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Old 04-02-2011, 12:55 PM   #61
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Default Re: Controversial boxing opinions

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Originally Posted by My2Sense View Post
Why would this be "controversial"? Isn't Chavez generally considered better than Ambers?
*Barney Ross

Although I would certainly think Chavez-Ambers would be competitive too.
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Old 04-02-2011, 12:57 PM   #62
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Funny how opinions of Aaron Pryor being overrated and underrated have both made this thread.
Ha ha! True But i think Pryor seems to fall into both categories depending on what way people take him. Like the saying goes, hes like marmite, you either love him or hate him, which kinda explains the way hes thought off in the extreme mirror opposites of opinion
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:03 PM   #63
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Why would this be "controversial"? Isn't Chavez generally considered better than Ambers?
Unfortunately.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:03 PM   #64
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I think Byrd would have always given Lennox some problems, because Lennox wouldnt box him like a statue from the outside like the Klitschkos. Steward knew it, Lennox knew it, so they took the Range Rover instead. Smart move.
LH, pray tell me where the film shows Jack Dempsey,not being a great fighter? Aside from the Gene Tunney fights when Dempsey hadn't fought in over THREE years,was thirty two years old , what fight did you see Jack
Dempsey lose ? Answer NONE. From 1917,when he hooked up with Jack Kearns, til 1923 when he flattened Luis Angel Firpo,Jack Dempsey was considered invincible by the boxing world of that day, who saw him defeat
whoever he faced, so tell me what makes you claim that all who saw him
[prior to Hallywood],were less knowledgeable than you eighty years after the fact. I'm not being too controversial ,methinks...
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:05 PM   #65
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Don't just snipe. Man up with your own.
Just messin' with ya.

I've done my own on the first and second pages. I'm sure I have more, but that's what I thought of off the top of the head.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:08 PM   #66
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If Bubi Scholz would have gotten a shot at the world title in his prime at mw he would have been champ, gotten a few defences under his belt and now be ranked as an atg.

Ike Williams would beat Roberto Duran in his own game.

Tszyu would beat even prime Chavez.

Vitali is not a great hw and should not be ranked highly.

Size is overrated and has diminishing returns anyway.

Joe Frazier and Rocky Marciano would beat Lennox Lewis.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:14 PM   #67
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Jack Dempsey was a champion and has a high place in boxing history, but wasn't as great a fighter as often stated, and I think film and results both show it.
I rate him in the top 2 heavyweights of all-time, and among the best pound-for-pound too.
I sometimes feel my view on this is more controversial than the contrary view that you hold.
Revisionist history has taken a toll on Dempsey's standing I think.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:31 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by My2Sense View Post
Why would this be "controversial"? Isn't Chavez generally considered better than Ambers?
He is but he shouldn´t be. And this would be an awesome, awesome fight.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:34 PM   #69
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I rate him in the top 2 heavyweights of all-time, and among the best pound-for-pound too.
I sometimes feel my view on this is more controversial than the contrary view that you hold.
Revisionist history has taken a toll on Dempsey's standing I think.
Why?
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:43 PM   #70
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Default Re: Controversial boxing opinions

Vincente Saldivar and in particular his 'comeback' is radically overrated.

Sam Langford is a smidge overrated.

Eddie Perkins would outpoint Aaron Pryor at least one fight out of three.

Archie Moore's reputation is slightly inflated because people are too forgiving of his several one sided losses. Being dominated by Patterson, Marciano, Burley, Bivins, Charles, and Morrow should not be so easily forgiven. All time great no doubt, but the man wasn't a cure for cancer.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:45 PM   #71
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Default Re: Controversial boxing opinions

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Revisionist history has taken a toll on Dempsey's standing I think.
I agree. This kinda thing tends to happen. Overrated fighters become underrated and vice versa.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:51 PM   #72
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Default Re: Controversial boxing opinions

Ray Robinson is the third greatest boxer of all time.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:51 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by The Funny Man 7 View Post
Vincente Saldivar and in particular his 'comeback' is radically overrated.

Sam Langford is a smidge overrated.

Eddie Perkins would outpoint Aaron Pryor at least one fight out of three.

Archie Moore's reputation is slightly inflated because people are too forgiving of his several one sided losses. Being dominated by Patterson, Marciano, Burley, Bivins, Charles, and Morrow should not be so easily forgiven. All time great no doubt, but the man wasn't a cure for cancer.
I think you're referring to Eder Jofre in your first point.

As for Moore, I agree on the whole, but you do have to cut him slack for the Morrow and Bivins defeats.
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Old 04-02-2011, 01:55 PM   #74
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Default Re: Controversial boxing opinions

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Originally Posted by The Funny Man 7 View Post
Archie Moore's reputation is slightly inflated because people are too forgiving of his several one sided losses. Being dominated by Patterson, Marciano, Burley, Bivins, Charles, and Morrow should not be so easily forgiven. All time great no doubt, but the man wasn't a cure for cancer.
I love the mongoose but i have to agree with this.
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Old 04-02-2011, 02:03 PM   #75
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Why?

1. As burt rightly points out, Dempsey was rated as the best by a wide group of experts and insiders, from the time he was champion and for several decades after. Louis and Dempsey were the best then, and I think that still holds. Obviously some might disagree and say Ali, Foreman, Marciano, Holmes and whoever somehow manage to squeeze in front of Dempsey. That's cool, but the fact is Dempsey and Louis were considered so close in terms of greatness that if one of them can still be considered number 1 now, I don't see why the other can't be too. Of course, some revisionists are chipping away at Louis's standing too, and many are declaring he can't be considered number 1 ! Still, Dempsey is an easier target and gets savaged by the revisionists.

2. He looks great on film, to me. Every bit as good as they said he was.
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