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Old 03-26-2012, 04:08 PM   #46
Senor Pepe'
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

The only person on the planet that had Muhammad Ali winning was,

Radio Talkshow Host, Art Rust Jr.,,,,,,,who was admittedly,,,,,an 'Ali Shill'.

The guy even scored the last round even,,,,,, which lost him respect from the New York Boxing Press.

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Old 03-26-2012, 04:26 PM   #47
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Some crazy shit thinking ali took more than 6 rounds.
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Old 03-26-2012, 08:01 PM   #48
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Frazier 9 rounds, Ali 6. Out of all the scores, this one seems the most reasonable and realistic.
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Old 03-26-2012, 10:56 PM   #49
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Quote:
Originally Posted by round15 View Post
Frazier 9 rounds, Ali 6. Out of all the scores, this one seems the most reasonable and realistic.
Good score,,,,,,,,,,

Plus give 'Smokin Joe' an additional 2-points for Rounds 11 & 15.

That would be 144 - 139 in points.
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Old 03-26-2012, 11:51 PM   #50
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Senor Pepe' View Post
The only person on the planet that had Muhammad Ali winning was,

Radio Talkshow Host, Art Rust Jr.,,,,,,,who was admittedly,,,,,an 'Ali Shill'.

The guy even scored the last round even,,,,,, which lost him respect from the New York Boxing Press.

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Score the fight for the recent late Joe Frazier. I think I gave Ali about 6 rounds on my card.
How can one fighter get knockdown and take a beating in said round(15) and have it scored even?

A lot of Ali homers would score this some what close fight for Ali, perhaps.(maybe??) But even they would have score round 15 for Joe Frazier.
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Old 03-27-2012, 12:29 AM   #51
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

10-5 Frazier. He didnt really need the knockdown in the last round but it was icing on the cake.

Give Ali credit for showing a great heart and proving his toughness but he got beaten soundly.

Joe Frazier was a machine that night. His quickness suprised many people. He was able to whip that hook to Ali`s jaw time and again. Ali underestimated how good Frazier left was.

Ali did land alot of punches early in the fight he was stinging Joe but as the midrounds came Frazier made Ali miss more than he ever had before. It was an impressive display.

It was just a great night.
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Old 03-27-2012, 05:16 AM   #52
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Senor Pepe' View Post
Here are the scorecards,,,

Arthur Mercante;
A A F F F A A F F A F E F A F = {8-6-1; Frazier}

Arthur Aidala;
A A F F F F F F A A F F A A F = {9-6-0; Frazier)

Bill Recht;
F A F F A F F F A F F F F A F = {11-4-0; Frazier}

Remember, this was New York State Boxing rules.
By round scoring.

If this was a 10-point must system, Joe Frazier would have
been awarded 10-8 (2-point win) rounds in the 11th and 15th.


Saying Muhammad Ali won that fight is like saying Japan won
World War II in the Pacific.
Just goes to show what a chancey business it is, relying on the scorecards. The three judges only agree with each other in 7 of 15 rounds, and if you give Ali all the rounds which were scored for him by at least one of them he has 9 - enough for a comfortable win!

For what it's worth I personally had Frazier a narrow winner on rounds and, of course, a clearer winner on points.
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:46 AM   #53
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisPontius View Post
I counted them a while ago. Only counted the number of punches though, not how many landed:

-FRAZIERS STATS-

Round 1 31
Round 2 29
Round 3 37
Round 4 42
Round 5 38
Round 6 54
Round 7 51
Round 8 73
Round 9 44
Round 10 49
Round 11 63
Round 12 53
Round 13 62
Round 14 32
Round 15 43

Total punches thrown: 701.
Average punch output per round: 47.

-ALI'S STATS-

Round 1 53
Round 2 66
Round 3 63
Round 4 66
Round 5 72
Round 6 43
Round 7 60
Round 8 46
Round 9 81
Round 10 66
Round 11 46
Round 12 58
Round 13 65
Round 14 65
Round 15 57



Total punches thrown: 907.
Average punch output per round: 60.


It should be noted that Frazier threw a negligible amount of jabs. A lot of his punches were power punches, where Ali threw many jabs.
Cheers for this always wanted to know roughly how many punches were thrown.

Frazier def. won the fight, Ali cruised through alot of the mid and later rounds and allowed Frazier to take them. However, i will say that when Ali won the round it was generally more convincing, Ali blitzed Frazier in the first 5 rounds but then tired while Frazier got warmed up. Add to this Frazier's constant aggression, lack of clinching and nearly taking Ali out in the 11th and the KD in the 15th.
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:27 AM   #54
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Butcher View Post
I think Im the only person alive who thinks Muhammad Ali should have won a close decision in the fight of the century vs joe frazier.

I certainly have no problem with frazier getting the verdict as it WAS a close fight but here`s what I saw in a nut shell....

Ali landing many more punches.
Ali winning more rds.
Frazier winning the 11th & 15th rds big.
Ali clowning on the ropes when he had a big lead giving away unnecessary points.

I had heard how frazier beat Ali in that fight & watched expecting just that but what I saw was a quite even fight which I gave to Ali as I dont think the big 11th & 15th rds were enough to overtake Ali`s other rds that he built up.

1 judge only gave Ali 4 rds... that was a pure utter disgrace.
People always point to the FOTC as to who was better in their prime because it was their 1st fight & I agree.... I watch that fight & think how dominant a 1967 Ali would be over Frazier... clear UD.
I had it 9 - 6 in rounds to Frazier,Bill. The fight was close,but a decisive victory for Smokin' Joe. Ali lost the battle but won the war,as it took more out of Joe than it did Muhammad.
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:29 AM   #55
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Believe it or not,I once knew someone who thought that Ali won their first fight,and that Joe deserved the verdict in their second bout !!!!!!!!!
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:56 AM   #56
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SolomonDeedes View Post
Just goes to show what a chancey business it is, relying on the scorecards. The three judges only agree with each other in 7 of 15 rounds, and if you give Ali all the rounds which were scored for him by at least one of them he has 9 - enough for a comfortable win!

For what it's worth I personally had Frazier a narrow winner on rounds and, of course, a clearer winner on points.
Solomon,,,,,,,,

If you used that same formula with Joe Frazier, thats 13 rounds in which
one of the judges scored a round for him.

It looks like the consensus is 9-6-0 for 'Smokin Joe'.
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Old 03-27-2012, 08:08 AM   #57
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

9-6-0 all day long.

Hate punch stats and compu box stats!

Unless the stats can tell me:

A. What effect the power punches have on the opponent.

B. What force the punches(power or otherwise) are landed at.

Probably some more factors that are missed by punch stats by I write punch stats off in the main when scoring a fight...or we may as well revert to the awful olympic style scoring!
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Old 03-27-2012, 09:35 AM   #58
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smokin joe View Post
bullshit fraizer whooped that ass and they both knew it, once fraizer got smokin ali couldnt do much
Ali lost the middle rounds and didnt get back into it until the 9th, and lost many of the rounds after that including the 11th & 15th.
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Old 03-27-2012, 10:06 AM   #59
SolomonDeedes
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Senor Pepe' View Post
Solomon,,,,,,,,

If you used that same formula with Joe Frazier, thats 13 rounds in which
one of the judges scored a round for him.

It looks like the consensus is 9-6-0 for 'Smokin Joe'.
Well, as I said, I'm not suggesting Frazier wasn't a deserving winner.

But it does illustrate what an inexact and subjective process scoring boxing matches is, and that this fight was too close and competitive to assume that anyone scoring it the other way must be deluded.
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:12 AM   #60
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Default Re: I Thought Ali Won The F.o.t.c.

Frazier won it fair and square by at least 4pts on my card. 1 or 2 rounds were very close and could have went either way, but it was joes night
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