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Old 06-30-2011, 01:06 PM   #1
Tin_Ribs
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Default 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

In slight relation to the 'fighters who disappointed you' thread. A lot of supposed underachievers have passed through the professional ranks over the years, but which of the flawed geniuses never had as much ability or potential in your opinion as is often made out?

Eg. as an Englishmen I've never been sold on the mythos around a man like Laing where his level of natural ability is concerned. Not to the standard that many hold him to, at least, even though he was clearly talented in his own way.
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Old 06-30-2011, 01:20 PM   #2
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Laing is a good call.Physically gifted and good tools offensively, but just woefully naive defensively which would have held him back even with the dedication of a spartan.

Zab Judah...just shite.
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Old 06-30-2011, 01:28 PM   #3
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Zab Judah- No stamina, holes in his game the size of swiss cheese, runs around the ring in the most idiotic energy wasting fashion at times.

Jimmy Young- Too passive, and not that great of a physical talent. Only really shines as a technical talent because of the unskilled, weak late 70's.

David Tua- Predictable, lacked the punch variety of a top level swarmer, lacked the activity of a top level swarmer, and was strongly lacking in defensive ability. Cool haircut though.

Tony Ayala Jr.-Destined to implode in or out of the ring. More of a ticking time bomb than Tyson ever was. I'd say the same for Valero.

Naseem Hamed- Oversold ability due to cheap competition, style that would never translate into any real longevity... Boxing's equivalent of highlight reel AndOne tapes.
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Old 06-30-2011, 01:33 PM   #4
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Joan Guzman is another recent one for me.

He did have raw physical talent, but was always unfocused, sloppy and not nearly as cute as he thought he was.
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Old 06-30-2011, 01:44 PM   #5
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Zab Judah is and was never that good.
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Old 06-30-2011, 01:52 PM   #6
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Looks like we're all in accord on Zab then, though I'm mildly interested in the upcoming Khan fight.

Good calls on the others too with the likes of Hamed and especially Guzman, who actually reminds me of Laing in a roundabout sort of way with the physical talent but overrated technical prowess and defensive lapses.
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Old 06-30-2011, 02:09 PM   #7
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

A quick attempt at listing the most genuinely talented of the underachievers(looking more at fighters with bad lifestyles or headcase mentality rather than those who maybe just lacked one key fighting attribute like power, or were stymied by bad promotion etc)from the past 30-40 years..

Fighting Harada
Benny Lynch
Wilfred Benitez
Ruben Olivares
John Conteh
Eddie Gregory
Chan-Hee Park
Hilario Zapata
Jung-Koo Chang
Jiro Watanabe
Mike Tyson
Raul Jibaro Perez
James Toney
Chris Eubank
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Old 06-30-2011, 02:22 PM   #8
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Devon Alexander is at the top of the list. I liked much of what I saw in the Urango fight, but the more I dug in and analyze him, the less I liked what I saw. Beyond some of the amateurish flaws in his game skill wise (like grunting before every combination, which lets the opponent know what's coming and eliminates his ability to feint, coming up short on combinations, getting hit too easily, etc.), his physical talent is overrated. I don't see him as having anything better than average power, above average (but not great) speed, and he's not big enough to get away with the mistakes he makes. Doesn't have a great ring IQ either, and with the hundreds of amateur fights he's had, I think he's pretty much the finished product despite him still being young.
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Old 06-30-2011, 02:30 PM   #9
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

His power is probably quite good. I'd say his shit leverage and shot picking is what's killing him.

His ring IQ is indeed amateurish and easily outdone at the world/p4p level.
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Old 06-30-2011, 02:33 PM   #10
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swarmer View Post
His power is probably quite good. I'd say his shit leverage and shot picking is what's killing him.

His ring IQ is indeed amateurish and easily outdone at the world/p4p level.
Good point.
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Old 06-30-2011, 02:34 PM   #11
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Odlanier Solis: He has never impressed me as a proffesional at all.
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Old 06-30-2011, 02:42 PM   #12
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Quote:
Originally Posted by lora View Post
Laing is a good call.Physically gifted and good tools offensively, but just woefully naive defensively which would have held him back even with the dedication of a spartan.

Zab Judah...just shite.
This!
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Old 06-30-2011, 03:14 PM   #13
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

I've never really understood all that "Jerry Quarry would be champ in any other era". He was a good contender, and would have been in most eras. Nothing more, nothing less.
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Old 06-30-2011, 03:35 PM   #14
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

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Originally Posted by Bokaj View Post
I've never really understood all that "Jerry Quarry would be champ in any other era". He was a good contender, and would have been in most eras. Nothing more, nothing less.
True, but in the context of the thread you've kind of defeated your own argument. Quarry wasn't the type of flash, physical talent or natural athlete that usually attracts the 'gifted' label, nor was he really an underachiever. He was exactly what you said he is, but it's almost the exact opposite of what the thread was asking after.
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Old 06-30-2011, 03:44 PM   #15
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Default Re: 'Gifted' underachievers who were never all that gifted in your opinion

Quote:
Originally Posted by lora View Post
A quick attempt at listing the most genuinely talented of the underachievers(looking more at fighters with bad lifestyles or headcase mentality rather than those who maybe just lacked one key fighting attribute like power, or were stymied by bad promotion etc)from the past 30-40 years..

Fighting Harada
Benny Lynch
Wilfred Benitez
Ruben Olivares
John Conteh
Eddie Gregory
Chan-Hee Park
Hilario Zapata
Jung-Koo Chang
Jiro Watanabe
Mike Tyson
Raul Jibaro Perez
James Toney
Chris Eubank
Yeah, I'd just about agree with all of those as real gifted underachievers and not the overrated type. What would you make of, say, Jose Medel and Gerry Penalosa in the same vein?
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