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Old 05-20-2010, 06:18 PM   #1
Super_Fly_Sam
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Default Congrats VIC!!!!!

3rd world title in 3rd division!!!

Without a doubt Australia's best and surely edging closer and closer to world P4P title
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Old 05-20-2010, 08:21 PM   #2
ipswich express
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Super_Fly_Sam View Post
3rd world title in 3rd division!!!

Without a doubt Australia's best and surely edging closer and closer to world P4P title
Bob Fitzsimmons would be spinning in his grave.
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Old 05-20-2010, 08:42 PM   #3
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Super_Fly_Sam View Post
3rd world title in 3rd division!!!

Without a doubt Australia's best and surely edging closer and closer to world P4P title
Let me see if Pac or Floyd have fought recently for a 'world title' against a guy with 17 defeats, mmmm... nope can't see one!

Please, keep some perspective!
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Old 05-20-2010, 09:21 PM   #4
straight left
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

Perspective !

First fighter to unify the Super Flyweight division in the history of the sport!

7 time world champion !

yeh Contendo I agree Vic is overated ! Ppphhh.

Billy Dib must have fought a world champion boxer when he won his IBO belt.

Please dont be a hater. He has surpassed the feats of any boxer in modern Australia. I dont know why this site loves to knock our fighters.

We should be supporting everyone one of our boys that step into the ring. Ive got respect for all of them. Lets not be keyboard champions. I hope they punch the c*$! out of all their opponents everytime they step out.
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Old 05-20-2010, 09:55 PM   #5
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

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Originally Posted by straight left View Post
Perspective !

First fighter to unify the Super Flyweight division in the history of the sport!

7 time world champion !

yeh Contendo I agree Vic is overated ! Ppphhh.

Billy Dib must have fought a world champion boxer when he won his IBO belt.

Please dont be a hater. He has surpassed the feats of any boxer in modern Australia. I dont know why this site loves to knock our fighters.

We should be supporting everyone one of our boys that step into the ring. Ive got respect for all of them. Lets not be keyboard champions. I hope they punch the c*$! out of all their opponents everytime they step out.
Now Straight Left, I've let you go in the past when you've tried to take my comments out of perspective but here are the facts -

1.) I am no hater of Vic. These are your words, and generally used by people such as yourself when heaven forbid someone comments in perspective, or more so, has a differing opinion that one is entitled too about fighters. It's what makes boxing or actually any sport for that matter.

(Do I like Pretty Boy Floyd and his demeanour, probably fair to say no, but do I acknowledge him as one of the best P4P of all time - of course I do! Does that make me a hater, simply not.)

2.) Vic has achieved some fantastic milestones in his career for which I applaud whole-heartedly.

3.) At what point did I say in my post that Vic's over rated? (Again, your words)

I made my comment to the original post that it's to be kept in perspective against the acheivements of both Pac and Pretty Boy Floyd and generally speaking, I would think most boxing fans would agree, or at least acknowledge my perspective.

I support Australian boxing, hence why I enjoy being involved in the industry but don't come on here with your blind faith after you get bit's and pieces comments thrown to you and then you formulate that into your own version of fact.

Myself and a lot of people on here have followed boxing all our lives, and for some on here, been involved also, so it's fair to say we know how to judge the context of results.

Vic is right up there for mine with his record with the modern day Aussie greats such as Fenech and Kostya. The only thing IN MY OPINION, is that the lower weight classes, barring some of his opponents on his record do not stack up against the likes/quality of opponents both Fenech and Kostya fought. However, this doesn't make me think less of his record/achievements as you can only beat whose in front of you.

Have I made my point clear enough for you?
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Old 05-20-2010, 10:08 PM   #6
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

Good to see a non Mundine debate here....need a few more of these

I see where Contendo is coming from & i think Straight Left took it a bit the wrong way....im 1 of Vic's biggest fans...chatted to him & met him quite a few times....however i agree with Contendo that would u wouldnt see Floyd or Manny fighting guys with 17 odd defeats.
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Old 05-20-2010, 10:49 PM   #7
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

Contendo I am not taking a shot I have an honest question and would like an honest answer.

Do you think Billy Dib has ever been a world champion?
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Old 05-20-2010, 11:07 PM   #8
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

Daz,

Far from taking offence, it's a straight up question.

The I say, 'unfortunate' state of world boxing is that we have multiple sanctioning bodies available to fighters to contest for 'world titles'.

Do I decree the IBO as one of the leading group, simply put no. Let me be clear here, I'm not denegrating the IBO whatsoever with that answer, it's a sanctioning body trying to do good things for boxers and promoting opportunities for them, however as far as positioning them alongside the 'Big 4' (WBC / IBF / WBA and WBO), well I couldn't in my opinion.

That's not to detract from Billy's claim to his 130lbs title. He fought for it and was deemed the winner and you can't take that away from him due to again, the current state we have in boxing with multiple sanctioning bodies all offering a 'world title'.

However it clearly shows how Billy's developed as a boxer as he's well positioned now at No.4 with the IBF and firmly focused on opportunities there. Time will tell if he is to win either the IBF or a 'Big 4' belt, obviously we as a team think he can.

I suppose to use an example, Jackson Asiku can consider himself a 'world champion', but is his seriously greater in importance than that of his stablemate Chris John, even though technically they are both 'World Champions'. You see the reference I'm trying to make. (And please, that's not dismissing Jackson's achievements, just in perspective for example)

In a nutshell, I suppose technically speaking Billy's won a 'world title' as Vic did last night or Jackson and Lenny did recently etc, however do I, or the majority of the boxing world rank it alongside the merits of a 'Big 4', well no would have to be the answer. I certainly have never discussed it with Billy or any other fighter who's won an IBO title, but I'd like to think that as serious professionals and being honest with themselves, their respective answers wouldn't be greatly different to that of the above.

Let me say in closing, if any of those fighters who have won an IBO title view it different to me, well that's fine and I'm not one to judge negatively of them. They work hard for their opportunities and that was their moment so that sit's with me also.

Last edited by Contendo; 05-21-2010 at 02:06 AM.
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Old 05-20-2010, 11:23 PM   #9
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

I appreciate that answer mate truly. I was sure you would give me some bullshit 1 liner of 'of course he is rah rah rah' but you didn't and that's classy. I know how hard boxing can be both inside and outside the ring. From what i gather sometimes fighting can be the easiest part of the two.

In my opinion though I recognise a world champion as simply 'the man who beat the man'. For me, a fighter might not hold any belt whatsoever or he could hold every belt (WBA, WBC, IBO, IBF, WBO) there is. Unless you are the man who beat the man you aren't a world champion.

I just think that whole 'big 4' thing is crazy. I mean look at how Lovemore and Anthony got their titles. Lovemore beats Rabah in a good fight that was an eliminator for a shot at then IBF champ Hatton. Hatton decides to vacate so the IBF says hey we need a sanctioning fee. Ring up Lovemore and say hey mate your the champ give as a few thousand. All bodies are as corrupt as each other and boxing would be better off with NONE of them.
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Old 05-20-2010, 11:24 PM   #10
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

being positive congrats Vic.you got the job done with a broken hand.well done.
being negative if he cant recapture his Mijares,Arce form and brings last nights Vic too a Donaire rematch he will be badly owned again.
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Old 05-20-2010, 11:37 PM   #11
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

Vic did well to get out of the rough and come away with a tough fought win.

I don't think their is any doubt that his best days are behind him. Bantam seems too big for him and at 34, he is an old flyweight.
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Old 05-20-2010, 11:42 PM   #12
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

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Originally Posted by stiflers mum View Post
being positive congrats Vic.you got the job done with a broken hand.well done.
being negative if he cant recapture his Mijares,Arce form and brings last nights Vic too a Donaire rematch he will be badly owned again.
Alway happy to see Vic win......if he could just fight like he did in the Mijares win he could reach the top 10 p4p again.
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Old 05-20-2010, 11:59 PM   #13
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

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Originally Posted by daz52 View Post
I appreciate that answer mate truly. I was sure you would give me some bullshit 1 liner of 'of course he is rah rah rah' but you didn't and that's classy. I know how hard boxing can be both inside and outside the ring. From what i gather sometimes fighting can be the easiest part of the two.

In my opinion though I recognise a world champion as simply 'the man who beat the man'. For me, a fighter might not hold any belt whatsoever or he could hold every belt (WBA, WBC, IBO, IBF, WBO) there is. Unless you are the man who beat the man you aren't a world champion.

I just think that whole 'big 4' thing is crazy. I mean look at how Lovemore and Anthony got their titles. Lovemore beats Rabah in a good fight that was an eliminator for a shot at then IBF champ Hatton. Hatton decides to vacate so the IBF says hey we need a sanctioning fee. Ring up Lovemore and say hey mate your the champ give as a few thousand. All bodies are as corrupt as each other and boxing would be better off with NONE of them.

I undeerstand what you are saying with the man that beat the man I would only recognise the big 3 Less the WBO. However if someone vacates the title and you then win it in a fight do you never become the real champion as you will never be the man that beat the man
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Old 05-21-2010, 12:18 AM   #14
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

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I undeerstand what you are saying with the man that beat the man I would only recognise the big 3 Less the WBO. However if someone vacates the title and you then win it in a fight do you never become the real champion as you will never be the man that beat the man
So do you believe that no matter the circumstances, whoever wins the WBA, WBC or IBF belt, they are a legitimate world champion in your eyes?



Obviously nothing is going to be prefect and I can see your point. If whoever is considered the lineal champion retires or moves up in weight, you will never be the one who beat the man. I guess there has to be a fight between 2 fighters considered the Number 1 and 2 contender for a shot at the vacant championship.

But who decides who are the two contenders?
What if they dont want to fight?
And so on...

I know there are alot of things that could go wrong with that but in my opinion it's still better then just going off completely corrupt sanctioning bodies. I'm saying the way I look at it is when some one tells me "This guy is the --- champ" or "This fighter won such and such a belt", it means absolutely jack all to me in terms of if they are or ever have been a world champion.
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Old 05-21-2010, 12:35 AM   #15
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Default Re: Congrats VIC!!!!!

I'm a consumer Daz....food, drink and bullshit...specially the crap the media dishes up....if its in the paper in the morning.....it happened.

Winner of the IBO MW title is the IBO MW World champ
Winner of the WBA MW title is the WBA MW World champ

The World champion in any one division holds the RING belt....at MW it was Pavlik...now it's Martinez.

Thats not so hard is it
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