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Old 04-07-2010, 04:10 PM   #46
Mandanda
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Default Re: If you were Cleverly's promoter...would you put him in with Hopkins?

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Well? I know its not remotely likely but hypothetically speaking.

Having seen Hopkins in his last two outings, struggle (relatively) with fighters you'd expect him to dominate and impress against. Losing rounds to both. Getting hit a lot more than we've come to expect from a master defensive fighter. Getting hit by what seemed to be pretty ordinary punches to the back of the head and rolling around on the floor like he'd been harpooned, trying to get a break presumably, numerous times.

On the other hand, of course he still has that ring IQ. He's still strong in the clinches. He still roughs fighters up, hits on the blindside of the ref, all that nonsense (but can't take a bit of rough treatment himself ). It's always talked about how fighters aren't the same again after Hopkins treatment and it could be true. He still has a good defence though his reflexes are obviously fading and handspeed is a proven formula for success against him. He can presumably still pick good counters, though we havn't seen that in his last two outings so much due to how the fights panned out.

Cleverly has handspeed to trouble Hopkins. He has a variety of punch which you need, you can't throw the same punches or Hopkins neutralizes you as Pavlik found out. He has great stamina and punch output, that can't be disputed, Calzaghe beat him with high output. So you'd think he has the basis of a style to give this version of Hopkins trouble, though obviously the main concern is his defence which Hopkins could pick apart, and him being a relative novice that might not have the know how to overcome Hopkins tricks.

Is it a risk worth taking? Would Cleverly be getting Hopkins at the perfect time, so that he could win but also get due credit? Do you see Cleverly troubling Hopkins or even winning? Or does he have no chance in your mind?
Very Good Question

A loss wouldn't do him any harm, Although we haven't seen Clev in adversity and don't really know his mental make up. Some fighters are never the same once they lose there '0'.

With Regards to Hopkins..i'm still trying to understand the Jones fight. It was like a exhibition bout, Jones looked like he was just trying to see the 12 rounds out and risk very little. I was more impressed with Jones then Hopkins. Is he there for the taking...hell yes but Cleverley has looked good when he's controlling the tempo and dominating, BHOP loves come ahead fighters and loves to be able to make the lead first make em miss then land clinical shots then hold.

I'd like to see it, It be a intriguing fight that's for sure.
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Old 04-07-2010, 04:33 PM   #47
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Default Re: If you were Cleverly's promoter...would you put him in with Hopkins?

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I think we're on the same page. The kid is still very green so he needs to be handled as such for the next few fights. Trying to match him against someone like Hopkins however aged he looks could be the kiss of death. He still displays a lot of bad habits and we don't want him to run into the ghost of a "Calzaghe" type where that heart just gets viciously ripped out...and 23 or not, it's career defining like poor Lacy.

I know it was a long time ago, but Taylor for example was never the same after those fights with a weight drained Hopkins even though he 'won'.
I think we are on the same page mate. He just needs some issues ironing out. Clev could either pull it out of the bag on decision, or b-hop could school him. He isn't at that stage of his career where we need to find out whether he can hack it right at the top.
He is young enough to be worked into it.
Let b-hop do his thing clev, he ain't for you now. Glen Johnson would be a good yard stick, or possiblu woods in a couple of fights, if he could ever be tempted to come back!
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Old 04-07-2010, 06:06 PM   #48
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Default Re: If you were Cleverly's promoter...would you put him in with Hopkins?

Pity Clinton Woods isnt about any more as i think he would be an ideal match up for Cleverly at this stage.
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Old 04-07-2010, 06:10 PM   #49
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Default Re: If you were Cleverly's promoter...would you put him in with Hopkins?

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Pity Clinton Woods isnt about any more as i think he would be an ideal match up for Cleverly at this stage.
yep, would've been a good step for a work in progress.
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Old 04-07-2010, 06:14 PM   #50
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Default Re: If you were Cleverly's promoter...would you put him in with Hopkins?

He'd get killed
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Old 04-07-2010, 06:17 PM   #51
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Default Re: If you were Cleverly's promoter...would you put him in with Hopkins?

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He'd get killed
against who?
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Old 04-07-2010, 06:48 PM   #52
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Default Re: If you were Cleverly's promoter...would you put him in with Hopkins?

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against who?
Cleverly would by Hopkins IMO. Sorry if I just butted into your conversation, lol.
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Old 04-08-2010, 04:50 AM   #53
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Default Re: If you were Cleverly's promoter...would you put him in with Hopkins?

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Any reason why?

Based on their last two outings I'd rather face Hopkins than Glen based on Cleverly's strengths. His main strength is handspeed and a good engine. The gameplan would be to expose Hopkins age in the fight, quite a simple one.

Glen still fights 12 hard rounds and never stops coming. He looked pretty decent against Mack compared to Hopkins against Jones and Ornelas.
You can lose a close fight and learn a lot, and I think that is the worst scenario possible if Clev fought GJ. It'd be close and Clev would learn loads in the process. Plus he'd come over here.

However, if he fought Hopkins, there is a chance (albeit remote) that he could do a number on him a la Pavlik. A defeat like that could knock Clev back years. It's a needless risk at the moment.

If I was Clev I'd want the fight without a doubt, however, if I was his promoter, as you asked, I'd not want it yet. Let's see Hopkins in a meaningful fight, one where he is actually threatened, again like Pavlik, before writing him off for good. I don't see him as a gatekeeper yet.

As an aside, I was going to mention Lacy but deleted it, it's a meaningless fight at the moment. The only thing it would acheive is to con the casuals. I'd rather Clev learn something new in every fight from here on in.
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Old 04-08-2010, 05:37 AM   #54
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Default Re: If you were Cleverly's promoter...would you put him in with Hopkins?

No. It would be a rerun of Pavlik, silly talk, needs more experience first
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