Is Roberto Duran overrated? - Page 2

Unforgiven · 03-04-2010, 05:11 AM

Pachilles,
Surely by the time he gets to like 40 or whatever, it would be acceptable to excuse some of his losses ?

CassiusClayAli · 03-04-2010, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pachilles

His greatness rests on excusing all 16 of his losses. Which Robertards are fluent in. Or some just flat out refuse to believe his career went on beyond Montreal. You see, how he lost is irrelevant, why he lost only adds to his greatness!

He is without a doubt the biggest bitch in the history of boxing and is the king of excuses.
His victories don't recieve the same double standards. His greatest wins are...

Ray Leonard - Fantastic win, made his career, from the hate people had for Leonard.
Carlos Palomino - Was at the very tail end of his career, infact it was his very last serious fight. He was merely a faded big name used to boost the reputations of hot WW contenders Benitez and Duran.
Iran Barkley - Absolutely in no way, shape or form ATG career defining competition
Davey Moore - Absolutely in no way, shape or form career defining competition
Ken Buchanan - Finished the fight with literally an almighty punch to the testicles, anyone else else would've been disqualified.
De Jesus - Went 2 - 1 with him. His very best wins at LW.

Now all you have to do is hype the above fighters up beyond measure(except for Leonard because he made Duran quit like a bitch in the rematch and beat him in the 3rd fight...just pretend they never happened). Hype these fighters up to delusional standards, and then make as many excuses you can for the following losses....

-De Jesus, Leonard, Benitez, Laing, Hagler, Hearns, Sims, Leonard, Lawlor, Pazienzax2, Camacho, Castro, Joppy, Gonzales, Camacho

...and then you have credibility on ESB Classic.

This is a cool comment!. Yes Duran overrated big and only 2 hall of fame wins in his boxing record on boxrec!. For an ATG that is terrible!!!!! and he quit with SRL!!!

Pachilles · 03-04-2010, 05:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unforgiven

Pachilles,
Surely by the time he gets to like 40 or whatever, it would be acceptable to excuse some of his losses ?

I am consistant with every single boxer i talk about in saying that a loss is a loss. Its not fair to make excuses and claim something totally different would've happened, compared to what actually did happen. If a fighter steps into the ring and he hadn't trained properly for the fight, that is his fault! It is a weakness to enter the ring unprepared, an emotional and a mental weakness. If a fighter is "past his prime" and still enters the ring it is a weaknessunder the same principle.

Pachilles · 03-04-2010, 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CassiusClayAli

This is a cool comment!. Yes Duran overrated big and only 2 hall of fame wins in his boxing record on boxrec!. For an ATG that is terrible!!!!! and he quit with SRL!!!

And now the Robertards are going to the trouble of creating new accounts, and typing like idiots to discredit the image of us non-believers.

Unforgiven · 03-04-2010, 05:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bodhi

If somebody says he is Top3, he is overrating him. If somebody says he is Top20 he is underrating him. He should be Top10, perhaps Top15.

If you are talking ALL-TIME POUND-FOR-POUND, I disagree.
On consideration, he wouldn't get in my top 20 all-time p4p.
I mean, we're talking about all-time, every fighter who ever fought.

If you mean lightweights, I'd say he'd definitely make the top 10, perhaps top 5.

bodhi · 03-04-2010, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unforgiven

If you are talking ALL-TIME POUND-FOR-POUND, I disagree.
On consideration, he wouldn't get in my top 20 all-time p4p.
I mean, we're talking about all-time, every fighter who ever fought.

If you mean lightweights, I'd say he'd definitely make the top 10, perhaps top 5.

You can disagree with it. It just means you are underrating him.

Unforgiven · 03-04-2010, 05:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pachilles

I am consistant with every single boxer i talk about in saying that a loss is a loss. Its not fair to make excuses and claim something totally different would've happened, compared to what actually did happen. If a fighter steps into the ring and he hadn't trained properly for the fight, that is his fault! It is a weakness to enter the ring unprepared, an emotional and a mental weakness. If a fighter is "past his prime" and still enters the ring it is a weaknessunder the same principle.

Ok. That's your criteria.

Unforgiven · 03-04-2010, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bodhi

You can disagree with it. It just means you are underrating him.

No, because everyone I'd rate above him would be thoroughly deserving. Great great fighters.

Pachilles · 03-04-2010, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unforgiven

Ok. That's your criteria.

Its not criteria mate, its fact. If somebody takes those fights and wins then fine, use it. But if he loses, it cannot be excused or turned into some kind of victory

bodhi · 03-04-2010, 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pachilles

Its not criteria mate, its fact. If somebody takes those fights and wins then fine, use it. But if he loses, it cannot be excused or turned into some kind of victory

No, it's not fact. It's your opinion. If people have the opinion that past prime losses are excusable it's as much "fact" as your "facts".

Pachilles · 03-04-2010, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bodhi

No, it's not fact. It's your opinion. If people have the opinion that past prime losses are excusable it's as much "fact" as your "facts".

Regardless, its still a loss. A loss is a loss. If you lost, you lost for a fact. It is a fact that you lost. There can be reasons behind a loss, reasons to why you lost...but a reasonable loss doesnt make a win.. An excuse doesnt excuse a loss, its still a loss. You can pretend it never happened, thats all you can do. But in real life it did happen, it is a loss no matter what. And that is why me saying a loss is a loss is FACT.

Meast · 03-04-2010, 06:06 AM

I voted yes as I don't think he belongs in the top 3.

top 10 without a question, but top 3 is too high imo.

bodhi · 03-04-2010, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pachilles

Regardless, its still a loss. A loss is a loss. If you lost, you lost for a fact. It is a fact that you lost. There can be reasons behind a loss, reasons to why you lost...but a reasonable loss doesnt make a win.. An excuse doesnt excuse a loss, its still a loss. You can pretend it never happened, thats all you can do. But in real life it did happen, it is a loss no matter what. And that is why me saying a loss is a loss is FACT.

Yes, a loss is a loss. But not all losses are the same.

JudgeDredd · 03-04-2010, 06:23 AM

Absolutely not! At least top 3 Lightweight of all time, even without the Leonard win he's right up there.

Ezzard · 03-04-2010, 07:36 AM

He was the best fighter of the colour TV age.

Watch him fight, glance at his record, there are enough names on there to back up what you’ve watched. Factor in his longevity… He’s as good as it gets. Some fighters achieved more in the past but I doubt anyone in the future will trump him.

View Poll Results: Is Roberto Duran overrated?
Yes	28	34.57%
No	53	65.43%
Voters: 81. You may not vote on this poll

03-04-2010, 05:11 AM	#16
Unforgiven Undisputed Champion East Side VIP Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 13,141 vCash: 1000	Re: Is Roberto Duran overrated? Pachilles, Surely by the time he gets to like 40 or whatever, it would be acceptable to excuse some of his losses ?
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03-04-2010, 06:06 AM	#27
Meast Undisputed Champion East Side VIP Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Yorkshire/GTMSBT/London Posts: 14,935 vCash: 900	Re: Is Roberto Duran overrated? I voted yes as I don't think he belongs in the top 3. top 10 without a question, but top 3 is too high imo.
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03-04-2010, 06:23 AM	#29
JudgeDredd Contender ESB Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,449 vCash: 187	Re: Is Roberto Duran overrated? Absolutely not! At least top 3 Lightweight of all time, even without the Leonard win he's right up there.
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03-04-2010, 07:36 AM	#30
Ezzard Contender ESB Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: UK Posts: 1,037 vCash: 1000	Re: Is Roberto Duran overrated? He was the best fighter of the colour TV age. Watch him fight, glance at his record, there are enough names on there to back up what you’ve watched. Factor in his longevity… He’s as good as it gets. Some fighters achieved more in the past but I doubt anyone in the future will trump him.
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