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Old 12-16-2010, 06:25 PM   #1
Lights Out
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Default Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

At 160 at 15 round distance- who ya got
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Old 12-16-2010, 06:31 PM   #2
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

James Toney ud
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Old 12-16-2010, 06:35 PM   #3
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

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Originally Posted by BUMPY KNUCKLES View Post
James Toney ud
You think Monzon's straight forward style would be effective or not?
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Old 12-16-2010, 06:54 PM   #4
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

I'm no authority on Monzon, but I don't think his style should be labeled "straight forward".

He was great at maintaining the distance he wanted. Definitely not the go straight to you kind of guy...

I say Monzon W15. Toney counters well enough to keep it competitive, but Toney can be outboxed and Monzon is too consistent and too good at making the fight go his way.
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Old 12-16-2010, 07:01 PM   #5
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

Monzon by wide decision. Toney's stay at 160 wasn't that great... a draw with Williams, a draw with a shopworn McCallum, a robbery victory over Tiberi. Please.
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Old 12-16-2010, 07:05 PM   #6
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

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Originally Posted by DaveK View Post
I'm no authority on Monzon, but I don't think his style should be labeled "straight forward".

He was great at maintaining the distance he wanted. Definitely not the go straight to you kind of guy...

I say Monzon W15. Toney counters well enough to keep it competitive, but Toney can be outboxed and Monzon is too consistent and too good at making the fight go his way.
I suppose I labelled it incorrectly. He hardly uses his footwork like a Jones and while he does well to keep distance (very well in fact, he was a shade below 6 foot but his jab never seemed to miss) but what I meant was you would rarely see him manouever around a little. He would be in your face all night
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Old 12-16-2010, 07:12 PM   #7
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

Monzon at 160, but Toney at 168 and upward... Toney is the greater overall fighter in history... I know Monzon nuts will never buy that, but so what... Cheers.....

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Old 12-16-2010, 07:12 PM   #8
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

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Originally Posted by Lights Out View Post
You think Monzon's straight forward style would be effective or not?
i dont think anything monzon tried would be effective against toney , i feel toney was a much better boxer and i think he would have controlled the fight throughout , being just to elusive for monzon , good matchup though
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Old 12-16-2010, 07:20 PM   #9
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

Toney's chances are not serious.
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Old 12-16-2010, 07:30 PM   #10
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

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Originally Posted by McGrain View Post
Toney's chances are not serious.

Hmmmm.... 'Tis a *****y statement... Even a drained Toney drew and beat a still capable but, aging Mike McCallum, in 1991 and 1992 at 160 pounds...

Okay, Okay.... Toney was horrid against David Tiberi.... Again, drained and weak at 160....


STILL! Toney was healthy and leaned out at 157 for Nunn when he KO'd Nunn for the IBF title in May '91, but that conditioning was short-lived there....

Toney looked strong and fit at 168 for Iran Barkley in 1993, but Barkley was dead at 168 by 1993....

Toney was a master in July 1994 when he parked a drained Charlie Williams at 168 on HBO.... Toney KO 12 Williams.... WICKED!

Toney was limp and dead for Royale Jones in Nov. 1994.... Making 168 by that time had almost killed Toney.... I have pix of Toney at the press conference weighing a reported 206 pounds.... CHRIST!

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Old 12-16-2010, 07:30 PM   #11
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

How have so many people got this so wrong so far?

Monzon would beat James Toney with ease. Monzon is a terrible matchup for him. Toney does not have great footwork, never did. Thats his major weakness as a fighter, in the pocket he was fantastic, at mid range he was good, but he can be outboxed on the outside because of his footwork. So the exact type of fighter you would want is somebody that can maintain distance - Monzon was the absolute master of this.
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Old 12-16-2010, 07:51 PM   #12
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

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Originally Posted by MRBILL View Post
Toney is the greater overall fighter in history...
MR.BILL
Fail.

Let's review the facts:

Monzon won 15 World Championship Middleweight bouts, with 12 being for the undisputed title. He won 80 straight fights and avenged his 3 losses, all of which occurred in the first 2 years of his run. It is as close to perfection as you can get unless you are a stubby, sainted Italian from Brockton...

Toney's career was brilliant at times and more than disappointing at others. Draws against Williams and a long in the tooth McCallum were bad enough, but the robbery against Tiberi sealed an underwhelming career at middle. He followed up a brilliant performance against Prince Williams with more losses to Jones (forgiveable), two to Montell Griffin (less forgiveable) and Drake Thradzi (unforgiveable). His last, best moments were beating Jirov (excellent victory) and Holyfield (debatable how good that was as Holy was aged and had always been inconsistent)... Lastly, I don't view his heavy reign as very credible as he was a known juicer and lost twice to Peter a very ordinary, though legit heavyweight and got another robbery versus Fres. He was more often a case of what could be rather that what was to be, one scintillating performance followed by two or more mediocre outings.
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Old 12-16-2010, 08:08 PM   #13
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

Sorry, Seamus..... That ain't gonna fly by me, mate....

Jim Toney has kicked world class ass from 160 to 200+ pounds, or has at least held his ground in losing...

Fact is, Carlito Monzon never beat a dude that Jim Toney couldn't lick, too.....

You all can scoff all you like, however, I cannot picture Monzon ever drawing or beating "Rahman & Ruiz" in a time machine at a catch-weight...... NOPE! I'm not even sure prime Monzon could handle Vassily Jirov of 2002 / '03 in a time machine, either...

Regardless, both are "Hallers" and each own a huge fan support....

Note: Toney WILL be inducted into the IBHOF one day.... WORD!

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Old 12-16-2010, 08:12 PM   #14
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

Toney was **** for years before he made his mini comeback at cruiser at heavy, something that seems to be forgotten often now.it's not like he was cutting a swathe through the divisions like a some giant unstoppable grimace.
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Old 12-16-2010, 08:17 PM   #15
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Default Re: Carlos Monzon vs James Toney

Monzon never lets Toney in the fight. Wide decision.
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