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Old 11-07-2007, 07:23 PM   #16
Amsterdam
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

I'd pick most modern Heavy's who are ranked, most modern solid CW's and plenty of famous LHW's over Marciano.

Bob Foster wins over Marciano in my opinion.
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Old 11-07-2007, 07:24 PM   #17
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by brownpimp88
He lost 7 times within a 3 year span prior to losing to marciano, i think that suggests his prime was over.

He lost twice to Walcott, who he beat before, than to Valdes, and than to Layne. The Johnson-loss I don´t count, because it was a robbery. No shame to lose against such good ranked opposition, let Wlad fight fighters like Ibragimov, Chagaev, Povetkin, Arreola, etc. (instead of fighters like Austin) in 2 years time than you would see that he would also lose some fights, lame counter...
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Old 11-07-2007, 07:25 PM   #18
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Amsterdam
I'd pick most modern Heavy's who are ranked, most modern solid CW's and plenty of famous LHW's over Marciano.

Bob Foster wins over Marciano in my opinion.

Of course Foster would win, he proved at HW that he could survive against an ATG-HW- puncher like Marciano with his iron chin...
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Old 11-07-2007, 07:26 PM   #19
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Luigi1985
He lost twice to Walcott, who he beat before, than to Valdes, and than to Layne. The Johnson-loss I don´t count, because it was a robbery. No shame to lose against such good ranked opposition, let Wlad fight fighters like Ibragimov, Chagaev, Povetkin, Arreola, etc. (instead of fighters like Austin) in 2 years time than you would see that he would also lose some fights, lame counter...
Yeah and right after the marciano losses he lost 15 times within 5 years. So he lost 22 times within 8 years, hardly a lame counter. Charles was past his prime.
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Old 11-07-2007, 07:46 PM   #20
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

Anthony Mundine is likely a good pick over Rocky also.
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Old 11-07-2007, 08:08 PM   #21
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

Best ever at around 200lbs +/- 5 lbs. I'd say the competition is between Marciano, Dempsey, Louis, and Holyfield. Tough to pick between them, if forced I'd probably go with Louis or Holyfield.
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Old 11-07-2007, 09:35 PM   #22
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by McGrain
There is some contention over his level of competition, but he fought the best of his era, overcame adversity (back, cuts, great, great boxing Heavyweights) and fought a proper pro career - never beaten.

Given that Roy Jones is treated by some as an unbeatable monster head to head (not unjustly perhaps), despite the fact that he didn't fight some of his best contempories, what of Marciano who actually remained unbeaten?

Can picking him over anyone between 175 and 200 be justified, Jones, Dempsey, Ezzard Charles (of course) included, be justified? Or is he the best around this weight, all time?
I would personally give Marciano at least even odds against any sub-200 pound opponent in history.
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Old 11-07-2007, 09:41 PM   #23
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

Anyone with a chin is a threat to Marciano.
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:17 PM   #24
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amsterdam
I'd pick most modern Heavy's who are ranked, most modern solid CW's and plenty of famous LHW's over Marciano.

Bob Foster wins over Marciano in my opinion.
You've got to be shitting me.

I'm no great fan of Marciano as they come but in my 30 years of watching the sport, and 8 years of competing in it, I'd say he's as good a pick as there is in the sub-200 class, a definite lb for lb'er. There are so many things he does so well that the novice misses on film and even his competition missed until they got in the ring with him. Supremely under-rated defense, fantastic stamina and fitness, and he carried a bit of pop. Plus, that somewhat important thing called heart which he proved time and again. Short career in terms of his time at the top? Sure, but his style dictated that, as did Fraziers, Dempsey's and Tyson's.

I'm not going to rank him as unbeatable vs. top heavies of the last three decades, but for under 200 lbs., no doubt in my mind.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:24 AM   #25
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Amsterdam
Anthony Mundine is likely a good pick over Rocky also.
Keep taking the tablets.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:26 AM   #26
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

Quote:
Originally Posted by McGrain
Can picking him over anyone between 175 and 200 be justified, Jones, Dempsey, Ezzard Charles (of course) included, be justified? Or is he the best around this weight, all time?
I would say only if they were an all time great and there was a good stylistic argument for that fighter beating him.

In that case sure.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:30 AM   #27
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

Quote:
Originally Posted by brownpimp88
Joe Frazier would have been undefeated if he fought during that era too.
It is one thing to run your eye down Marciano's record and conclude you would favour Frazier over every single opponent.

Quite another to asume that he would fight them all in that order and never loose.

Personaly I would give Marciano even money or less at repeating his 49-0 record if we ran the experiment agains with the same opponents.
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Old 11-08-2007, 06:31 AM   #28
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

Quote:
Amsterdam I'd pick most modern Heavy's who are ranked, most modern solid CW's and plenty of famous LHW's over Marciano.
Same here

Quote:
Bob Foster wins over Marciano in my opinion.
No way.
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Old 11-08-2007, 06:57 AM   #29
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by Mendoza
Same here
What modern cruiserweights would you pick over him?

Or heavyweights for that matter?
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Old 11-08-2007, 07:06 AM   #30
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Default Re: As Marciano was never beaten, is it reasonable to pick a >200lb fighter over him?

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Originally Posted by janitor
What modern cruiserweights would you pick over him?

Or heavyweights for that matter?
Oh, I misread the question. My mistake. I thought it read which modern heavyweight would you pick over Marciano's competition! Quite a few.

What modern Cruiserweights would I pick over Marciano?

Perhaps Holyfield at 190 pounds could eek out a point’s decision. But outside of Holyfield, there really has not been a super impressive cruiser weight.

I would pick Walcott, or a prime Charles to be the #1 guy at Cruiser weight today.
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