Boxing  

Forum Home Boxing Forum European British Classic Aussie MMA Training
Go Back   Boxing News 24 Forum > Other > MMA Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 12-02-2011, 08:40 PM   #1
cross_trainer
Bergeron Avatar Club
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,685
vCash: 1000
Default Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

Assume Lyoto starts fighting in UFC I close to his prime. How does he perform in the first UFCs? If he sweeps the early ones, would this trend continue once the wrestlers got involved? How does the game evolve differently because of his influence?
cross_trainer is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 12-02-2011, 08:52 PM   #2
chimba
Off the Somali Coast
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 10,025
vCash: 800
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

Hed blow through the tournament pretty easily and alot more unscathed than Royce.

The game would probably evolve the same but alot faster (more well rounded guys) , wrestlers would still be wrestlers and still be dominant. On the other hand 1 dimensional strikers like Mo Smith and Pete Williams were able to beat Coleman who was a beast back then.

But Machida would pretty much have the advantage striking over everyone and would give grapplers nightmares as well.

Plus he has great tactics and strategies. Hed be considered perhaps the GOAT in that reality.
chimba is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-02-2011, 09:31 PM   #3
BobDigi5060
East Side MMA
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: TX
Posts: 5,458
vCash: 553
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

He'd def be P4P.. Almost every UFC fighter would with the training they have nowadays.

It wasn't until UFC 6, 7, or 8 did enthusiast recognize that you needed a well rounded game or as Severn would call it "cross training".
BobDigi5060 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2011, 01:23 AM   #4
Flea Man
มวยสากล
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: @ferociousflea
Posts: 39,916
vCash: 75
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

Mo Smith was pretty one dimensional, but adapted his game for the Coleman fight and worked extensively on his grappling with Frank Shamrock.
Flea Man is online now  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2011, 12:36 PM   #5
Ubersteve
The Main Event Mafia
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,208
vCash: 888
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

He would absolutely decimate everyone at UFC 1. I would think this is fairly obvious tbh.
Ubersteve is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2011, 01:06 PM   #6
greathamza
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: sweden
Posts: 5,329
vCash: 117
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

He would prolly go undefeated in the UFC as Frank and retire due to being bored
greathamza is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2011, 01:49 PM   #7
Will Cooling
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,589
vCash: 500
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

What an odd thread
Will Cooling is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2011, 02:06 PM   #8
chimba
Off the Somali Coast
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 10,025
vCash: 800
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

^^^No its not because intended or not, it shows that current fighters are better than older ones and we're talking only 15 or so years of evolution.

Hopefully, MMA in its current form survives and becomes one of those sport that respects its elder statemen but doesn't propagate the myth of them being unbeatable.
chimba is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2011, 02:28 PM   #9
cross_trainer
Bergeron Avatar Club
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,685
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

Modern fans often overlook how much the paradigms shifted after 1993. It was a very near-run thing, as much a social development as a development in ring craft. That's why I included not only Machida's initial participation in UFC I, but his subsequent influence on the sport.

Personally, I suspect that Machida's dominance in striking would slow down the sport's development. Royce gave the martial arts community a wakeup call because he fought so differently from what everybody thought of as "martial arts". If you'd asked 99.9% of the population before UFC I if a guy could win a martial arts tournament by hanging on you until you fell over and then strangling you on the ground, they'd have laughed at you.

Machida, on the other hand, would have fit existing stereotypes about the "untouchable" karate expert. People would have ignored his takedown defense and BJJ ("It's just judo, anyway") until the later UFCs forced him to use them more. Wrestlers might have involved themselves later, too: the early promoters worried about Severn's safety even after Gracie had proved that you could take guys down and submit them.

At first, the martial arts community might well have shrugged its collective shoulders and returned to the McDojos, satisfied that Machida had proved them right about grappling. Early UFC fighters might themselves have leaned more toward striking than grappling,
cross_trainer is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2011, 02:58 PM   #10
chimba
Off the Somali Coast
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 10,025
vCash: 800
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

Quote:
Originally Posted by cross_trainer View Post
Modern fans often overlook how much the paradigms shifted after 1993. It was a very near-run thing, as much a social development as a development in ring craft. That's why I included not only Machida's initial participation in UFC I, but his subsequent influence on the sport.

Personally, I suspect that Machida's dominance in striking would slow down the sport's development. Royce gave the martial arts community a wakeup call because he fought so differently from what everybody thought of as "martial arts". If you'd asked 99.9% of the population before UFC I if a guy could win a martial arts tournament by hanging on you until you fell over and then strangling you on the ground, they'd have laughed at you.

Machida, on the other hand, would have fit existing stereotypes about the "untouchable" karate expert. People would have ignored his takedown defense and BJJ ("It's just judo, anyway") until the later UFCs forced him to use them more. Wrestlers might have involved themselves later, too: the early promoters worried about Severn's safety even after Gracie had proved that you could take guys down and submit them.

At first, the martial arts community might well have shrugged its collective shoulders and returned to the McDojos, satisfied that Machida had proved them right about grappling. Early UFC fighters might themselves have leaned more toward striking than grappling,
Don't know about that just because Royce would have won his share of matches and probably loses to Machida via decision. People would still hail him as the small guy that could. The rest of the Gracies got into the fray, who wasnt shocked at the way Renzo destroyed Taktarov and Rickson and Roylers run at Pride.

Secondly, Carlson Gracie brought hordes of his talent to MMA at that time. His protege Bitteti, along with Ze Mario, Allan Goes, Ismail, Bustamante. These guys were top of the line practitioners and surely people took notice.

One of these guys would have certainly faced Machida and for the first time would have been dominated and damaged because unlike Royce, they "think" they can strike. It would be an eye opener.

Against Wrestlers, Machida would avoid the TD and would have dominated guys like Frye and Randleman who has the tendency to stand up toe to toe.

This dominance would almost force the sport to evolve quickly. Perhaps we would have seen more Wreslers who can strike and Strikers with Andersons BJJ skills. Fighters would have focused on his style and not only try to emulate it but try to defeat it.
chimba is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2011, 05:57 PM   #11
SouthpawSlayer
Im coming for you
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Gay St Pierre
Posts: 8,187
vCash: 75
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Will Cooling View Post
What an odd thread
yep
SouthpawSlayer is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2011, 01:39 PM   #12
leejunfan777
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 517
vCash: 500
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

what would have hapenned if the earth was actually flat
can you imagine
lets debate
leejunfan777 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2011, 01:51 PM   #13
Ne5ville14
Rationalist by default...
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,318
vCash: 500
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

Quote:
Originally Posted by leejunfan777 View Post
what would have hapenned if the earth was actually flat
can you imagine
lets debate
Ne5ville14 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2011, 02:02 PM   #14
Stoo
Undisputed Champion
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,933
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

Machida v Ettish would be an ATG fight
Stoo is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2011, 02:04 PM   #15
cross_trainer
Bergeron Avatar Club
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,685
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Lyoto Machida in the early UFCs

Quote:
Originally Posted by leejunfan777 View Post
what would have hapenned if the earth was actually flat
can you imagine
lets debate
Imagining a flat Earth doesn't tell us much about reality. Imagining Machida in the early UFCs does tell us something about the historical development of MMA during the early and mid 1990s.
cross_trainer is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Reply

Boxing News 24 Forum > Other > MMA Forum

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:06 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Boxing News 24 Forum 2013