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Old 02-26-2010, 07:50 AM   #61
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Nah Marcus, we need uglier.

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Old 02-26-2010, 08:04 AM   #62
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Old 02-26-2010, 08:16 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by kflex101 View Post
Ranser and Gilly, I can probably help you out here, as I own two supplement companies in Australia, with my job, amongst other things being responsible for formulation and development of all our products.

My education is in Science and I've been doing this kind of thing for about 5 years, obviously being on here I'm a boxing fan from way back. I have a personal interest here too as I was a typical ectomorph (skinny guy), however with a strict eating and training plan, managed to put on 24kg of weight over 5 years, with the large majority being muscle.

This is not easy but if you stick to a plan then results will come.

As some of the other fella's have said, good nutrition whether your goals are putting on muscle or cutting up for a competition starts with a good meal plan based around whole foods.
Supplements should merely be used to "supplement" the diet, with that being said, proteion powders do fit the catergory of a food rather than a supp in many ways as Nutritionally speaking, they contain fats, carbs and protein with naturally occuring vitamins and minerals very much there.

If you can start by posting up your diet, (give as much info as possible) as well as the amount of exercise you are doing, your current weight as well as your target weight then I'll do my best to give some advice.

We may have to look at your weight training too, if you are doing a typical 'beach" style 3 x 8 sets, straight outta the magazine kind of training protocal we can likely improve on that a lot.

If it does come to supps, I can highly recommend our brands as one of which is the most econmoical in Australia, with the other being Australia's purest range of supplements.

Gilly, your problems could be related to meal timing, types of food you eat or simply the amount of calories you are taking in.
Can you also itemise your meal and training in this thread? There are certainly some very effective products which assist recovery, without adding superfulous nutrients (particularly carbohydrates) but best look at your diet first.
hey mate thanks for taking the time out to help.
DIET
9am-2 weet-bix full cream milk tea spoon suger
10am-yogurt or a peace of friut
1pm-sandwich on wholemeal bread ham lettus cheese avocado
2pm-banana or choclate bar
8pm-steak or chicken & veg 4x a week stir fry or pasta the other nights

I drink a good 2 liters of water a day also a class of juice & cordial.i dont drink tea or coffee but i drink thos damn energy drinks about 3 a week.

EXERCISE
its a hard one cos its all over the place
7am-3 x a week road runs with hill sprints total of 45mins
MONDAY-5pm basic boxing training.skipping,shadow boxing,exercises,1kg hand weights **** load of different reps,bag work,pad work.
TUESDAY-3pm boxing skills & drills
WEDNESDAY-same as monday
THURSDAY-4pm boxing skills & drills, sparring
FRIDAY-same as monday & wednesday
SATURDAY-bootcamp 7am sparring 4pm
SUNDAY-6pm road work

WALK AROUND WEIGHT WHEN TRAINING 64KG
FIGHTING WEIGHT 61.23KG
I find it hard to eat from about 3pm onwards because i am at the gym training people then training myself till 7pm.
I was thinking of having smoothies to help with a better diet.what would be best to put in them?
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Old 02-26-2010, 08:24 AM   #64
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I dont think your eating enough mate with all that training
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Old 02-26-2010, 09:20 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by gilly View Post
hey mate thanks for taking the time out to help.
DIET
9am-2 weet-bix full cream milk tea spoon suger
10am-yogurt or a peace of friut
1pm-sandwich on wholemeal bread ham lettus cheese avocado
2pm-banana or choclate bar
8pm-steak or chicken & veg 4x a week stir fry or pasta the other nights

I drink a good 2 liters of water a day also a class of juice & cordial.i dont drink tea or coffee but i drink thos damn energy drinks about 3 a week.

EXERCISE
its a hard one cos its all over the place
7am-3 x a week road runs with hill sprints total of 45mins
MONDAY-5pm basic boxing training.skipping,shadow boxing,exercises,1kg hand weights **** load of different reps,bag work,pad work.
TUESDAY-3pm boxing skills & drills
WEDNESDAY-same as monday
THURSDAY-4pm boxing skills & drills, sparring
FRIDAY-same as monday & wednesday
SATURDAY-bootcamp 7am sparring 4pm
SUNDAY-6pm road work

WALK AROUND WEIGHT WHEN TRAINING 64KG
FIGHTING WEIGHT 61.23KG
I find it hard to eat from about 3pm onwards because i am at the gym training people then training myself till 7pm.
I was thinking of having smoothies to help with a better diet.what would be best to put in them?

what city u from?
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Old 02-26-2010, 09:23 AM   #66
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brisbane.whys that?
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Old 02-26-2010, 04:29 PM   #67
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everybody (body) is different.
Hey Andriy...did you say the "body different" thing because of the fat content of the cream, butter, oil......on all of my meals?
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Old 02-26-2010, 04:52 PM   #68
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This is what I would do.

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Originally Posted by gilly View Post
hey mate thanks for taking the time out to help.
DIET
9am-2 weet-bix full cream milk tea spoon suger
**** this rubbish off, and have a smoothy with a cup of milk, 2 scoops of ice cream (optional, maybe 1 or 1/2 is enough just for taste) and the kicker..... 3-4 raw eggs.
Eggs are awsome, some of the bigger athletes eat a dozen a day!

10am-yogurt or a peace of friut
Good.

1pm-sandwich on wholemeal bread ham lettus cheese avocado
Good, could even improve with a bit more salad, such as tomato, cucumber, etc.

2pm-banana or choclate bar
Lose the chocolate bar. Fruit is good.

8pm-steak or chicken & veg 4x a week stir fry or pasta the other nights
That's good, throw fish in the mix too.
Don't cook the **** out of the vegies either.

I drink a good 2 liters of water a day also a class of juice & cordial.
Lose the cordial and even the juice. Juice isn't what it's cracked up to be, far too concentrated and doesn't have all the goodness of the real thing anyway. Replace it with the proper fruit.
Water is good.


i dont drink tea or coffee but i drink thos damn energy drinks about 3 a week.
Lose the energy drinks. Tea is ok, coffee is bad. Water is best.

EXERCISE
its a hard one cos its all over the place
7am-3 x a week road runs with hill sprints total of 45mins
MONDAY-5pm basic boxing training.skipping,shadow boxing,exercises,1kg hand weights **** load of different reps,bag work,pad work.
TUESDAY-3pm boxing skills & drills
WEDNESDAY-same as monday
THURSDAY-4pm boxing skills & drills, sparring
FRIDAY-same as monday & wednesday
SATURDAY-bootcamp 7am sparring 4pm
SUNDAY-6pm road work
I'm not as experienced as some in this area, but an important thing to remember is rest. 7 days may be too much, give your self a rest day.


WALK AROUND WEIGHT WHEN TRAINING 64KG
FIGHTING WEIGHT 61.23KG
I find it hard to eat from about 3pm onwards because i am at the gym training people then training myself till 7pm.
I was thinking of having smoothies to help with a better diet.what would be best to put in them?
See above.
I have a smoothie like I mentioned above every morning, that's my breakfast.

Forget the supplements, they are all ****.

Last edited by Sox; 02-26-2010 at 06:19 PM.
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Old 02-26-2010, 05:40 PM   #69
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This is what I would do.



See above.
I have a smoothie like I mentioned above every morning, that's my breakfast.

Forget the supplements, they are all ****.
Ice cream? (14 scoops a week???) He has a weight class and is an athlete, he's not a body builder. His day seven is roadwork, if its a steady state run that's fine active rest is good.

It's true diet is the most important but when you are training 2 or 3 times a day supplementation is beneficial cod liver oil, whey etc. The body needs the extra vitamins etc

Run things by your coach or by someone not on the internet.
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Old 02-26-2010, 05:49 PM   #70
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Default Re: Supplements

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Originally Posted by Sox View Post
This is what I would do.



See above.
I have a smoothie like I mentioned above every morning, that's my breakfast.

Forget the supplements, they are all ****.
thats rubbish and you know it, that diet you guys are discussing has NOWHERE NEAR enough protein to be workout out 7 days a week...he should be at least taking a few whey protein shakes a day to get enough to keep him going. All the fruit and veges are good but where are his carbs and protein coming from? steak once a day? i reckon protein powder in the smoothie and also a shake post training to aid recovery

alot of suppliments are ****, but alot of them are awesome, and thats coming from someone who has studied medicine and understands their role in the body. It is simple science, to build muscle you need to provide it with protein which become amino acids. He simply will not be getting enough and will eventually over train and burn out

look at Pac at the moment. He hates any form of suppliment but Freddy Roach has him on 7000 calories a day and 5 shakes to give him enough fuel to go hard day in and day out (also to help him stay at 147)
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Old 02-26-2010, 05:50 PM   #71
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Ice cream? (14 scoops a week???) He has a weight class and is an athlete, he's not a body builder.
I should have elaborated there. (I edited it)
I have 2 scoops because I'm not chasing ultimate leanness and I like it like a thick shake.
He wouldn't need the 2 scoops, either one, half, or none.
Quote:
His day seven is roadwork, if its a steady state run that's fine active rest is good.
I always like a good days rest, YMMV.
Quote:
It's true diet is the most important but when you are training 2 or 3 times a day supplementation is beneficial cod liver oil, whey etc. The body needs the extra vitamins etc
Bull****.
Supplements are never neccesary if your diet is up to scratch.
The body can get everything it needs, and then some, from good diet.
Quote:
Run things by your coach or by someone not on the internet.
I would agree with that in an ideal world, however even coach's and people not on the internet have agendas.

Last edited by Sox; 02-26-2010 at 06:20 PM.
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Old 02-26-2010, 05:55 PM   #72
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thats rubbish and you know it, that diet you guys are discussing has NOWHERE NEAR enough protein to be workout out 7 days a week...
That's why I added the eggs.

he should be at least taking a few whey protein shakes a day to get enough to keep him going. All the fruit and veges are good but where are his carbs and protein coming from? steak once a day? i reckon protein powder in the smoothie and also a shake post training to aid recovery
Why add protein powder to a smoothie when it has eggs? You're talking nonsense.

alot of suppliments are ****, but alot of them are awesome,
They're all ****.

and thats coming from someone who has studied medicine and understands their role in the body. It is simple science, to build muscle you need to provide it with protein which become amino acids. He simply will not be getting enough and will eventually over train and burn out
****.

look at Pac at the moment. He hates any form of suppliment but Freddy Roach has him on 7000 calories a day and 5 shakes to give him enough fuel to go hard day in and day out (also to help him stay at 147)
No one but the guys involved really know what these guys are on..... PED's anyone?
In any case, these supplements would only be mentioned because of $$, nothing more. There's a lot of money at stake here.

Last edited by Sox; 02-26-2010 at 06:22 PM.
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Old 02-26-2010, 06:03 PM   #73
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Our companies are Bioflex Nutrition [Only registered and activated users can see links. ] and Bulk Nutrients [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

Initially I started Bioflex, with that company we manufacture supplements for the retail market where people want flashy packaging and the rest, and whom buy through shops and gyms. This range is what we promote as Australia's purest supplements and is available (albeit somewhat limited) in every Aus state and Territory.

As we progressed with Bioflex, we went from being web based to manufacturers/distributours our prices had to go up which is why I created Bulk Nutrients. BulkN is extremely popular, for those who want raw amino acids, extracts, proteins, fat burners etc. As we keep things basic in that part of the business our products are really economical. We have a massive following throughout Australia in the bodybuilding market.

The thing that makes us very unique is that we formulate, manufacture and pack all of our range, unlike almost every other company who uses contractors to do it. This gives us a massive advantage as we can assure customers are getting exactly what they see on the label. This is also the reason why Powerlifting Australia accepted us as their official supplement sponsor, when they had previously distanced themselves from the supp industry.
mate the bioflex site looks ****ing great... im going to buy your mass gainer and pre workout energy suppliment biocharge. So freakin cheap man!
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Old 02-26-2010, 06:39 PM   #74
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I should have elaborated there. (I edited it)
I have 2 scoops because I'm not chasing ultimate leanness and I like it like a thick shake.
He wouldn't need the 2 scoops, either one, half, or none.
I always like a good days rest, YMMV.
Bull****.
Supplements are never neccesary if your diet is up to scratch.
The body can get everything it needs, and then some, from good diet.
I would agree with that in an ideal world, however even coach's and people not on the internet have agendas.
I don't really agree with any of this. The vitamin intake achievable through supplementation is vast and if you attempted to mimic it with food you would pay a significant price in calorie intake which again hampers weight. I strongly advocate diet as the be all and end all to the average health nut or gym goer there are nothing wrong with certain supplements even to them. Everyone has an agenda but someone like his coach knows him, his weight, body type etc and hopefully has a vested interest in his performances.

At Gilly or any other boxers:

I notice you do a lot of work prior to sparring, do you feel tired or sloppy in sparring because of it? I'm not sure whether Australia tends to operate its gyms like the US (open all day) or like the Uk (generally timetabled hours for ams)? I've boxed in gyms that make you spar fresh which I am a big fan of as all supplemental exercise on other days should be about improving actual ability/fitness in the ring and I've also boxed at gyms that put you through the mill before sparring which I hate.
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Old 02-26-2010, 06:50 PM   #75
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I don't really agree with any of this.
Good for you, you're blinded by advertising and misinformation.
Everything a supplement company hopes for.
Quote:
The vitamin intake achievable through supplementation is vast and if you attempted to mimic it with food you would pay a significant price in calorie intake which again hampers weight.
Utter nonsense.
Firstly the supposed vitamin intake of supplements is not all utilised by our body.
And secondly, the vitamins are only part of what comes from good food. Supplements can't begin to provide the nutrition and goodness which real food can.
Quote:
I strongly advocate diet as the be all and end all to the average health nut or gym goer there are nothing wrong with certain supplements even to them.
And you know that how? You know the long term and even short term side effects of all the supplements available? Of course you don't.
Quote:
Everyone has an agenda but someone like his coach knows him, his weight, body type etc and hopefully has a vested interest in his performances.
And even his coach has an agenda. Do you have any idea how big the supplement industry is? Who do you think they target?

As I said in a earlier post, the only people who will give you the truth are the ones in the game who are NOT involved with supplement companies.
The rest are just lining their pockets.
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