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Old 12-14-2007, 02:51 AM   #1
Jack Dempsey
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Default Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

From this months issue

1.Sugar Ray Robinson
2.Henry Armstrong
3.Kid Gavilan
4.Charley Burley
5.Sugar Ray Leonard
6.Carmen Basilio
7.Jose Napoles
8.Tommy Ryan
9.Joe Walcott
10.Emile Griffith
11.Tommy Hearns
12.Mickey Walker
13.Jack Britton
14.Ted Kid Lewis
15.Barney Ross
16.Jimmy McLarnin
17.Luis Rodriguez
18.Billy Graham
19.Pernell Whitaker
20.Roberto Duran

What do you guys think?
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Old 12-14-2007, 03:01 AM   #2
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

curry should be in there, griffith is too low. Burley did far more at 160, i rank him there.
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Old 12-14-2007, 04:25 AM   #3
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

That's actually a decent enough list all told, not that much to argue with. A few personal points I'll make is that:


- Leonard, Napoles, Griffith and Whitaker should all be higher. Burley is a very good fighter but too high here (sorry McGrain). Same with Ryan.

- Benitez is under-rated and would be a deserving shout for a place somewhere around #13

- De La Hoya would also perhaps make the very tail end of my list.
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Old 12-14-2007, 04:36 AM   #4
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

They mention that De La Hoya and Mosely could be future inclusions
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Old 12-14-2007, 04:39 AM   #5
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

Mayweather, De La Hoya and Mosley????
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Old 12-14-2007, 04:53 AM   #6
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

that is actually pretty good
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Old 12-14-2007, 04:54 AM   #7
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

Trinidad and Oscar should be on there.
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Old 12-14-2007, 05:03 AM   #8
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

Basilio should be much lower, Burley and Duran remove completely and replace with somebody who's got some logetivity at welter. Gavilan was better than Armstrong at welter. Barney Ross should be at #5 or thereabouts. Walker, Lewis and Britton should be at or around #10, ahead of Walcott and Ryan.
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Old 12-14-2007, 05:20 AM   #9
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

Well Mayweather gets good credit for his win over Hatton.
Baldomir.......I'm not very impressed with him and really don't think hes world class, hes essentially a journeyman who beat an unfocused Judah.
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Old 12-14-2007, 05:45 AM   #10
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Dempsey
From this months issue

1.Sugar Ray Robinson
2.Henry Armstrong
3.Kid Gavilan
4.Charley Burley
5.Sugar Ray Leonard
6.Carmen Basilio
7.Jose Napoles
8.Tommy Ryan
9.Joe Walcott
10.Emile Griffith
11.Tommy Hearns
12.Mickey Walker
13.Jack Britton
14.Ted Kid Lewis
15.Barney Ross
16.Jimmy McLarnin
17.Luis Rodriguez
18.Billy Graham
19.Pernell Whitaker
20.Roberto Duran

What do you guys think?
I think this is a very good list , it shows that they take everything into consideration because they have Duran as high as 20 in a division he didnt stay at too long (Duran maybe wouldve beaten most of atg welters on the Montral night) . So this list compiles longeviity , skill and other aspects , not just one aspect in its criteria , which is important in these lists.

Mine would probably e -

1. Robinson
2. Armstrong
3. Leonard
4. Napoles
5. Trinidad
6. Gavilan
7. Griffith
8. Burley
9. Walker
10. Cuevas
11. Walcott
12. Ross
13. Hearns
14. Basilio
15. Lewis
16. DeLaHoya
17. Britton
18. McLarnin
19. Whitaker
20. Duran

The placement of some might get criticism , maybe Duran , Cuevas and Burley . But these are fighters I have huge respect for , Cuevas carried himself great as champion and had a good run before Hearns . My top 6 are the only ones I wont budge on . Gavilan is after Trinidad just because of the bad decisions he benefited from , he did also get robbd on the scorecards on occasion . Trinidads only benefit from a bad decision was DLH , anyhow I have hin one above Gavilan . The next 10 or so after that are not set in stone
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Old 12-14-2007, 05:58 AM   #11
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

As has been said, all the right names are there. It's just the placement. Burley's rating is criminal. Over Napoles and Griffith!
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Old 12-14-2007, 06:02 AM   #12
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

Yes, Napoles and Griffith way too low. Obviously Jose will slide down the list as time goes by because he wasn't American . I can't complain greatly because Carmen Basilio is ranked highly- and that should warm all our hearts.
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Old 12-14-2007, 06:13 AM   #13
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

Quote:
Originally Posted by My dinner with Conteh
Yes, Napoles and Griffith way too low. Obviously Jose will slide down the list as time goes by because he wasn't American . I can't complain greatly because Carmen Basilio is ranked highly- and that should warm all our hearts.
Yep, he's the last one I would complain about. And although I'd disagree, I wouldn't even argue with someone who rated him #1. It's not often you find a man who looked like the vegetable he once farmed.
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Old 12-14-2007, 12:20 PM   #14
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

Quote:
Originally Posted by teeto
I think this is a very good list , it shows that they take everything into consideration because they have Duran as high as 20 in a division he didnt stay at too long (Duran maybe wouldve beaten most of atg welters on the Montral night) . So this list compiles longeviity , skill and other aspects , not just one aspect in its criteria , which is important in these lists.

Mine would probably e -

1. Robinson
2. Armstrong
3. Leonard
4. Napoles
5. Trinidad
6. Gavilan
7. Griffith
8. Burley
9. Walker
10. Cuevas
11. Walcott
12. Ross
13. Hearns
14. Basilio
15. Lewis
16. DeLaHoya
17. Britton
18. McLarnin
19. Whitaker
20. Duran

The placement of some might get criticism , maybe Duran , Cuevas and Burley . But these are fighters I have huge respect for , Cuevas carried himself great as champion and had a good run before Hearns . My top 6 are the only ones I wont budge on . Gavilan is after Trinidad just because of the bad decisions he benefited from , he did also get robbd on the scorecards on occasion . Trinidads only benefit from a bad decision was DLH , anyhow I have hin one above Gavilan . The next 10 or so after that are not set in stone
What's your rationale for Trinidad at #5? Just out of curiousity.
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Old 12-14-2007, 12:59 PM   #15
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Default Re: Ring Magazines 20 Greatest Welterweights

Not a bad list although Walcott and Ross derserve to be higher while Burley derserves to be lower his biggest wins are at 160.
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