Boxing  

Forum Home Boxing Forum European British Classic Aussie MMA Training
Go Back   Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-25-2011, 05:10 PM   #46
TheGreatA
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 7,098
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ripcity View Post
The list is short but he's not invincible. Great movement and akwardness. Just checked out a short video on him. I don't think I saw him throw one jab. For a 5' 10' with a 71" reach his lack of a jab is going to hamper him. I know this is going to make some of you mad but the cloest current comparsian to him is Paul Williams, who all things considered is not a bad boxer but would be better much better with a constant jab. So would Kid Gavilan.
The jab was probably Gavilan's key weapon.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IH4GEcjJV68[/ame]
TheGreatA is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 10-25-2011, 05:13 PM   #47
Garrus
Big Boss 1935-2014
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: A Hero Forever Loyal To The Flames Of War, Rests in Outer Heaven
Posts: 2,439
vCash: 157
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

Why y'all dissing my boy ripcity?

He'd **** you till you love him faggots.
Garrus is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 05:13 PM   #48
lufcrazy
requiescat in pace
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: England, Up North
Posts: 22,862
vCash: 330
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

Would anyone put him above napoles?
lufcrazy is online now  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 05:15 PM   #49
McGrain
Diamond Dog
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 37,431
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
Would anyone put him above napoles?
yeah
McGrain is online now  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 05:15 PM   #50
TheGreatA
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 7,098
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
Would anyone put him above napoles?
I would say that Gavilan fought in a stronger welterweight era.
TheGreatA is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 05:21 PM   #51
Unforgiven
Undisputed Champion
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 12,641
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

I love Kid Gavilan - I once rated him no.2 welter behind SRR - but I think he'd possibly lose to some of the ATG welters and even a few lightweights.
Barney Ross, Mickey Walker, Benny Leonard, Joe Gans, Henry Armstrong maybe. Marcel Cerdan. Charley Burley. Fritzie Zivic. Etc.
Gavilan was great but he lost, or had close ones with, lesser fighters.

I think he'd beat Hearns, in a similar thrilling fight to his battle with Turner.
Unforgiven is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 05:21 PM   #52
Pachilles
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 3,157
vCash: 75
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

el poo-poo deserves a mention
Pachilles is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 06:32 PM   #53
Surf-Bat
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 3,125
vCash: 500
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

[quote=Flea Man;11062040]I would say Gavilan is vicious enough, and varied enough, to unleash a devastating flurry on punches on Hearns.

Howdy Flea. "Varied" I will give you. But Gavilan's flurries were far from devastating(as his paltry KO record clearly indicates). They were pitty-pat and carried negligible power. Ike Williams, a lightweight, told me on several occasions that "Gavilan couldn't punch at all". If a lightweight is dismissing Kid's power you can bet that Hearns's review of it won't be much more flattering.


Hearns would have a hard job keeping Gavilan at bay IMO.

Why? He's got the speed, power and most importantly, the reach.

Firing him up is asking for trouble,

The only trouble Gavilan could give you was the frightening possibility of a bloody nose.


and with the durability and stylistic variety, I'd pick him to do the better work.

As far as this debate goes, this kind of reasoning is a bit more solid. I don't agree, but the variety aspect is a good point I agree that it would be a great fight.
Surf-Bat is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 06:53 PM   #54
Flea Man
มวยสากล
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: @ferociousflea
Posts: 39,924
vCash: 75
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

-I didn't mean Gavilan was in any way a devastating hitter. I meant that the effect of one of his spiteful two-handed assaults would be devastating to a leg weary Hearns.

-Gil Turner certainly found himself on the wrong end of exchanges he tried to instigate.

-Again, ask Gil Turner, or Johnny Bratton.

Gavilan was no puncher. But he was no feather fist either IMO. He was a slashing puncher who threw with bad intent and threw a lot. I think he could hurt Tommy and I think his K.O% is a bit deceiving. It's clear on film he could hurt his opponents. He threw a lot.

I don't think Tommy can do it consistently. Gavilan will find a way around it, he's hard to dissuade through pain, and was wellschooled enough, in terms of reflexes and ring generalship, to figure out a way around Tommys jab, enough to get shots off that will make Tommy less sharp down the stretch.

I definitely think Tommy goes on the backfoot in this one. He was beautiful in that mode of course, I just favour Gavilan to get the better work done

Thanks for the anecdote from Ike as well Bigger opponents showed that it wasn't always the case.
Flea Man is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 07:09 PM   #55
TheGreatA
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 7,098
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

Hearns doesn't have the iron chin to take the barrages that Bratton and Turner were forced to take from Gavilan. Then again he might not have to, if he fights smart enough. But in a 15 round bout he might just run out of gas since Gavilan was not one to leave you alone if you were outpointing him.
TheGreatA is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 07:14 PM   #56
Flea Man
มวยสากล
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: @ferociousflea
Posts: 39,924
vCash: 75
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatA View Post
Hearns doesn't have the iron chin to take the barrages that Bratton and Turner were forced to take from Gavilan. Then again he might not have to, if he fights smart enough. But in a 15 round bout he might just run out of gas since Gavilan was not one to leave you alone if you were outpointing him.
Exactly, it's a two way thing. I lean towards Gavilan.
Flea Man is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 07:29 PM   #57
ripcity
Undisputed Champion
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: "Somebody may beat me, but they are going to have to bleed to do it."
Posts: 10,232
vCash: 887
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatA View Post
The jab was probably Gavilan's key weapon.

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
The short list just got shorter.
ripcity is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2011, 12:45 AM   #58
Senya13
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Russia
Posts: 3,936
vCash: 1210
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatA View Post
That depends on whether you think Hearns drastically improved by adding 7 pounds to his frame or whether he was just facing more favourable opposition at 154 in comparison to Ray Leonard.
He obviously gained experience after he moved higher in weight and became stronger (although still overrated as a KO artist). But at 147 he doesn't have anything to back up him being favorite over Gavilan.
Senya13 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2011, 12:51 AM   #59
Wu-Gambino
ESB Swordsman
ESB Jr Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Slums of Shaolin
Posts: 168
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

^^It's Hearns's physical intangibles that make him dangerous for anyone at 147, not necessarily his resume at the weight. Anyway weren't you using the exact same logic to back Jones over Charles in the other thread?
Wu-Gambino is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2011, 01:01 AM   #60
Senya13
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Russia
Posts: 3,936
vCash: 1210
Default Re: Kid Gavilan - head-to-head monster?

I didn't use the same logic, on the contrary, I used it to show inconsistency in people's opinions. In one thread they say, look who this guy beat, he's winning this fantasy matchup. In another they say, doesn't matter who he beat, he's got the tools/potential and is winning this fantasy matchup.

For sure Roy Jones has got a better 175 lbs resume than Hearns' 147 lbs, and by far so, to back up his ability with actual achievements, and to make one consider other things than his opposition in a matchup with Charles.
Senya13 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Reply

Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Boxing News 24 Forum 2013