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Old 11-27-2007, 05:32 AM   #16
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

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Originally Posted by Senya13
Unlike Burley, Roy was throwing a lot of combinations, instead of one, or, rarely, two punches at a time. .
Sure. It's worth noting though that Burley was keen to slow the action down down down when he was in with someone a good deal bigger. Although actually it sounds like he gave Turner clean hell, so maybe it was more about a guy who worried him than the guys size.
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Old 11-27-2007, 05:37 AM   #17
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

Smith seemed somewhat slow in that film, and when Burley was jumping in with a punch or two, Smith covered up, it taking some time for him to react to attack, and Burley usually had plenty of time to step backwards to avoid a counter, or to come into a clinch. I feel he could be throwing at least 2-3 punches combinations without endangering himself that much.
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Old 11-27-2007, 05:53 AM   #18
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

I disagree. Burley was winning in the fashion that he created, he knew this, and Smith was known as a banger, a big puncher. Why take that risk?

Besides, that is the rematch. Burley probably had Smith firmly felt out from the orignal match. Some say Burley deliberately carried Smith in that one, I don't know.
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Old 11-27-2007, 06:10 AM   #19
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

The first time they met Burley was a lot more active. He was chasing Smith around the ring, two knockdowns, and Smith was only thinking about defense in 9 rounds out of 10 (except 3rd). Hardly anything to make Burley cautious in the rematch. What, the Marshall-Smith fight made him so afraid of Smith's right hook?
And like I said, it continued like this in all rounds, one or, rarely, two punches at a time, even though there were plenty of opportunities to throw combinations against a ponderous covering up opponent, without much risk.
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Old 11-27-2007, 06:14 AM   #20
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

Bottom line - Smith was a big hitting LHW, Burley was a natural 147 IMO, 154 in yours. He was winning the fight without taking these risks you describe.

Why get careless?
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Old 11-27-2007, 06:20 AM   #21
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

He was winning a lot more impressive the first time. What happened before the rematch that it made him so cautious? Or, perhaps, he wasn't so good a combination puncher after all, far inferior to Jones in this department?
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Old 11-27-2007, 06:22 AM   #22
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

Based on what I know, I wold say that Jones would be a better combination puncher than Burley, yes. But they are pretty different in that regard, I think. Comparisons between Jones and Burley seem to abound these days - I think any similaritys are a little overstated personlly. They both seemed to have a real quickness, and they both seemed to be able to impose their style regardless of the opponent though.
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Old 11-27-2007, 06:34 AM   #23
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

There were similarities in the in and out movement, I think. And old Jones, whose body coordination has deteriorated, also throws only one or two punches at a time at long range. Both used range-finding jab. Both liked timing the opponent's moves and throwing their own punch a fraction of a second earlier. Both holding left hand low a lot of time. Both like throwing punches at unusual angles. In the 6th round Burley showed nice defensive moves too, with head and upper body movement.
Although there are more differences than similarities, in my opinion too.
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Old 11-27-2007, 06:38 AM   #24
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

You make interesting and valid points here.
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Old 11-27-2007, 06:46 AM   #25
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

I wrote an article about that fight on one Russian forum, when I first saw it, so I'm using that text to sum up my impressions about Burley's style.

Last edited by Bananas; 10-08-2006 at 05:42 PM.
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Old 11-27-2007, 05:38 PM   #26
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Senya13
There were similarities in the in and out movement, I think. And old Jones, whose body coordination has deteriorated, also throws only one or two punches at a time at long range. Both used range-finding jab. Both liked timing the opponent's moves and throwing their own punch a fraction of a second earlier. Both holding left hand low a lot of time. Both like throwing punches at unusual angles. In the 6th round Burley showed nice defensive moves too, with head and upper body movement.
Although there are more differences than similarities, in my opinion too.
That is true...and you are also correct re combination punching between Roy Jones and Burley...Perhaps? I'm just going from the one film of Burley...However, Roy Jones is a breath- taking combination puncher (with power), to say the least...I think that both were definitely innovators in the ring...and I thought that their defensive movements and reactions were similar...I don't think it's a stretch to compare them stylistically at all.
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Old 11-27-2007, 05:44 PM   #27
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

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Originally Posted by dpw417
Perhaps? I'm just going from the one film of Burley....
That's the problem bud. Senya's break down is excellent, but to much, far to much is made of this film. I see Burley as a 147 fighter, he was in with a 175lb man for this fight. Of course this is going to affect Burley's style.

Moore (listed as 161 for that fight) described being in with Burley as akin to fighting "a riveting gun" with punches coming "from all angles". As a source, Moore is not ideal, and it is important not to romanticise a fighter like Burley, on whom there are many words but not much film - but I think it's fair to say that the style that Burley used against Smith (and other big punchers/bigger men) was not the same strategy he used when in more shallow waters.

Clearly he had Moore's number, clearly he felt this was the case going in. There are even unsabstantiated stories of Burley sitting up late the night before drinking whiskey, playing poker.
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Old 11-27-2007, 05:50 PM   #28
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

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Originally Posted by McGrain
That's the problem bud. Senya's break down is excellent, but to much, far to much is made of this film. I see Burley as a 147 fighter, he was in with a 175lb man for this fight. Of course this is going to affect Burley's style.

Moore (listed as 161 for that fight) described being in with Burley as akin to fighting "a riveting gun" with punches coming "from all angles". As a source, Moore is not ideal, and it is important not to romanticise a fighter like Burley, on whom there are many words but not much film - but I think it's fair to say that the style that Burley used against Smith (and other big punchers/bigger men) was not the same strategy he used when in more shallow waters.

Clearly he had Moore's number, clearly he felt this was the case going in. There are even unsabstantiated stories of Burley sitting up late the night before drinking whiskey, playing poker.
Absolutely.
Fighting big men is RISKY....BTW, I like your avator....I think he may have a shot at it!
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Old 11-27-2007, 05:52 PM   #29
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

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Originally Posted by dpw417
Absolutely.
Fighting big men is RISKY....BTW, I like your avator....I think he may have a shot at it!
Sure, and even though Burley had the power and the chin, Smith was seen as a proper banger, a real hitter.

...i want Ricky to win. The closer we get the more hope I have! But if i'm honest I am picking, at this time, Mayweather to win...

"Make this a very ugly fight".
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Old 11-27-2007, 06:00 PM   #30
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Default Re: What would Charley Burley do....

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Originally Posted by McGrain
Sure, and even though Burley had the power and the chin, Smith was seen as a proper banger, a real hitter.

...i want Ricky to win. The closer we get the more hope I have! But if i'm honest I am picking, at this time, Mayweather to win...

"Make this a very ugly fight".
It needs to be ugly...I did hear Joe Cortez is the referee howevr. He refereed Hatton's last fight. Maybe, Hatton gets to fight his kind of fight.

Last edited by Thread Stealer; 10-09-2006 at 04:27 PM.
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