Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs...

Losfer_Words · 10-02-2010, 06:51 AM

Can any of the people who have been critical of the Haye-Harrison fight (including myself, I'll admit) really moan about Haye fighting Audley now that Wlad might be fighting Chisora and Vitali is fighting Briggs next?

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/m...o_1235541c.jpg

http://www.spox.com/de/sport/mehrspo...tschko-514.jpg

Before anyone says it's Haye's fault for making both Vitali and Wlad look for other options to square-off against, you could play Devil's advocate and say the same about Haye having to look for other viable opponents after a deal with the other titleholders at the weight wasn't made for whatever reason(s). The truth of the matter is the Klits need Haye as much as he needs them; this is not the same for the other fighters at the weight who don't have a title, so it's a moot point saying something like, 'Well, Fighter C took the fight, so it's obvious that Fighter B is avoiding Fighter A'.

Also, before percentage splits are the like are brought up, as much as people like to claim they know about contract negotiations, the truth is they really know next to fuck all and are only forming opinions from bias snippets of information from each camp.

So, with all that in mind, should all of the titleholders at the weight be judged the same for not making the fights that the fans want to see?

LP_1985 · 10-02-2010, 06:54 AM

yes, there all as bad as each other

clyde · 10-02-2010, 06:56 AM

Tactically, it's better to just moan about the division in general rather than any specific fight.

LP_1985 · 10-02-2010, 06:57 AM

i think del boy is gona be a much easier fight than what audley is for haye

ed7890 · 10-02-2010, 06:58 AM

Chisora would batter Harrison

Losfer_Words · 10-02-2010, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clyde

Tactically, it's better to just moan about the division in general rather than any specific fight.

Indeed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ed7890

Chisora would batter Harrison

That's not the point I'm making. I'm not looking at sylistic scenarios at all...

GazOC · 10-02-2010, 07:00 AM

Financially, given that both can earn well defending against (and I'm being kind here) average opponents, I'd say Wlad needs Haye as much as Haye needs Wlad but from a legacy or career point of view Wlads record will not suffer too much from not having a win over David Haye on it whereas Hayes will suffer considerably for not having beaten Wlad.

clyde · 10-02-2010, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ed7890

Chisora would batter Harrison

When they meet to unify the belts we'll know for sure.

NSFW · 10-02-2010, 07:06 AM

Haye has talked shit then bottled the big fight.

ed7890 · 10-02-2010, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Losfer_Words

That's not the point I'm making. I'm not looking at sylistic scenarios at all...

Well, from my point of view, Wlad or Vitali's choice of opponent still does nothing to change how bad Harrison is. He got beaten by Rogan, he barely beat Sprott, if he had fought any decent fighter to earn a shot, fair enough, but he didn't. He could not have beaten Sexton or Chisora, or Dimitrenko, or Sosnowski. It's a terrible choice in fairness.

Chisora isn't super but it's amuch more legit fight in my eyes.

Losfer_Words · 10-02-2010, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ed7890

Well, from my point of view, Wlad or Vitali's choice of opponent still does nothing to change how bad Harrison is. He got beaten by Rogan, he barely beat Sprott, if he had fought any decent fighter to earn a shot, fair enough, but he didn't. He could not have beaten Sexton or Chisora, or Dimitrenko, or Sosnowski. It's a terrible choice in fairness.

Chisora isn't super but it's amuch more legit fight in my eyes.

Haye-Harrison is a terrible fight and I've made my stance clear on that in the past. That said, although it's not my personal preference for making fights, Haye-Harrison has a lot in common with Vitali-Briggs and Wlad-Chisora: it makes money. Shitloads. I would be very confident in predicting that Haye-Harrison will make more than Wlad-Chisora or Vitali-Briggs; perhaps even more than both Wlad and Vitali fights combined.

To add to that, both Briggs and Chisora have no more of a right to fight for a version of the HW title than Harrison does (although I will obviously want Chisora to win if the fight gets signed). All three are crap fights and Wlad and Vitali shouldn't be spared the same sort of criticism that Haye has got, IMO.

GazOC · 10-02-2010, 07:20 AM

The reason that Haye is getting more shit is that he is the one thats perceived as having put the mockers on the Haye-Wlad fight.

Vit and Wlad are getting an easy ride because they seem to want to fight Haye and other than Haye no one is really that bothered who they fight as the other contenders have either already been beaten by the Klits or just arn't that appealing to the fans.

madballster · 10-02-2010, 07:28 AM

Haye didn't want to fight Wlad this year remember what Adam Booth said?

Booth was on TV saying that Haye wasn't considering any opponents and needed a big long rest. That was in May, when the IBF said Wlad has to reach a deal with Haye in order to be relieved of the duty to defend against his mandatory challenger.

Haye had *ZERO* interest in fighting Wlad this summer. Period. Doesn't mean he's scared of Wlad, he just didn't want to fight him now.

My personal hypothesis is that Haye wants to get rid of Sauerland, his co-promoter. He owes them co-promotion rights for 2 more fights including the Harrison bout. They probably take a good chunk out of his part of the purse.

Squire · 10-02-2010, 07:35 AM

Come on mate, we've been over the situation here over and over again. You can (and people have) listed 15-30 of the top fighters ticking off valid reasons for why a fight with Wlad is not possible. You can't say the same for Haye, he could have fought anyone but chose Harrison. Wlad and Vitali's option were very limited so they had to settle for their opponents

Quote:

Originally Posted by LP_1985

i think del boy is gona be a much easier fight than what audley is for haye

Because Wlad is a much better fighter than Haye

LP_1985 · 10-02-2010, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squire

Come on mate, we've been over the situation here over and over again. You can (and people have) listed 15-30 of the top fighters ticking off valid reasons for why a fight with Wlad is not possible. You can't say the same for Haye, he could have fought anyone but chose Harrison. Wlad and Vitali's option were very limited so they had to settle for their opponents

Because Wlad is a much better fighter than Haye

audley will last longer than chisora against haye

10-02-2010, 06:51 AM	#1
Losfer_Words ★★★ 2 TONE EXPRESS ★★★ East Side Guru Join Date: May 2009 Location: Bristol, England Posts: 9,660 vCash: 1000	Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs... Can any of the people who have been critical of the Haye-Harrison fight (including myself, I'll admit) really moan about Haye fighting Audley now that Wlad might be fighting Chisora and Vitali is fighting Briggs next? http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/m...o_1235541c.jpg http://www.spox.com/de/sport/mehrspo...tschko-514.jpg Before anyone says it's Haye's fault for making both Vitali and Wlad look for other options to square-off against, you could play Devil's advocate and say the same about Haye having to look for other viable opponents after a deal with the other titleholders at the weight wasn't made for whatever reason(s). The truth of the matter is the Klits need Haye as much as he needs them; this is not the same for the other fighters at the weight who don't have a title, so it's a moot point saying something like, 'Well, Fighter C took the fight, so it's obvious that Fighter B is avoiding Fighter A'. Also, before percentage splits are the like are brought up, as much as people like to claim they know about contract negotiations, the truth is they really know next to fuck all and are only forming opinions from bias snippets of information from each camp. So, with all that in mind, should all of the titleholders at the weight be judged the same for not making the fights that the fans want to see?
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10-02-2010, 06:54 AM	#2
LP_1985 JMM beat Pac-Man 3 Times East Side VIP Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Vicente Carrillo Fuentes Organization HQ, Home of Team Mexico Posts: 18,375 vCash: 75	Re: Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs... yes, there all as bad as each other
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10-02-2010, 06:56 AM	#3
clyde Champion East Side Guru Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Glasgow Posts: 5,224 vCash: 1001	Re: Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs... Tactically, it's better to just moan about the division in general rather than any specific fight.
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10-02-2010, 06:57 AM	#4
LP_1985 JMM beat Pac-Man 3 Times East Side VIP Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Vicente Carrillo Fuentes Organization HQ, Home of Team Mexico Posts: 18,375 vCash: 75	Re: Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs... i think del boy is gona be a much easier fight than what audley is for haye
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10-02-2010, 06:58 AM	#5
ed7890 Col. Hunter Gathers East Side Guru Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Galway Posts: 8,922 vCash: 1127	Re: Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs... Chisora would batter Harrison
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10-02-2010, 07:00 AM	#7
GazOC Guest Star for Team Taff East Side VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: The Spion Kop Posts: 44,504 vCash: 1000	Re: Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs... Financially, given that both can earn well defending against (and I'm being kind here) average opponents, I'd say Wlad needs Haye as much as Haye needs Wlad but from a legacy or career point of view Wlads record will not suffer too much from not having a win over David Haye on it whereas Hayes will suffer considerably for not having beaten Wlad.
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10-02-2010, 07:06 AM	#9
NSFW ESB interacial lovin... East Side Guru Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Everything in Retro??? Posts: 9,295 vCash: 2266	Re: Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs... Haye has talked shit then bottled the big fight.
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10-02-2010, 07:20 AM	#12
GazOC Guest Star for Team Taff East Side VIP Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: The Spion Kop Posts: 44,504 vCash: 1000	Re: Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs... The reason that Haye is getting more shit is that he is the one thats perceived as having put the mockers on the Haye-Wlad fight. Vit and Wlad are getting an easy ride because they seem to want to fight Haye and other than Haye no one is really that bothered who they fight as the other contenders have either already been beaten by the Klits or just arn't that appealing to the fans. Last edited by GazOC; 10-02-2010 at 07:30 AM. Reason: fuking spastik spelling
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10-02-2010, 07:28 AM	#13
madballster Champion East Side Guru Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 9,041 vCash: 1000	Re: Haye-Harrison, Wlad-Chisora, and Vitali-Briggs... Haye didn't want to fight Wlad this year remember what Adam Booth said? Booth was on TV saying that Haye wasn't considering any opponents and needed a big long rest. That was in May, when the IBF said Wlad has to reach a deal with Haye in order to be relieved of the duty to defend against his mandatory challenger. Haye had ZERO interest in fighting Wlad this summer. Period. Doesn't mean he's scared of Wlad, he just didn't want to fight him now. My personal hypothesis is that Haye wants to get rid of Sauerland, his co-promoter. He owes them co-promotion rights for 2 more fights including the Harrison bout. They probably take a good chunk out of his part of the purse.
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