The Williams chin conundrum

Leif Erikson · 12-06-2009, 11:03 AM

As we saw last night, Williams can be hit and hurt badly, even by light punching fighters such as Sergio Martinez. However, he managed to weather the storm and see the final bell, earning a debatable decision victory. If you browse Williams' record, it's obvious that he hasn't fought a genuine 'knockout artist' since he started mixing it with top quality fighters. With this in mind, I think that Pavlik must be kicking himself for his apparent reticence to take on Williams - Such a contest would almost certainly end in a morale boosting first round knock out win for the Ohio man. I'm not a huge fan of his, but given Williams inability to take punches from Martinez without wilting, it's something of a no-brainer.

However, if he somehow made it through the early storm, being dropped and hurt but surviving could Williams chin again 'grow' into the task as it seemed to last night? Personally, I don't think so - We know that Martinez can't punch for toffee at world class level but given his flooring and repeated buzzing of Williams, you have to suspect that a genuine puncher would add a first stoppage defeat to the record of 'The Punisher'.

Jack · 12-06-2009, 11:08 AM

Martinez is not light hitting and even more, his punches come fast and from different angles. He has variety and speed, meaning he will always catch people clean and unexpected. Considering he has good power, it's not suprising he hurt Williams and he will hurt other top class fighters too.

Is Williams' chin a doubt? Not at all. He has a good chin but unexpected punches are the ones which hurt the most. As long as he is wary of the straight right, he'll be fine.

Sonny Carson · 12-06-2009, 11:08 AM

He did take some monster punches by Maragarito and Matthysse. Margarito could punch(and could have been wearing illegal hand wraps) and Matthysse(though a bad fighter) could bang too. Although Williams was hurt by that knockdown, honestly I think part of that knockdown was because he couldn't see the punch and because of fighting inactivity. And also Martinez can punch, I mean he basically knocked out Cintron, the ref just wasn't doing his job.

Zak2 · 12-06-2009, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leif Erikson

As we saw last night, Williams can be hit and hurt badly, even by light punching fighters such as Sergio Martinez. However, he managed to weather the storm and see the final bell, earning a debatable decision victory. If you browse Williams' record, it's obvious that he hasn't fought a genuine 'knockout artist' since he started mixing it with top quality fighters. With this in mind, I think that Pavlik must be kicking himself for his apparent reticence to take on Williams - Such a contest would almost certainly end in a morale boosting first round knock out win for the Ohio man. I'm not a huge fan of his, but given Williams inability to take punches from Martinez without wilting, it's something of a no-brainer.

However, if he somehow made it through the early storm, being dropped and hurt but surviving could Williams chin again 'grow' into the task as it seemed to last night? Personally, I don't think so - We know that Martinez can't punch for toffee at world class level but given his flooring and repeated buzzing of Williams, you have to suspect that a genuine puncher would add a first stoppage defeat to the record of 'The Punisher'.

Martinez is not a big puncher!! Let someone that really hits hard and you will see that PW chin is not that good. PW has poor defense and I see a devastating knock out in his future.

Martinez had him really hurt, but Martinez never really followed up his shots, he decided clench and wrestle Williams after he land a hard shot on Williams, he never would apply the pressure and go for the knock out.

It kind of reminded me of when Clottey fought Cotto, Clottey fought good enough to lose.

iceman71 · 12-06-2009, 11:10 AM

styles make fights...u cant base anything off this and say what pav would do.....evander holyfield struggled and looked like shit against a blown up bobby czyz while tyson was knocking WBA and WBC champions out in Frank Bruno and Bruce Seldon....then they meet and holyfield kicks his ass all over the ring....pavlik getting owned by hopkins and knocking out bums in his last 2 fights and not fighting for a year aint gonna help him.....

Zak2 · 12-06-2009, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack

Martinez is not light hitting and even more, his punches come fast and from different angles. He has variety and speed, meaning he will always catch people clean and unexpected. Considering he has good power, it's not suprising he hurt Williams and he will hurt other top class fighters too.

Is Williams' chin a doubt? Not at all. He has a good chin but unexpected punches are the ones which hurt the most. As long as he is wary of the straight right, he'll be fine.

Once again, Martinez is not, I repeat, is not a power puncher. PW gets knocked out by a real puncher.

Leif Erikson · 12-06-2009, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zak2

Martinez is not a big puncher!! Let someone that really hits hard and you will see that PW chin is not that good. PW has poor defense and I see a devastating knock out in his future.

I agree. I said that he's not a big puncher! A 50% KO ratio says it all. I think Williams should nix the idea of a Pavlik fight for now and stay at 154.

TonyPeri · 12-06-2009, 11:14 AM

I think Martinez won the fight. But I think he and PW out box Pavlick who I've lost all respect for.

walk with me · 12-06-2009, 11:14 AM

I'm still waiting to see the fitht but one punch on the money is all it takes... Who knows if pavlik would land that

TommyV · 12-06-2009, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leif Erikson

I agree. I said that he's not a big puncher! A 50% KO ratio says it all. I think Williams should nix the idea of a Pavlik fight for now and stay at 154.

What does KO ratio's have to do with anything? Ike Williams had a 50% KO ratio or so, I bet he can't punch either, right? LaMotta's was about 30%, I bet he's feather-fisted too, aye?

Beenie · 12-06-2009, 11:15 AM

Martinez may not be a banger but he also isn't a light puncher.

Just ask Cintron about how light Martinez' punches are who argued to the ref that the punch that knocked him down was caused from a butt.

boricua100% · 12-06-2009, 11:20 AM

I have never seen this before

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

nervousxtian · 12-06-2009, 11:20 AM

Martinez has grown into a puncher.. his record over the last 17 fights = 15 wins 1 loss 1 draw and 14 KO's.

Change that draw to a KO like it should have been and it'd be 16 - 1 w/ 15 KO's.

Yeah, of course he can't punch.

Jack · 12-06-2009, 11:22 AM

I couldn't care less what you see when you go onto BoxRec. I've watched Martinez for years and I know he is a hard puncher. He's not a one punch KO artist, but his record is deceptive.

KO ratio tells you nothing, as was proven when Ike Williams was mentioned - Go onto YouTube, watch him destroy Beau Jack, who was as tough as they come, and tell me he can't punch and that KO ratio means something.

BoxRec warriors...

Leif Erikson · 12-06-2009, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nervousxtian

Martinez has grown into a puncher.. his record over the last 17 fights = 15 wins 1 loss 1 draw and 14 KO's.

Change that draw to a KO like it should have been and it'd be 16 - 1 w/ 15 KO's.

Yeah, of course he can't punch.

Against TERRIBLE opposition for the most part. Just terrible.

12-06-2009, 11:03 AM	#1
Leif Erikson Contender ESB Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,090 vCash: 1000	The Williams chin conundrum As we saw last night, Williams can be hit and hurt badly, even by light punching fighters such as Sergio Martinez. However, he managed to weather the storm and see the final bell, earning a debatable decision victory. If you browse Williams' record, it's obvious that he hasn't fought a genuine 'knockout artist' since he started mixing it with top quality fighters. With this in mind, I think that Pavlik must be kicking himself for his apparent reticence to take on Williams - Such a contest would almost certainly end in a morale boosting first round knock out win for the Ohio man. I'm not a huge fan of his, but given Williams inability to take punches from Martinez without wilting, it's something of a no-brainer. However, if he somehow made it through the early storm, being dropped and hurt but surviving could Williams chin again 'grow' into the task as it seemed to last night? Personally, I don't think so - We know that Martinez can't punch for toffee at world class level but given his flooring and repeated buzzing of Williams, you have to suspect that a genuine puncher would add a first stoppage defeat to the record of 'The Punisher'.
Top

12-06-2009, 11:08 AM	#2
Jack P4P King East Side VIP Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: England Posts: 18,872 vCash: 15000	Re: The Williams chin conundrum Martinez is not light hitting and even more, his punches come fast and from different angles. He has variety and speed, meaning he will always catch people clean and unexpected. Considering he has good power, it's not suprising he hurt Williams and he will hurt other top class fighters too. Is Williams' chin a doubt? Not at all. He has a good chin but unexpected punches are the ones which hurt the most. As long as he is wary of the straight right, he'll be fine.
Top

12-06-2009, 11:08 AM	#3
Sonny Carson Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 1,506 vCash: 1000	Re: The Williams chin conundrum He did take some monster punches by Maragarito and Matthysse. Margarito could punch(and could have been wearing illegal hand wraps) and Matthysse(though a bad fighter) could bang too. Although Williams was hurt by that knockdown, honestly I think part of that knockdown was because he couldn't see the punch and because of fighting inactivity. And also Martinez can punch, I mean he basically knocked out Cintron, the ref just wasn't doing his job.
Top

12-06-2009, 11:10 AM	#5
iceman71 WBC SILVER Champion East Side VIP Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: the DIRTY SOUTH Posts: 19,359 vCash: 1000	Re: The Williams chin conundrum styles make fights...u cant base anything off this and say what pav would do.....evander holyfield struggled and looked like shit against a blown up bobby czyz while tyson was knocking WBA and WBC champions out in Frank Bruno and Bruce Seldon....then they meet and holyfield kicks his ass all over the ring....pavlik getting owned by hopkins and knocking out bums in his last 2 fights and not fighting for a year aint gonna help him.....
Top

12-06-2009, 11:14 AM	#8
TonyPeri Gatekeeper ESB Full Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 368 vCash: 1000	Re: The Williams chin conundrum I think Martinez won the fight. But I think he and PW out box Pavlick who I've lost all respect for.
Top

12-06-2009, 11:14 AM	#9
walk with me Champion East Side Guru Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Miami Posts: 9,871 vCash: 1000	Re: The Williams chin conundrum I'm still waiting to see the fitht but one punch on the money is all it takes... Who knows if pavlik would land that
Top

12-06-2009, 11:15 AM	#11
Beenie Evolve already! East Side Guru Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: On the path to Desire > Fear Posts: 9,884 vCash: 1389	Re: The Williams chin conundrum Martinez may not be a banger but he also isn't a light puncher. Just ask Cintron about how light Martinez' punches are who argued to the ref that the punch that knocked him down was caused from a butt.
Top

12-06-2009, 11:20 AM	#12
boricua100% Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Puerto Rico Posts: 2,433 vCash: 1000	Re: The Williams chin conundrum I have never seen this before [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
Top

12-06-2009, 11:20 AM	#13
nervousxtian Northwest Boxing Guru East Side Guru Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Northwest Posts: 5,430 vCash: 526	Re: The Williams chin conundrum Martinez has grown into a puncher.. his record over the last 17 fights = 15 wins 1 loss 1 draw and 14 KO's. Change that draw to a KO like it should have been and it'd be 16 - 1 w/ 15 KO's. Yeah, of course he can't punch.
Top

12-06-2009, 11:22 AM	#14
Jack P4P King East Side VIP Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: England Posts: 18,872 vCash: 15000	Re: The Williams chin conundrum I couldn't care less what you see when you go onto BoxRec. I've watched Martinez for years and I know he is a hard puncher. He's not a one punch KO artist, but his record is deceptive. KO ratio tells you nothing, as was proven when Ike Williams was mentioned - Go onto YouTube, watch him destroy Beau Jack, who was as tough as they come, and tell me he can't punch and that KO ratio means something. BoxRec warriors...
Top