post to a point , a lot of guys who have maybe had a few amerature fights and watch boxing on tv all of a sudden think that they are qualified to guide a young boxer through the ropes, but it also depends a lot on where you live obviously known "boxing citys" will have more dedicated trainers and also you have to look around a lot from personal experience i know that there are certain trainers that are just not going to fit with you.
do you not have do to teaching courses
nip102 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 06:01 PM   #24
wuzupman
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 754
vCash: 1000
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

Quote:
Originally Posted by dabox View Post
hi i live in toronto and i have boxed on and off for 15 years i guess and i have also done other combat sports like bjj,wrestling and a bit of muay thai...

i am 28 and as i have grown up i have noticed there are less boxing gyms then when i started and before i started there were more boxing gyms then when i started and i started to think of why......


first mma and other martial arts/sports are not really to blame

boxing coaches are......

i always had a strong passion for boxing and many of friends are also into boxing/mma etc


but here is the thing i have noticed from my own experience and of others i have spoken too...

the reason less boxing gyms are capable of being open are the ****ing so called coaches we have in north america.

example: many guys come to start boxing and are all happy but that happiness quickly goes away when day after day you have some grumpy
old and usually over weight guy telling you..."yeah kid go hit the back for 6 round and show box before that"
once in a while he might come tell use the jab more lol if your lucky

and if you compete then once a ****ing week he might give you a couple rounds of pad work.....

but most of the time you could be doing everything wrong but as long as thumping the heavy way or skipping it's all good.....


i remember i brought quite a few of my friends into the boxing gyms i trained at and they got feed up after a few mouths and left...some of these guys were tough guys with potental....


i remember when i was about 21 or so i got feed up as well after years of this and i started doing brazilian jiu-jitsu and my first class was an eye opener....
here i was paying the same as in boxing but i was actually being taught moves, we drilled the moves, sparred, had 2 coaches walking around fixing mistakes, this was my start....

as i got better and better, and did less classes....the coaches still came around fixed the mistakes and give advice even to the most advanced guys and we worked on stuff etc....


i did bjj for about 4 years straight and still go here and there,
when i did wrestling and thai boxing, i noticed again in those sports from beginners to advancedd fighters were still paid attention too.


even in non mma martials(mma martial arts aka those that work lol are bjj,boxing,wrestling,thai boxing and sometimes judo,sambo or kyoushin etc)

so even in stuff like takewondo and karate which does not work well, you still have someone paying attention to you and teaching,

point is you still getting something for you money....


back to boxing my fav sport and the one i am the most skilled at,

i go to the gym and pay 100 dollars a mouth to hit a ****ing heavy bag and teach my friend because the coach sit around doing nothing....but complain about not getting any students...
they even sometimes give me angry looks if i try help out a beginner by giving tips etc.....


dont blame mma, in fact i have noticed a lot of students sign up to boxing now because of mma....reason being they want to have good hands for that sport....


these coaches dont really coach anything and people get bored and frustrated and leave, and other go to these other sports where they are treated some that matters...


and the ones that stay often are not that well schooled and it is one the reason why you have better schooled europeans schooling fighters from here, because boxing is quite different there


but as a result of having less great fighters, the sports gets less popular...


remember this is not 1950 where you have to prove something to some fat coach so you can actually start getting something for the money you paid to train there, these days johhnny nobody will just go to the muay thai school across the street and you won't money to pay rent...end of story


i hope you have some comments

thanks
next time check your writing, I couldn't understand shit of what you were saying.
wuzupman is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 06:05 PM   #25
nip102
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 987
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

Quote:
Originally Posted by dabox View Post


i go to the gym and pay 100 dollars a mouth to hit a ****ing heavy bag and t
you really pay 100 a month what a rip off here was me thinking my 40 was dear
nip102 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 06:17 PM   #26
Predicto
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,719
vCash: 1000
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

Toronto is a shit town for boxing these days imo... Big fights (even in Quebec) get zero coverage in the local media... You're hard pressed to find a bar showing the big fights anymore... Nobody seems to give a shit about the sport,,, least of all the young kids.

Without the kids coming in, and wanting to learn the sport and compete seriously in the amatures with the help of real accredited trainers, the whole scene starts to stagnate.

Real coaches aren't going to hang around too long once things start going south, and the bills aren't being paid etc... Then you're left with the degenerates with nothing better to do, who would rather sit on their asses and talk shit than give some kid a few pointers. (unless somebody waves $$ at them) ... Next thing you know, it becomes a dead-beat scene, there's no money coming in, and before long another gym is closing down for good...
At least, thats the way I saw it in the east-end anyway.

Now, here's a guy with all your experience, paying $100 a month to hit the bags???
It's a Bum Deal if you ask me. Good thing I'm too old to fight anybody!

I pay $35 a month for a fitness gym now thats 10 times nicer than any boxing club I ever saw... And I can still hit the heavybag.... And the scenery is alot nicer too!
Predicto is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 06:19 PM   #27
mightyd40
Spartan
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: otown
Posts: 1,135
vCash: 1000
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

good news, my friends new boxing gym opens in syracuse ny starting feb 1st so thatll give boxing a little more attention at least.
mightyd40 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 06:46 PM   #28
spooky
Gatekeeper
ESB Full Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 313
vCash: 1000
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

Quote:
Originally Posted by bald_head_slick View Post
I agree and disagree. I agree about the attitude of many coaches. My coach seemed evil, from a distance. I knew nothing and was thinking, "why won't this guy help me?" I then stopped thinking about him, hit some of the group classes, did tons of rope, shadow, and bag work and THEN he started talking to me. So I agree in the sense that sometimes boxing coaches are a bit "stand-offish" however I would counter that boxing is very different than other "contact" sports.

I think BJJ and the other contact sports are "different" in that you can "fake" them and/or perform them in a "friendly" state. Rolling around tapping each other gives a guy his contact sport fix and hey, tapping is cool and accepted. Great move, let's roll some more. This is the genius of the training system. Two horribly unevenly matched guys can get no the mat and the "scrub" lives to tell the tale. Even the other sports you mentioned are more about the Art than the Martial, belts systems, katas etc... I say this as a person who loves, respects, and does BJJ.

Boxing, even at its lowest level (in your own gym), is a rough sport. It also contains what I believe to be the toughest training system and I don't say this as a compliment. It is a detriment to the sport. The boxing system is set up to chew up physically and mentally weak people as "Work". If a guy is ripping you up in there what do you do? Take a knee? Lose all form and get a concussion (even with headgear)? There is NO acceptable "out" in boxing even in training. That is OK in a 1930s slum not for an office worker. Today the "casual practitioner" keeps the lights on.

I think the frustration you feel is you actually ignoring the fact... It is almost impossible to "casually" box. If a guy can't move, keep his hands up, judge distance, and punch at a minimum to keep a guy from mauling him he is literally useless as a student of boxing. I think the coaches know this. This is why they tell you to do that stuff other stuff first. You can't get anything out of getting pounded. You need the foundation first. BJJ is the exact opposite.

Mind you I don't even mean 5 rounds. Most guys walking in off of the street, in America at least, can't do 3-2 minute rounds without being on the edge of throwing up. Sadly, that will get you KTFO even in headgear and 16 oz gloves.

Most boxing gyms must exist with two types of customer, the Cardio Box Crew and a Hardcore Crew. One set keeps the lights on. The other set is there to up their game. I agree with you though, coaches can step up and keep the "Casual Practitioner" interested. They must. If not the Sweet Science will be a Sweet Memory.
Well put
spooky is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 07:15 PM   #29
spooky
Gatekeeper
ESB Full Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 313
vCash: 1000
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

i started late (age 21). The first gym i tried wouldnt give me the time of day. He trained the kids and took them to all the am shows.

2nd gym. I was the only white kid in the place. I dont remember the head trainer saying more than 10 words to me in three months. Needless to say i left due to the fact i was uncomfortable and not getting any training, tips, advice, ect.

3rd gym. to avoid going bankru pt they turned into mma, karate, women aerobic boxing crap. not much motivation for me, someone trying to train for fights.

4th. Now im at a gym were I can train hard and spar with top amatuers and some pro's. the problem here is the coach has his favorites. example... he spends most of his time with his 15 yrs son (nationally ranked) and the pro (journeymen at best). They were real excited about me untill He found out im not elligable for amatuers (i did several toughman tournaments when i first started). Now i get no real training/attention.

In conclusion. Without proper coaching and a late start at this sport i am now faced with going pro or sticking with toughman(gay-not real boxing). I have more natural talent than anyone in my gym and can cause the pro's much trouble in sparring. I only wish i would have started young.
spooky is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2010, 10:25 PM   #30
dabox
Gatekeeper
ESB Full Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 369
vCash: 1000
Default Re: less and less boxing gyms...why??? here is the reason

Quote:
Originally Posted by bald_head_slick View Post
I agree and disagree. I agree about the attitude of many coaches. My coach seemed evil, from a distance. I knew nothing and was thinking, "why won't this guy help me?" I then stopped thinking about him, hit some of the group classes, did tons of rope, shadow, and bag work and THEN he started talking to me. So I agree in the sense that sometimes boxing coaches are a bit "stand-offish" however I would counter that boxing is very different than other "contact" sports.

I think BJJ and the other contact sports are "different" in that you can "fake" them and/or perform them in a "friendly" state. Rolling around tapping each other gives a guy his contact sport fix and hey, tapping is cool and accepted. Great move, let's roll some more. This is the genius of the training system. Two horribly unevenly matched guys can get no the mat and the "scrub" lives to tell the tale. Even the other sports you mentioned are more about the Art than the Martial, belts systems, katas etc... I say this as a person who loves, respects, and does BJJ.

Boxing, even at its lowest level (in your own gym), is a rough sport. It also contains what I believe to be the toughest training system and I don't say this as a compliment. It is a detriment to the sport. The boxing system is set up to chew up physically and mentally weak people as "Work". If a guy is ripping you up in there what do you do? Take a knee? Lose all form and get a concussion (even with headgear)? There is NO acceptable "out" in boxing even in training. That is OK in a 1930s slum not for an office worker. Today the "casual practitioner" keeps the lights on.

I think the frustration you feel is you actually ignoring the fact... It is almost impossible to "casually" box. If a guy can't move, keep his hands up, judge distance, and punch at a minimum to keep a guy from mauling him he is literally useless as a student of boxing. I think the coaches know this. This is why they tell you to do that stuff other stuff first. You can't get anything out of getting pounded. You need the foundation first. BJJ is the exact opposite.

Mind you I don't even mean 5 rounds. Most guys walking in off of the street, in America at least, can't do 3-2 minute rounds without being on the edge of throwing up. Sadly, that will get you KTFO even in headgear and 16 oz gloves.

Most boxing gyms must exist with two types of customer, the Cardio Box Crew and a Hardcore Crew. One set keeps the lights on. The other set is there to up their game. I agree with you though, coaches can step up and keep the "Casual Practitioner" interested. They must. If not the Sweet Science will be a Sweet Memory.


i agree with some stuff but you but DISAGREE with a lot of it....

you thing boxing is the roughest/toughest sport there,

my friend go to a wrestling practice, you will get worked 3 times hard then boxing....
i wrestled for a year and trust me it is a rougher sport then boxing,
you think getting punched is all brutal and stuff, try getting thrown and slammed over and over again....

see what you think, not mention the rate of injury is much higher then boxing....i dislocated my shoulder there preety badly and had to get surgery....


and about casually boxing, you make a good point...
but i dont casual box, i must say i am preety good and did have sparred national canadian champions(pro and amauter) and did ok with

but you mention about know how to move, keeping distance etc
the thing is most people dont get taught much of any of it


and about chewing the mentally weak etc, i dont think not teaching your students a ****ing thing is a weak of doing it....

a person getting bored to death is not mentally weak, just bored

i like how some people like to make excuses for lazy coaches
dabox is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Reply

Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Boxing Training/Amateur Boxing

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Boxing News 24 Forum 2013