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Old 04-02-2010, 02:23 AM   #61
Gander Tasco
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

Tyson was just saying what Cus D'mato told him. He obviously found the suggestion a bit ridiculous as well.
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Old 04-02-2010, 02:32 AM   #62
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Originally Posted by Gander Tasco View Post
Tyson was just saying what Cus D'mato told him. He obviously found the suggestion a bit ridiculous as well.
yeah, I thought Marciano presses you.. haha
in all honesty every heavyweight would be in a fight if they were to ever fight Marciano, even the slugger/punchers. he would probably be beaten by the greats like Ali, possibly holmes, foreman, Liston, etc
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Old 04-02-2010, 03:00 AM   #63
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

I know it may not be popular, but I have to question Rocky's punch resistance against big hitters like Tyson. He was hurt pretty good against Walcott and Moore, and these guys weren't the biggest hitters at HW. He didn't really face a lot of powerful HW's in his reign. Sure he took punishment, but what would have happened if he ran into a guy like Liston? I don't know if he could have taken Sonny's punches the way he took Archie's or JJW's. I think Tyson would outclass Marciano and KO him early. Prime Tyson would have totally taken Rocky out of his gameplan and beat his ass to the punch time and again, busting him up and taking him out. Tyson was even a better boxer with a good jab for his size when he actually used it. Tyson just had too much firepower for Rocky to handle.
One thing Rocky's opponents never did is punish his body the way Mike would have. That left uppercut to the body and head would have been there all night.
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Old 04-02-2010, 08:03 AM   #64
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Originally Posted by JohnThomas1 View Post
Tyson basically pressed everyone at his best. It worked great for him. He's hardly going to start dancing around or backpedal non stop vs a Marciano. He could potentially get Marciano out of there early.
Or it could have an opposite effect and he could get himself out of there early. I remember Tyson getting rocked early by Ton Tucker and he was quite reserved in his approach after that punch. Tucker also was not a ball of fire but I seen something. Tyson fought carefully vs Rudduck, who was not known for an Iron chin, yet he proceeded with caution.Than his opponents and would be carefull early but ready for a quick start vs Mike...

Mike was a fast starter but Marciano was in a different league Than his opponents and would be careful early but ready for a quick start vs Mike...This fight would unravel as the round went on. the longer the fight I would favor Marciano and Tyson would also get hit in close with some awkward but very hard shots and may get hurt early himself.

We all know who the better man in the adversity department and I would have to say Marciano stacks up as one of the best in this area, also stamina. The early start is where I favor Tyson but again Tyson has never faced a deadly one punch fighter like Marciano and there is no way he proceeds without caution here and if he chooses to be reckless may pay early and dearly.
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Old 04-02-2010, 09:37 AM   #65
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

Sorry Bummy but i think Tyson would take Marciano out early. Even if he didn't i'd still have him. The Rock could be as careful as he liked early but an offensive force like Tyson is going to power into gaps. This isn't no Archie Moore at heavy. I rate The Rock top 5 ATG but don't pick him in many H2H's sorry.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:09 AM   #66
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Originally Posted by JohnThomas1 View Post
Sorry Bummy but i think Tyson would take Marciano out early. Even if he didn't i'd still have him. The Rock could be as careful as he liked early but an offensive force like Tyson is going to power into gaps. This isn't no Archie Moore at heavy. I rate The Rock top 5 ATG but don't pick him in many H2H's sorry.
Another factor would be Tyson's advantage in weight. Even if Rocky was able to keep the fight close and inside, the fact that a 220 pound Tyson is leaning and pushing against him all night may stress Rocky's fabled stamina late in the fight.
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Old 04-02-2010, 02:54 PM   #67
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Or it could have an opposite effect and he could get himself out of there early. I remember Tyson getting rocked early by Ton Tucker and he was quite reserved in his approach after that punch. Tucker also was not a ball of fire but I seen something. Tyson fought carefully vs Rudduck, who was not known for an Iron chin, yet he proceeded with caution.Than his opponents and would be carefull early but ready for a quick start vs Mike...
This is nonsense. Tucker was 6'5 225 and a good hitter and cracked him with a full power uppercut Tyson didn't see coming. It caught him off balance which caused him to fall back, then he just kept going forward. This fight proves if nothing else that you're not going to get lucky against Tyson with one punch.
And Tyson didn't fight reserved against Ruddock either.
You also failed to mention how Rocky fought no one even remotely close to Ruddock in terms of size or strength, critisizing Tyson for not blowing out every giant he fought out is hypocritical when Rocky didn't even FIGHT big men.
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Old 04-02-2010, 02:55 PM   #68
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Sorry Bummy but i think Tyson would take Marciano out early. Even if he didn't i'd still have him. The Rock could be as careful as he liked early but an offensive force like Tyson is going to power into gaps. This isn't no Archie Moore at heavy. I rate The Rock top 5 ATG but don't pick him in many H2H's sorry.
Same here.
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Old 04-02-2010, 03:32 PM   #69
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Originally Posted by Gander Tasco View Post
Tyson was just saying what Cus D'mato told him. He obviously found the suggestion a bit ridiculous as well.
He knew it sounded ridiculous, but I don't think Tyson ever found Cus to ridiculous when it came to boxing.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:54 PM   #70
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Originally Posted by Muchmoore View Post
This is nonsense. Tucker was 6'5 225 and a good hitter and cracked him with a full power uppercut Tyson didn't see coming. It caught him off balance which caused him to fall back, then he just kept going forward. This fight proves if nothing else that you're not going to get lucky against Tyson with one punch.
And Tyson didn't fight reserved against Ruddock either.
You also failed to mention how Rocky fought no one even remotely close to Ruddock in terms of size or strength, critisizing Tyson for not blowing out every giant he fought out is hypocritical when Rocky didn't even FIGHT big men.


I never criticized Tyson for not blowing out Giants just the way he dealt with fighters that came to win and lacked fear of him. The few that stood up to him like Douglas, Holyfield 2 times,Danny Williams and at the end of his career McBride beat him and Tyson could not get his mojo back in a rematch.

Joe Louis, Walcott and Charles beat many giants in fact Louis dominated them but one thing these men had was heart

Tyson was not an easy man to KO but he wilted when you stood up to him, Evander had heart and showed Mike no fear, funny but talk about size, light punching blown up middleweight Bobby Cyz made it hard for Evander the fight prior to Tyson but Holyfield took his courage and Put Tyson on his ass, something he could not do with the 5"8 Cyz. You want to say Tyson had a decent chin and I agree but it was his mind or intestinal fortitude that made him quit against the men he lost to
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Old 04-03-2010, 10:15 AM   #71
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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I never criticized Tyson for not blowing out Giants just the way he dealt with fighters that came to win and lacked fear of him. The few that stood up to him like Douglas, Holyfield 2 times,Danny Williams and at the end of his career McBride beat him and Tyson could not get his mojo back in a rematch.
Debating against someone who believes in the nobody tried to win against Tyson except when he lost and then tops that off by mentioning the Williams/McBride fights is really not worth it.

You believe in that, and I believe that you don't become HWT. champion without anyone trying to win.
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Old 04-03-2010, 11:32 AM   #72
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Originally Posted by Muchmoore View Post
Debating against someone who believes in the nobody tried to win against Tyson except when he lost and then tops that off by mentioning the Williams/McBride fights is really not worth it.

You believe in that, and I believe that you don't become HWT. champion without anyone trying to win.
No dont try and twist my words, Some people tried like trial horse Reggie Gross, who stunned Mike, just that Reggie was not a winning fighter. When Tyson got into the top league there are certain fighters that are not intimidated and they wont fold up. Douglas usually did fold up but on the night he fought Tyson was inspired by his mothers death. Evander (who had a tough time deposing of Cyz, had no trouble making Mike fold up his tent. and did it again in the rematch. There are many ways a guy can quit and biting the ear of your opponent is 1 way.

Tyson folded up his tent vs Williams and McBride, also. It seemed to become easier but I think its got to be in you.
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Old 04-03-2010, 12:59 PM   #73
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

The Tyson that bit Holyfield was ****ing crazy. I'm not talking about Tyson's skill/technique/shape declining I'm talking about his general personality, he was crazy at that point in his life.
If he had as much quit in him as people say he wouldn't of come so close to stopping Douglas in the 8th and lasted as long as he did. End of story.
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Old 04-03-2010, 01:38 PM   #74
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Originally Posted by Bummy Davis View Post
No dont try and twist my words, Some people tried like trial horse Reggie Gross, who stunned Mike, just that Reggie was not a winning fighter. When Tyson got into the top league there are certain fighters that are not intimidated and they wont fold up. Douglas usually did fold up but on the night he fought Tyson was inspired by his mothers death. Evander (who had a tough time deposing of Cyz, had no trouble making Mike fold up his tent. and did it again in the rematch. There are many ways a guy can quit and biting the ear of your opponent is 1 way.

Tyson folded up his tent vs Williams and McBride, also. It seemed to become easier but I think its got to be in you.
You're a hard hard man Bummy. Via your criteria i could take down 95% of ATG's including some of your own faves. We have to look at them at their best and even then they all had their off nights.

Last edited by JohnThomas1; 04-03-2010 at 09:21 PM.
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Old 04-04-2010, 07:50 AM   #75
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Default Re: Tyson on beating Marciano: "You have to press him."

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Originally Posted by Muchmoore View Post
The Tyson that bit Holyfield was ****ing crazy. I'm not talking about Tyson's skill/technique/shape declining I'm talking about his general personality, he was crazy at that point in his life.
If he had as much quit in him as people say he wouldn't of come so close to stopping Douglas in the 8th and lasted as long as he did. End of story.

Douglas was the surprise that night and the tide turned when he got up and went at Tyson. Yes Mike took a lot of punches but lost sometime when Douglas got up and fought
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