Zuffa Interjects in Fedor Emelianenko Negotiations with Strikeforce

[Beekeeper]

Originally Posted by AJAX

not just that, Fedor has a big salary and on top of that M1 get's half the profit making impossible for SF to make much money when Fedor fights.
Fedor had to continue his streak of ending orgs when he fights for them

What would those orgs be without Fedor? Who watched Strikeforce before he signed with them?

[greathamza]

Originally Posted by Will Cooling

You're the type of guy who stops following bands when they become popular aren't you?

No not rly i like A. Silva, JDS, Cain, Fedor, BJ, sakuraba and GSP even tho his fights get a bit boring from time to time.

i dont like the huge hype that the fighters cant live up to like Lesnar out striking JDS is just laughable but that is what a hype does to those who doesnt know anything about the sport and only believe in the hype

[Beekeeper]

Originally Posted by Primate

Lesnar is a bigger PPV draw than Fedor.

To argue otherwise is just stupidity.

Of course its ridiculous, we all know that Fedor's UFC debut was a huge bomb, and nobody has ever heard of him besides Japanese people.

[Will Cooling]

Originally Posted by greathamza

No not rly i like A. Silva, JDS, Cain, Fedor, BJ, sakuraba and GSP even tho his fights get a bit boring from time to time.

i dont like the huge hype that the fighters cant live up to like Lesnar out striking JDS is just laughable but that is what a hype does to those who doesnt know anything about the sport and only believe in the hype

I haven't read one person who thinks Lesnar can out strike JDS. In any case its stupid to hate a fighter because someone somewhere who's stupid likes him.

And the fact is that Lesnar lived up to hype - he was thrown in the deep end and won big matches. The UFC promoted the fight against Velasquez as a 50-50 contest and it was. Lesnar came out all guns blazing and got picked apart, which again conforms to the hype that he's this brute force but unskilled.

[greathamza]

Originally Posted by Will Cooling

I haven't read one person who thinks Lesnar can out strike JDS. In any case its stupid to hate a fighter because someone somewhere who's stupid likes him.

And the fact is that Lesnar lived up to hype - he was thrown in the deep end and won big matches. The UFC promoted the fight against Velasquez as a 50-50 contest and it was. Lesnar came out all guns blazing and got picked apart, which again conforms to the hype that he's this brute force but unskilled.

They said he had great standup and great stamina and had the speed of a WW yet he got subbed by Mir and got embarrassed by Cain

[greathamza]

Originally Posted by Beekeeper

Of course its ridiculous, we all know that Fedor's UFC debut was a huge bomb, and nobody has ever heard of him besides Japanese people.

that made my day

[Will Cooling]

Originally Posted by greathamza

They said he had great standup and great stamina and had the speed of a WW yet he got subbed by Mir and got embarrassed by Cain

Who said he had great stand up? Show me. Everything I saw put out by the UFC was code for "his technique sucks but he's a big guy with small gloves so he could knock a dude out with a lucky shot".

And he is extraordinary fast for a man his size, as was saw even in the Velasquez fight. Don't see how he got embarassed - he just ran up against somebody more well-rounded and better than him. Simple as. Its not like Velasquez is a bum either - he's not only undefeated but has yet to lose a single round.

And to hold the first Mir fight against him is just stupid. He destroyed Mir in what was in reality his pro debut before making a rookie mistake. And if you look at the Herring fight and the second Mir fight he made the necessary revisions.

[kelics]

I would love to see fedor with big foot 2!!!!!!!!! what can be bigger?!

[Thom]

Originally Posted by Beekeeper

If Lesnar headlined Pride 32 and Affliction do you think they would be more successful? People don't watch UFC because of Lesnar, they watch it because its well established in the American market. If you buy UFC just to see the great master Brock Lesnar then I apologize.

Yes, Lesnar absolutely would have sold more PPVs than Fedor did due to his popularity from his pro wrestling days. He probably wouldn't have cracked a million buys without the UFC brand name, but I believe that he would have still easily outsold Fedor. UFC cards don't have a uniform buyrate. The numbers vary greatly based who's headlining. I also think that you're failing to take into account how poor Fedor's US PPV numbers were. PRIDE 32 did 40,000 buys, and the Afflication cards did about 100,000 a piece.

Look, all due respect to Fedor for what he's accomplished in the ring/cage over the years, but it's farcical to claim that the guy is the biggest draw in the sport. The numbers just don't support that claim. He doesn't have any real pull outside of hardcore fans who've been following MMA since before the post-TUF 1 explosion of popularity. Frankly, it's his own fault that he didn't effectively promote himself after the death of PRIDE. His "management" was more focused on bleeding struggling orgs dry than cementing his legacy.

[Beekeeper]

To claim this is far from ridiculous. Perhaps wrestling fans do not know him so well but that does not constitute the majority of new MMA fans. Perhaps I am blinded by my own personal preference, but I think a Fedor UFC event would garner more interest than a Lesnar one, even post losses.

[Thom]

Originally Posted by Beekeeper

To claim this is far from ridiculous. Perhaps wrestling fans do not know him so well but that does not constitute the majority of new MMA fans. Perhaps I am blinded by my own personal preference, but I think a Fedor UFC event would garner more interest than a Lesnar one, even post losses.

If he had signed with the UFC immediately after the demise of PRIDE and continued his streak for a couple more years, it's possible that he could have been built into a major draw in the US. To claim that he could headline a UFC PPV now after the abrupt end of the "Fedor mystique" is, again, farcical. There's just no way he would "garner more interest in Lesnar" (i.e. do well over a milllion PPV buys) considering what has happened in the past year and the fact his career is clearly on the downside. No way.

[Valane]

Originally Posted by Will Cooling

Who said he had great stand up? Show me. Everything I saw put out by the UFC was code for "his technique sucks but he's a big guy with small gloves so he could knock a dude out with a lucky shot".

And he is extraordinary fast for a man his size, as was saw even in the Velasquez fight. Don't see how he got embarassed - he just ran up against somebody more well-rounded and better than him. Simple as. Its not like Velasquez is a bum either - he's not only undefeated but has yet to lose a single round.

And to hold the first Mir fight against him is just stupid. He destroyed Mir in what was in reality his pro debut before making a rookie mistake. And if you look at the Herring fight and the second Mir fight he made the necessary revisions.

Carwin made him shell up in the foetal position, Cain made him shell up too, both were abysmal performances. Cain is a decent fighter, but was getting bounced around by Kongo, Carwin has a powerful one two. Being completely dominated by both is not good.

I always hear this speed myth thrown about. He has no kicking game, average to slow hand speed and slow movement speed.

[greathamza]

Originally Posted by Will Cooling

Who said he had great stand up? Show me. Everything I saw put out by the UFC was code for "his technique sucks but he's a big guy with small gloves so he could knock a dude out with a lucky shot".

And he is extraordinary fast for a man his size, as was saw even in the Velasquez fight. Don't see how he got embarassed - he just ran up against somebody more well-rounded and better than him. Simple as. Its not like Velasquez is a bum either - he's not only undefeated but has yet to lose a single round.

And to hold the first Mir fight against him is just stupid. He destroyed Mir in what was in reality his pro debut before making a rookie mistake. And if you look at the Herring fight and the second Mir fight he made the necessary revisions.

now if you where in a cage with millions watching you get pounded would you SCREAM on top of your lungs to the ref to stop cuz you are more or less being raped by a mexican dude. Dana white said afterward "i thought he screamed uncle, uncle" and then laught a little
if that isnt embarrassing then i dont know what is

[Beekeeper]

Originally Posted by Thom

If he had signed with the UFC immediately after the demise of PRIDE and continued his streak for a couple more years, it's possible that he could have been built into a major draw in the US. To claim that he could headline a UFC PPV now after the abrupt end of the "Fedor mystique" is, again, farcical. There's just no way he would "garner more interest in Lesnar" (i.e. do well over a milllion PPV buys) considering what has happened in the past year and the fact his career is clearly on the downside. No way.

Its not just about the "no loss" mystique, he forces the action the way few do in MMA, even him getting beat down by Silva was an exciting fight. He almost got the sub near the end of the second round, put him against anyone and its still an exciting fight, no matter how faded he is (well, ok, at least for a 2-3 more years).

I don't know how you can still talk about Lesnar this way, Lesnar's mystique is gone as well, and his loss was more of a beatdown than Fedor's. More people watching the fight will be looking at how JDS does as the potential challenger.

[Thom]

Originally Posted by Beekeeper

Its not just about the "no loss" mystique, he forces the action the way few do in MMA, even him getting beat down by Silva was an exciting fight. He almost got the sub near the end of the second round, put him against anyone and its still an exciting fight, no matter how faded he is (well, ok, at least for a 2-3 more years).

There are plenty of guys who consistently put on exciting fights but don't get anywhere near a million PPV buys. Like I wrote before, I just don't think it's possible for Fedor to become a PPV star at this point.

I don't know how you can still talk about Lesnar this way, Lesnar's mystique is gone as well, and his loss was more of a beatdown than Fedor's. More people watching the fight will be looking at how JDS does as the potential challenger.

I'm not sure where you get the idea that I think Lesnar is going to draw the same kind of interest for his future fights that he did before. I fully concede the point that Lesnar's drawing power has probably taken a serious hit in the wake of his recent loss. The ratings of the current season of The Ultimate Fighter are in the toilet in spite of his presence.